National News Boris Johnson - Ousted Former PM

[ZeroTheHero]

There are two sides to every story. So a very senior minister was not getting the co-operation her position merited from some 'jobs-for-life' civil servants probably because of her gender or ethnicity or a combination of both resulting in her raising her voice to them born of frustration. Of course, in this politically correct world that we now inhabit, this behaviour must be given the appropriate label which in this case was deemed to be Bullying.
I'm heartily sick of so-called political correctness, it's about time the sensitive souls grew a pair and accepted life for what it is.

Leaving aside the Patel case, I'd be interested in what you deem to be 'political correctness'?

Presumably you wouldn't condone racist chanting at football, or disabled people being mocked (a la Trump) for their disabilities, or 'poof' jokes or a load of other things that are no longer considered 'politically correct'? Or that the recipients of that sort of treatment should 'grow a pair'?

So, am I right in concluding that for you, it's a question of degree rather than the 'political correctness' itself? A genuine question, because it always seems like a phrase that actually means very little.

 

[westyorkshireexile]

Leaving aside the Patel case, I'd be interested in what you deem to be 'political correctness'?

Presumably you wouldn't condone racist chanting at football, or disabled people being mocked (a la Trump) for their disabilities, or 'poof' jokes or a load of other things that are no longer considered 'politically correct'? Or that the recipients of that sort of treatment should 'grow a pair'?

So, am I right in concluding that for you, it's a question of degree rather than the 'political correctness' itself? A genuine question, because it always seems like a phrase that actually means very little.

I cannot leave the Patel case out of it as this was the main point of my rant particularly aimed at the protected-jobs civil servants.
The latter are the sensitive souls who cannot grasp that in private industry situations, their lack of co-operation would warrant such treatment.
However, I fail to see where racism and the inhumane treatment of disabled people comes under the mantle of political correctness, both are utterly reprehensible and it speaks volumes that you list them as such.
I am apparently a racist according to my son-in-law because I voiced the opinion that a major cause of the increase in crime in London is due to the influx of East Europeans. He dismissed the fact that 30% of Poles and Romanians living in this country have criminal records. This is what I would class as PC.

 

[SteMerritt]

He dismissed the fact that 30% of Poles and Romanians living in this country have criminal records.

Where have you found this fact? I've had a quick scan and can't find anything to back this up, apart from a Daily Mail piece from nearly 10 years ago, which just looks like Daily Mail scaremongering.

 

[OUFCGav]

I cannot leave the Patel case out of it as this was the main point of my rant particularly aimed at the protected-jobs civil servants.
The latter are the sensitive souls who cannot grasp that in private industry situations, their lack of co-operation would warrant such treatment.
However, I fail to see where racism and the inhumane treatment of disabled people comes under the mantle of political correctness, both are utterly reprehensible and it speaks volumes that you list them as such.
I am apparently a racist according to my son-in-law because I voiced the opinion that a major cause of the increase in crime in London is due to the influx of East Europeans. He dismissed the fact that 30% of Poles and Romanians living in this country have criminal records. This is what I would class as PC.

800,000 Poles in UK in 2019 and somewhere around 300,000 Romanians (the stats website I was looking at wants money for the precise figures), are you really suggesting that out of those 1.1 million that 360,000 have criminal records?

 

[ZeroTheHero]

However, I fail to see where racism and the inhumane treatment of disabled people comes under the mantle of political correctness, both are utterly reprehensible and it speaks volumes that you list them as such.

In the past (and not that long ago), people who protested against sexism, racism and casual homophobia (and more) were scorned as being 'politically correct' which is *exactly* why I brought it up. Our sensibilities have changed since then. I'm not sure why that 'speaks volumes' about me (if that's what you meant) - surely it is fact, just look at some mainstream entertainment of forty/fifty years ago. What defines 'PC' changes from era to era.

I don't know about the criminal records of eastern European people living in London but having done a quick but of Googling I found this:

"... almost a third of men have a criminal conviction by the age of 30, according to the Home Office. Research on men born in 1953 showed that about 30 per cent had clocked up a standard list offence - one that is dealt with by the courts but excludes minor motoring offences - by their thirtieth birthday. Research in Scotland points in the same direction, suggesting that about 25 per cent of men have a record by age 24." (https://www.theguardian.com/money/2002/apr/14/workandcareers.observercashsection) It's an old piece but I can't imagine it has changed that much.

And

"10 million people in the UK have a criminal record. A minimum of 20% of the working-age population has at least one conviction. And these figures are pretty conservative." (https://www.nacro.org.uk/news/nacro-comments/criminal-record-check/)

So it might well be that the criminal conviction rate of the people you mention is actually not so different of other people in the country?

I was merely asking what you thought 'political correctness' actually was?

 

[QR]

So a very senior minister was not getting the co-operation her position merited from some 'jobs-for-life' civil servants probably because of her gender or ethnicity or a combination of both resulting in her raising her voice to them born of frustration.

Have you got evidence of this?

 

[Essexyellows]

Have you got evidence of this?

Did you miss that in the report then?

"The Home Office was not as flexible as it could have been in responding to the home secretary's requests and direction. She has - legitimately - not always felt supported by the department."

"This conclusion needs to be seen in context. There is no evidence that she was aware of the impact of her behaviour, and no feedback was given to her at the time."

"The high pressure and demands of the role, in the Home Office, coupled with the need for more supportive leadership from top of the department has clearly been a contributory factor."

Want anymore??

 

[SteMerritt]

Did you miss that in the report then?

"The Home Office was not as flexible as it could have been in responding to the home secretary's requests and direction. She has - legitimately - not always felt supported by the department."

"This conclusion needs to be seen in context. There is no evidence that she was aware of the impact of her behaviour, and no feedback was given to her at the time."

"The high pressure and demands of the role, in the Home Office, coupled with the need for more supportive leadership from top of the department has clearly been a contributory factor."

Want anymore??

Where does that mention issues she's faced due to gender or ethnicity?

 

[QR]

Did you miss that in the report then?

"The Home Office was not as flexible as it could have been in responding to the home secretary's requests and direction. She has - legitimately - not always felt supported by the department."

"This conclusion needs to be seen in context. There is no evidence that she was aware of the impact of her behaviour, and no feedback was given to her at the time."

"The high pressure and demands of the role, in the Home Office, coupled with the need for more supportive leadership from top of the department has clearly been a contributory factor."

Want anymore??

Yet again you ignore the question posed.

Go back and look at the bit I highlighted. So I'll ask again, where is the evidence that any push back was because of her gender or ethnicity or a combination of both.

That's quite an accusation and very bad if true.

 

[westyorkshireexile]

was merely asking what you thought 'political correctness' actually was?

I gave you an example in my last sentence

 

[westyorkshireexile]

Yet again you ignore the question posed.

Go back and look at the bit I highlighted. So I'll ask again, where is the evidence that any push back was because of her gender or ethnicity or a combination of both.

That's quite an accusation and very bad if true.

It was mentioned in news reports without actually being put in writing.

 

[PottersRightBoot]

Bet you that nearly all voters will already have forgotten about this confected ‘row’.

MSM will be back to ‘Brexit chaos’ by Wednesday no doubt.

 

[QR]

It was mentioned in news reports without actually being put in writing.

So a really serious allegation without any evidence. Cheers Donald.

 

[Essexyellows]

She was pushed into behaving as she did. The report said so.

A few "jobs for life" civil servants got their cages rattled by a woman who is the child of migrants.

Of course things like "institutional racism" only apply when it suits eh?

 

[QR]

She was pushed into behaving as she did. The report said so.

A few "jobs for life" civil servants got their cages rattled by a woman who is the child of migrants.

Of course things like "institutional racism" only apply when it suits eh?

"It's their fault, they made me bully"

See how silly it sounds.

And still no evidence to support the it was 'because of her gender or ethnicity or a combination of both' claim.

 

[Essexyellows]

"It's their fault, they made me bully"

See how silly it sounds.

And still no evidence to support the it was 'because of her gender or ethnicity or a combination of both' claim.

How many people does the Home Secretary come into contact with every day?

How many complained?

Simple math`s really.

Maybe she only got shouty every 28 days or so?

Its over... water under the bridge....... for the many.

 

[Pillox]

Can't answer the question, obviously.

 

[QR]

Can't answer the question, obviously.

They're are no questions to answer. The independent report tells you want you want to know.

 

[Essexyellows]

Can't answer the question, obviously.

Nobody can except the people that were there, and even they will have different views, unconscious bias and all that...

 

[Essexyellows]

They're are no questions to answer. The independent report tells you want you want to know.

Correct. It was six of one and half a dozen of the other.