National News Boris Johnson - Ousted Former PM

[PottersRightBoot]

What’s your name, Frank Muir?

 

[Essexyellows]

Well the Conservatives "got into bed" with the Lib Dems so an alliance with the Brexit Party isn`t unthinkable (depending on your political leanings).

Lots of GE candidates being named by the BP, sending a pretty clear message to BJ. "Deliver or be knee-capped by a split vote."

And folk think the BP don`t do strategy??

 

[Sarge]

Well the Conservatives "got into bed" with the Lib Dems so an alliance with the Brexit Party isn`t unthinkable (depending on your political leanings).

Lots of GE candidates being named by the BP, sending a pretty clear message to BJ. "Deliver or be knee-capped by a split vote."

And folk think the BP don`t do strategy??

turning their backs on things is a strategy, isn't it?

 

[tonyw]

Lots of GE candidates being named by the BP, sending a pretty clear message to BJ. "Deliver or be knee-capped by a split vote."

And folk think the BP don`t do strategy??

"Deliver or be knee-capped by a split vote.......that will ensure we get Prime Minister Jeremy Corbyn, who is pretty much the direct antithesis of everything we believe in"

Some strategy!

If the pressure works - then they get the No Deal Brexit they want, and I guess their tactics succeed.
If BoJo doesn't deliver - and there's still a bunch of ways he may not - then they burn down their house in the name of principle, and leave the country in the hands of their polar opposites.

At best, it's daring brinkmanship. But I see it as fanaticism that could easily blow up in their faces. Whereas a bit of pragmatic deal-making would be much more likely to deliver them the result they want i.e. Brexit and a continuing right-wing government.

 

[amershamdave]

You KNOW that the word is never used that way any more. If someone says 'that bloke is a total loon' absolutely nobody thinks he actually means the chap is mentally ill.
HOWEVER - if anyone really is offended by that word then I apologise.
It does not change the sentiment though.

Zero, when Boris Johnson made those references to 'letter boxes' and the Scots, there were no apologies, as far as I can recall. Just imagine the squealing and ranting from the Tory-supporting press, if Cordustbin had made nasty remarks about Jewish people. For the record, I have never read or heard Cordustbin making derogatory remarks about Jewish people.

 

[Marked Ox]

Zero, when Boris Johnson made those references to 'letter boxes' and the Scots, there were no apologies, as far as I can recall. Just imagine the squealing and ranting from the Tory-supporting press, if Cordustbin had made nasty remarks about Jewish people. For the record, I have never read or heard Cordustbin making derogatory remarks about Jewish people.

The problem is Corbyn has done the root of f*** all about those who have made bigoted/derogatory comments in the Labour Party. In some cases, he, the leadership and/or Momentum have welcomed them back from suspension. With plenty of allegations of the leadership interfering in the disciplinary process. Hardly any expulsions even with lots of complaints being made yet Alistair Campbell gets thrown out for voting Lib Dem at great haste by the leadership.

 

[RyanioBirdio]

The problem is Corbyn has done the root of f*** all about those who have made bigoted/derogatory comments in the Labour Party. In some cases, he, the leadership and/or Momentum have welcomed them back from suspension. With plenty of allegations of the leadership interfering in the disciplinary process. Hardly any expulsions even with lots of complaints being made yet Alistair Campbell gets thrown out for voting Lib Dem at great haste by the leadership.

Labour is finished. It’s been taken over by the hard left in terms of membership - and let’s not forget that hard left can be just as nasty and bigoted as hard right - and they will put off any moderates or centrists from bothering with them. Corbyn will never walk until the day he dies and he will survive any and all no confidence votes by his own MPs, as the membership are hardliners now and they won’t attract new members to beat them out. It is hopelessly lost to the extreme left and I don’t see how it will recover for many years to come. After the last several years, that they’ve failed to do anything of any value or substance is just staggering. Any other opposition would’ve toppled the government and taken charge several times over by now.

 

[amershamdave]

Labour is finished. It’s been taken over by the hard left in terms of membership - and let’s not forget that hard left can be just as nasty and bigoted as hard right - and they will put off any moderates or centrists from bothering with them. Corbyn will never walk until the day he dies and he will survive any and all no confidence votes by his own MPs, as the membership are hardliners now and they won’t attract new members to beat them out. It is hopelessly lost to the extreme left and I don’t see how it will recover for many years to come. After the last several years, that they’ve failed to do anything of any value or substance is just staggering. Any other opposition would’ve toppled the government and taken charge several times over by now.

I am and always have been, a supporter of the Labour Party, because I am a working-class type of person. I don't pretend to be rich or successful, unlike a lot of people who brag that they are, and they tell you that is why they vote Tory.
Mr Birdio, this pains me to write this, but I agree with most of your post. Labour are not finished, though, because of any left-wing influence. People said they were fucked in the 80's under Michael Foot and again under Neil Kinnock in the 90's. They bounced back, after John Smith (R.I.P.) became leader in 1994 (ish). He was an inspiration for Labour voters, nationwide. If Cordustbin had been Labour leader back then..............I don't know what the outcome would've been.
My point is this; if you can't beat the useless Tories now, with the joker PM they installed, then be prepared for more Conservatism for at least one more term.
I only wish that this message would reach labour HQ; you need to replace Jeremy Corbyn NOW................not when BOJO or blow-job, whatever, calls what seems to be an early general election and Labour gets wiped out by the Lib Dumbs, Brexit Party and Monster Raving Loony Party. He will only go (by the looks of it) if he's pushed. I personally would like to see Emilly Thornberry at the helm.

 

[Essexyellows]

Labour is finished. It’s been taken over by the hard left in terms of membership - and let’s not forget that hard left can be just as nasty and bigoted as hard right - and they will put off any moderates or centrists from bothering with them. Corbyn will never walk until the day he dies and he will survive any and all no confidence votes by his own MPs, as the membership are hardliners now and they won’t attract new members to beat them out. It is hopelessly lost to the extreme left and I don’t see how it will recover for many years to come. After the last several years, that they’ve failed to do anything of any value or substance is just staggering. Any other opposition would’ve toppled the government and taken charge several times over by now.

He`s right.

The "political problem" is that everyone has been "leaning in" to the middle.

Its a mess that needs a radical shake up and, hopefully, that is what BJ will deliver.

 

[amershamdave]

The thing with blow-job is, he doesn't look like a statesman. He just looks like what he is...............a very rich, posh-talking person whose mummy and daddy paid for him to go to Eton. I don't think he has a clue about what its like to be poor and underprivileged. Running a country isn't just about making the rich richer at the expense of the working class. His sort always have and always will be the 'I'm alright Jack' party.

 

[Essexyellows]

The thing with blow-job is, he doesn't look like a statesman. He just looks like what he is...............a very rich, posh-talking person whose mummy and daddy paid for him to go to Eton. I don't think he has a clue about what its like to be poor and underprivileged. Running a country isn't just about making the rich richer at the expense of the working class. His sort always have and always will be the 'I'm alright Jack' party.

Alternative view.............. they provide more opportunity and self governance of income with a lower tax burden. ?

 

[MC Yellow]

I am and always have been, a supporter of the Labour Party, because I am a working-class type of person. I don't pretend to be rich or successful, unlike a lot of people who brag that they are, and they tell you that is why they vote Tory.
Mr Birdio, this pains me to write this, but I agree with most of your post. Labour are not finished, though, because of any left-wing influence. People said they were fucked in the 80's under Michael Foot and again under Neil Kinnock in the 90's. They bounced back, after John Smith (R.I.P.) became leader in 1994 (ish). He was an inspiration for Labour voters, nationwide. If Cordustbin had been Labour leader back then..............I don't know what the outcome would've been.
My point is this; if you can't beat the useless Tories now, with the joker PM they installed, then be prepared for more Conservatism for at least one more term.
I only wish that this message would reach labour HQ; you need to replace Jeremy Corbyn NOW................not when BOJO or blow-job, whatever, calls what seems to be an early general election and Labour gets wiped out by the Lib Dumbs, Brexit Party and Monster Raving Loony Party. He will only go (by the looks of it) if he's pushed. I personally would like to see Emilly Thornberry at the helm.

Is it your perception that all Tory voters are rich and successful then?

That’s a bit like saying all Labour voters are lazy and want to sponge off the state.

Neither of which I believe are true.

 

[Paul Cannell]

Spunge, eh?

 

[Marked Ox]

Is it your perception that all Tory voters are rich and successful then?

That’s a bit like saying all Labour voters are lazy and want to spunge off the state.

Neither of which I believe are true.

That's the Torygraph screwed then.

 

[tonyw]

I see BoJo and Gove have now moved into the "The EU aren't being fair" and "Oh go on, please" stage of the Brexit negotiations......

Brexit: Boris Johnson calls for 'common sense' compromise

Boris Johnson says there is "bags of time" for the EU to compromise before the Brexit deadline.

www.bbc.com

To be honest, we're nearing the point where the EU should probably re-consider the Irish Backstop issue. Yes, it is noble to try and avoid a hard border in Ireland...….but if the UK leaves under the withdrawal agreement with the backstop removed, then at least the border stays open for another two years - and there's a small chance that some alternative arrangement can be ironed out in that time period. If the UK leaves with No Deal (and we now seem to have a government crazy enough to do that), then the Irish border - officially at least - closes November 1st.

However if leaks from the German delegation are to be believed, their position seems to be that if they stand their ground now, the British parliament will find a way to prevent No Deal Brexit before Halloween. And then there would likely be a General Election, and who knows maybe a second referendum coming.

Intransigence and brinksmanship on both sides. I'll go get the popcorn...…..

 

[Marked Ox]

I see BoJo and Gove have now moved into the "The EU aren't being fair" and "Oh go on, please" stage of the Brexit negotiations......

Brexit: Boris Johnson calls for 'common sense' compromise

Boris Johnson says there is "bags of time" for the EU to compromise before the Brexit deadline.

www.bbc.com

To be honest, we're nearing the point where the EU should probably re-consider the Irish Backstop issue. Yes, it is noble to try and avoid a hard border in Ireland...….but if the UK leaves under the withdrawal agreement with the backstop removed, then at least the border stays open for another two years - and there's a small chance that some alternative arrangement can be ironed out in that time period. If the UK leaves with No Deal (and we now seem to have a government crazy enough to do that), then the Irish border - officially at least - closes November 1st.

However if leaks from the German delegation are to be believed, their position seems to be that if they stand their ground now, the British parliament will find a way to prevent No Deal Brexit before Halloween. And then there would likely be a General Election, and who knows maybe a second referendum coming.

Intransigence and brinksmanship on both sides. I'll go get the popcorn...…..

And misinformation from both sides on their opponents actions as well no doubt.

Johnson etc were always going to blame the EU for their own failures/delusions.

 

[Sarge]

 

[MC Yellow]

I see BoJo and Gove have now moved into the "The EU aren't being fair" and "Oh go on, please" stage of the Brexit negotiations......

Brexit: Boris Johnson calls for 'common sense' compromise

Boris Johnson says there is "bags of time" for the EU to compromise before the Brexit deadline.

www.bbc.com

To be honest, we're nearing the point where the EU should probably re-consider the Irish Backstop issue. Yes, it is noble to try and avoid a hard border in Ireland...….but if the UK leaves under the withdrawal agreement with the backstop removed, then at least the border stays open for another two years - and there's a small chance that some alternative arrangement can be ironed out in that time period. If the UK leaves with No Deal (and we now seem to have a government crazy enough to do that), then the Irish border - officially at least - closes November 1st.

However if leaks from the German delegation are to be believed, their position seems to be that if they stand their ground now, the British parliament will find a way to prevent No Deal Brexit before Halloween. And then there would likely be a General Election, and who knows maybe a second referendum coming.

Intransigence and brinksmanship on both sides. I'll go get the popcorn...…..

Total stalemate where no one is going to win in the short term unfortunately. But I do believe that if we leave with no deal and other countries see that after the initial fallout it isn’t actually so bad for us, others will want to follow [France/Spain). The EU can’t risk that and so it is also in their own interest to open renegotiations. At this moment in time the ball is in their court.

Not sure what else BoJo is expected to do. We need to take the hard line to tempt EU back to the table and if that doesn’t work we stick by our own convictions.

There was a deal but it was rejected 3 times. The EU can see that but say they will not renegotiate. So what exactly are we supposed to do ? What exactly do Labour believe they have that will get the EU to renegotiate ? The truth is they have absolutely nothing and are interested only in getting into no.10

The people of the UK voted to leave. At that time no one honestly knew what that really entailed despite all the rhetoric coming from both sides. But the vote was still to leave.

So we leave and get on with it.......

 

[mooro]

Total stalemate where no one is going to win in the short term unfortunately. But I do believe that if we leave with no deal and other countries see that after the initial fallout it isn’t actually so bad for us, others will want to follow [France/Spain). The EU can’t risk that and so it is also in their own interest to open renegotiations. At this moment in time the ball is in their court.

Not sure what else BoJo is expected to do. We need to take the hard line to tempt EU back to the table and if that doesn’t work we stick by our own convictions.

There was a deal but it was rejected 3 times. The EU can see that but say they will not renegotiate. So what exactly are we supposed to do ? What exactly do Labour believe they have that will get the EU to renegotiate ? The truth is they have absolutely nothing and are interested only in getting into no.10

The people of the UK voted to leave. At that time no one honestly knew what that really entailed despite all the rhetoric coming from both sides. But the vote was still to leave.

So we leave and get on with it.......

The Tories ousted May, then voted for BoJo. At that time no one honestly believed his b#llsh#t that anything would be any different. But the vote was still for BoJo.
So he has the job and should get on with actually attempting to fulfil something that he has actually promised (or if not promise, then stood by letting people believe things that he appears to promise) for the first time since this whole sorry saga began.

 

[MC Yellow]

The Tories ousted May, then voted for BoJo. At that time no one honestly believed his b#llsh#t that anything would be any different. But the vote was still for BoJo.
So he has the job and should get on with actually attempting to fulfil something that he has actually promised (or if not promise, then stood by letting people believe things that he appears to promise) for the first time since this whole sorry saga began.

That is my point, he is doing that. He says we are leaving, that was what the public voted for and we are now leaving on 31st Oct regardless of whether the EU agree to renegotiate, “no ifs, no buts”.