National News Boris Johnson - Ousted Former PM

[bazzer9461]

You shouldn't be allowed to vote for a standing candidate or candidates should be forced to stand. Your usual dangerous extremism I see.

If you are forced to stand and you don’t want to all you have to do is spoil the voting paper

 

[bazzer9461]

What, like the Tories and UKIP (or Reform, or whatever they were called at the time) did in the 2019 election

Did they? The red wall fell because they were all leaver constituencies and their Labour MP’s were against Brexit

 

[Sarge]

Did they? The red wall fell because they were all leaver constituencies and their Labour MP’s were against Brexit

Farage's Brexit party only stood in those constituencies ( where Lab MP opposed Brexit) where they could hand it on a plate to the Torys ... poor old Nige hasn't got his peerage in return yet though

 

[Sheik djibouti]

Did they? The red wall fell because they were all leaver constituencies and their Labour MP’s were against Brexit

https://whatukthinks.org/eu/what-impact-did-the-brexit-party-have-in-the-2019-general-election/

 

[Essexyellows]

You shouldn't be allowed to vote for a standing candidate or candidates should be forced to stand. Your usual dangerous extremism I see.

What, like the Tories and UKIP (or Reform, or whatever they were called at the time) did in the 2019 election

People need a range of candidates to get better representation irrespective of your own political views.

A realistic PR is what we need so that people know their vote counts much like the German system.

"Under the German system, we would need to redraw constituency boundaries to create 325 seats that would still be allocated under FPTP, and create another 325 seats elected from regional lists. A party gets its vote share from these lists translated into seats if it receives at least 5% of the votes, or if it wins three constituencies.

In the real German system, citizens have two votes, one for the constituency contest and one for the list vote."

What would the British parliament look like under proportional representation?

A chorus of politicians are once again calling for electoral reform after the UK’s 2019 election.

theconversation.com

 

[QR]

Enabling corruption. I cannot believe this is allowed to happen.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1494667598381961217

 

[SteMerritt]

People need a range of candidates to get better representation irrespective of your own political views.

A realistic PR is what we need so that people know their vote counts much like the German system.

"Under the German system, we would need to redraw constituency boundaries to create 325 seats that would still be allocated under FPTP, and create another 325 seats elected from regional lists. A party gets its vote share from these lists translated into seats if it receives at least 5% of the votes, or if it wins three constituencies.

In the real German system, citizens have two votes, one for the constituency contest and one for the list vote."

What would the British parliament look like under proportional representation?

A chorus of politicians are once again calling for electoral reform after the UK’s 2019 election.

theconversation.com

That link is a decent read. Reform of the current electoral process to a more PR-based one is something which we all seem to broadly agree upon on here.

 

[Essexyellows]

Enabling corruption. I cannot believe this is allowed to happen.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1494667598381961217

The problem being the employees have workers' rights, that creates a conflict between an internal investigation and a criminal investigation.
They have the right to know they are being investigated and the right to access evidence gathered before any internal disciplinary takes place.
Unfortunately, that is also the evidence the police will be using.

And I`ll bet most of them are in a Union too.

 

[Sarge]

The problem being the employees have workers' rights, that creates a conflict between an internal investigation and a criminal investigation.
They have the right to know they are being investigated and the right to access evidence gathered before any internal disciplinary takes place.
Unfortunately, that is also the evidence the police will be using.

And I`ll bet most of them are in a Union too.

our PM's closest henchpeople in a Trade Union, those organisations that many who individually and also collectively via the TUC contribute to Labour party funding? Would that be allowed?

 

[tonyw]

People need a range of candidates to get better representation irrespective of your own political views.

A realistic PR is what we need so that people know their vote counts much like the German system.

"Under the German system, we would need to redraw constituency boundaries to create 325 seats that would still be allocated under FPTP, and create another 325 seats elected from regional lists. A party gets its vote share from these lists translated into seats if it receives at least 5% of the votes, or if it wins three constituencies.

In the real German system, citizens have two votes, one for the constituency contest and one for the list vote."

What would the British parliament look like under proportional representation?

A chorus of politicians are once again calling for electoral reform after the UK’s 2019 election.

theconversation.com

I think this is one of the very few issues where the vast majority on here are in perfect agreement - as indeed are all kinds of disparate folks from the right and the left.

The problem is - the people who lose power under any form of PR system are the two major parties; and the two major parties are always in control of parliament; so how the hell does genuine election reform legislation ever get passed?

We saw from the Cameron/Clegg coalition how this dance goes - the Tories in power watered down the referendum so that what was on offer was the weakest form of PR imaginable and then leaned on the scales to get it rejected anyhow (with help from half the Labour party).

Not sure if and when it's ever going to come up again, unless at some point we end up with another hung parliament and one of the major parties needs the Lib Dems once more.



I was going to finish by saying that you should feel happy that at least you're not voting in the US, because the current system is much, much, much worse here.
BUT because the voting system here is actually determined on a local basis, and some areas (Maine, Alaska, NYC) have started experimenting with more representative voting, I think there's actually more hope for change (albeit gradually) in the US than the UK!

 

[Essexyellows]

our PM's closest henchpeople in a Trade Union, those organisations that many who individually and also collectively via the TUC contribute to Labour party funding? Would that be allowed?

The people involved are mostly civil servants/Whitehall staff - not "hench people" just folk doing their job for whichever boss is in the chair.

 

[YellowLittleBird]

You are defending Trump. You’re doing it with that “I’m just asking questions” voice which has become popular amongst people who aren’t interested in hearing the answers.

After 4 years of trump I can easily see how Biden could score a huge number of votes. The fact you can’t (and express your opinion with a patronising “I’m sure you don’t really believe…”) makes it quite clear where your politics are at.

Regarding your first point, and isn’t that a matter under investigation right now? An English footy forum probably isn’t the best source of evidence.
You seem keen on the idea that he had nothing to do with it. Any substantiation of that?

Well to be honest. I did like Trump as president. He was certainly more interesting to watch from afar than the previous. I feel like the positive moves he was making to America ie. Record levels of employment, economy showing improvements where highly distorted by our own media which seemed to discredit him at every opportunity.
I'm sorry if I came across as patronising with my comment. It wasn't intended.
I remember watching Trumps speech before the Jan 6th protest and he clearly said that he did not condone any acts of violence and urged people to act peaceful.
You raise an interesting point that people where only voting for Biden to see Trump removed from his position, however, there seemed to be such a huge support for Trump that I don't think a protest vote for a man with such small support would make a significant difference in the outcome.
Anyway it doesn't really matter anymore, Americans are unhappy with Biden and are now having to play with the cards they have been dealt. As I've already said, all pantomime to me and we have enough to worry about politically over here, just think Trump gets a bad wrap considering the progress he made, even just from an economic view.

 

[YellowLittleBird]

I`m really not tempted to get into a never ending debate about Trump tbh with you, discussing Johnson is depressing
enough without adding that crackpot back into the mix.

I know i`m going to regret this but i`ll go 3 rounds with you over on the Trump thread if you like ? That`s 3 posts each
before we agree to disagree and move on, based on your last post i will happily start, is that fair enough ?

Never ending debate huh? OK go ahead Hopefully we can find common ground on the matter.

 

[Sarge]

The people involved are mostly civil servants/Whitehall staff - not "hench people" just folk doing their job for whichever boss is in the chair.

24 hour party people?

 

[QR]

Well to be honest. I did like Trump as president. He was certainly more interesting to watch from afar than the previous. I feel like the positive moves he was making to America ie. Record levels of employment, economy showing improvements where highly distorted by our own media which seemed to discredit him at every opportunity.
I'm sorry if I came across as patronising with my comment. It wasn't intended.
I remember watching Trumps speech before the Jan 6th protest and he clearly said that he did not condone any acts of violence and urged people to act peaceful.
You raise an interesting point that people where only voting for Biden to see Trump removed from his position, however, there seemed to be such a huge support for Trump that I don't think a protest vote for a man with such small support would make a significant difference in the outcome.
Anyway it doesn't really matter anymore, Americans are unhappy with Biden and are now having to play with the cards they have been dealt. As I've already said, all pantomime to me and we have enough to worry about politically over here, just think Trump gets a bad wrap considering the progress he made, even just from an economic view.

Well called @chuckbert

 

[Sheik djibouti]

The people involved are mostly civil servants/Whitehall staff - not "hench people" just folk doing their job for whichever boss is in the chair.

Whitehall Staff and Spads that have been stuffed full of the Eton and Oxbridge elite (all like mined souls to Bojo etc) for the last 10 plus years.

Reaping what they've sown there!

 

[Sheik djibouti]

Never ending debate huh? OK go ahead Hopefully we can find common ground on the matter.

Out of interest, where were you when Trump was relevant?

 

[YellowLittleBird]

Out of interest, where were you when Trump was relevant?

I didn't bring him up

 

[Sarge]

Whitehall Staff and Spads that have been stuffed full of the Eton and Oxbridge elite (all like mined souls to Bojo etc) for the last 10 plus years.

Reaping what they've sown there!

Most of the males were more than likely fagging for Bojo n co at Eton

 

[Sheik djibouti]

I didn't bring him up

No, but for someone with such positive views about him, I just wondered where you were when the debate was raging on here whilst he was President (and in the run up to him becoming POTUS).

Bit late now, isn't it?