There has to be something going on..

[Scotchegg]

Please read. It's in the wording IF. There is no statement to the effect of concluding. And, if there is no proof either way, why say what you did in the first place? A lot of the time you have something sensible to offer, on this occasion, nothing.
View attachment 788

These payments were expected into the club, but if for any reason they weren't made, the club didn't want to be out of pocket. Hence the 'if'. I don't think it is unreasonable to assume that these payments were made and that on receipt we paid DE. Of course I can't prove this, but I'm sure that had they not taken place then others would have quickly pointed this out.

The point is that we can criticise Tiger for many things, and Robinson for more, but that doesn't mean that everything they are involved with is a farce. The tax returns issues in his first few weeks aside, there has not been anything to suggest that Tiger isn't paying his way. The likes of Derry came in at an additional cost that could (and should?) have been avoided. We could have cashed in on Eastwood and Nelson (even at 100k) and not paid out however much (too much) for Hanson.

So, we can question Tiger's leadership, his silence, his absences, the freedom he has given the manager and many other things. But I'm not sure we can truly question that the bills are being paid. DE was owed a big chunk of cash, and it was implied if not proved that he was paid some at the end of last season. The remainder appears to have now been paid (without proof) and may have been covered by Tiger directly, or our new Directors or payments into the club etc. But for all the shite we have right now, this is hopefully one less chain around our neck.

 

[myles]

These payments were expected into the club, but if for any reason they weren't made, the club didn't want to be out of pocket. Hence the 'if'. I don't think it is unreasonable to assume that these payments were made and that on receipt we paid DE. Of course I can't prove this, but I'm sure that had they not taken place then others would have quickly pointed this out.

The point is that we can criticise Tiger for many things, and Robinson for more, but that doesn't mean that everything they are involved with is a farce. The tax returns issues in his first few weeks aside, there has not been anything to suggest that Tiger isn't paying his way. The likes of Derry came in at an additional cost that could (and should?) have been avoided. We could have cashed in on Eastwood and Nelson (even at 100k) and not paid out however much (too much) for Hanson.

So, we can question Tiger's leadership, his silence, his absences, the freedom he has given the manager and many other things. But I'm not sure we can truly question that the bills are being paid. DE was owed a big chunk of cash, and it was implied if not proved that he was paid some at the end of last season. The remainder appears to have now been paid (without proof) and may have been covered by Tiger directly, or our new Directors or payments into the club etc. But for all the shite we have right now, this is hopefully one less chain around our neck.

I don’t think anyone is questioning whether Tiger is paying his way. This is a separate issue.

Ensco have a legal charge over the club for roughly £4.2m. That charge is secured against ALL income but also specifies particular contracts under which the club was owed certain sums. There is no indication whether those sums are greater than, equal to, or less than the amount secured.

There is no reason to suggest that other clubs have not made the payments as required under the contracts. And no reason to suggest the club haven’t made payment to Ensco.

But, there is also no evidence to show that the debt has been fully satisfied. If anything, with the charge remaining as unsatisfied at Companies House, the evidence available suggests that it hasn’t yet. That’s no accusation of wrongdoing against any party, just a statement of fact.

And this is where, unfortunately, I return to the familiar refrain. Where is OxVox’s comment on the debt position? Since the takeover, I don’t believe there has been any clarification of the club’s current debt other than the pieces various people on here have put together. We know from the official records that equity has been injected into the club, we know that various debts have been repaid and/or secured, but we don’t know what the full position is.

 

[outsidethebox]

"Findings and position" - I'm probably reading too much into this but it's an interesting choice of words.

 

[MarkG]

Seeing as the £4,275,708 loan notes are called Secured Loan Notes 2019, it would seem to me that repayment is due at some point in 2019. I don't think that the Solihull Moors takeover would mean that the loan has to be repaid earlier, and from section 9 of the documents, my guess is the instalments were as follows:- £1million already paid. £995,817 due 30 April 2018 and 30 September 2018. Balance of £1,284,074 due some time in 2019. The significance of transfer fees and instalments being paid into the charged bank account would seem to be that if more money comes in than the amounts owed, then the club gets to take that money out.

Also the last confirmation statement (June 2018) shows that Ensco held less than 10% of the ordinary £1 shares and less than 10% of 5.25% preference shares.

Although this is a mere distraction. Of course it's of interest to see that Darryl has a mechanism in place to ensure he gets paid for assets of the club when he sold it (the transfer fee instalments that he knew were coming in, plus potential sales of players at Feb 2018). But this of course means that the club is back to running at a significant cashflow loss each year with presumably no player sales or transfer fees to fund it, if that cash is being used to repay Darryl.

As Myles says, how much more debt is out there? , and who is funding it?

 

[makv]

I remember a few years (ie decades) back as a spotty wanabe roadie, struggling backstage to plug in a massive 3 phase plug into a switch fuse, and a bloke said "do you want a hand with that mate?". I said ta very much, and then not recognizing him as part of the crew asked him who he was, to which he replied "oh, I'm the bass player with Mudd". Top bloke, a world of difference from Captain Sensible who I've got another story about...

Off topic I know, but anything to lift the gloom.

Out with the Captain Sensible story!

 

[bazzer9461]

Out with the Captain Sensible story!

That will be a load of “ Happy Talk “ then

 

[AbsoluteZero]

We all know the Council and OUFC have not got on particularly well in the past, but this might just be a time when OUFC becomes convenient to the Council as an ally and OUFC may have no choice but to jump on board.

The corridor for the east west expressway road linking Oxford and Cambridge was announced a few weeks ago and the actual route of the road will be revealed in Summer 2019. Central government will have their desired route and between now and next Summer they will be busy speaking to local councils to try and find a way of softening the blow of a major road ripping up the Oxfordshire community. The road is meant to be linking the academic and science hubs of the two cities so it makes sense that the road will start around North Abingdon area to serve the Oxford, Culham and Harwell science parks to cross over the M40. But the whole scheme is actually about finding a reason to build more housing along the road. And no doubt Oxford Council will be looking for sweeteners to persuade them to accept a route, for example funding from central government towards building a new super hospital along the expressway to allow them to sell the JR site and the Churchill site for housing. Or a new sporting village for several sports possibly to act as a national centre for some sports and having a well positioned football/rugby stadium at the centre of it. And having the only professional football club in the county on board as a ready tenant will give the feel of a more community based project and appeal more to government to put money towards it. The football club may have no choice to run with this because there may be no alternative sites whilst this is going on, so the choice becomes join with the Council plan or stick with the current stadium.

 

[Jonny G]

Out with the Captain Sensible story!

Yeah, give us the Happy Talk!

Sorry @bazzer9461 saw you beat me to that one after I'd posed!!

 

[Oufcrealist]

That will be a load of “ Happy Talk “ then

And he'll be ' Glad it's all over'

 

[Manorlounger]

We all know the Council and OUFC have not got on particularly well in the past, but this might just be a time when OUFC becomes convenient to the Council as an ally and OUFC may have no choice but to jump on board.

The corridor for the east west expressway road linking Oxford and Cambridge was announced a few weeks ago and the actual route of the road will be revealed in Summer 2019. Central government will have their desired route and between now and next Summer they will be busy speaking to local councils to try and find a way of softening the blow of a major road ripping up the Oxfordshire community. The road is meant to be linking the academic and science hubs of the two cities so it makes sense that the road will start around North Abingdon area to serve the Oxford, Culham and Harwell science parks to cross over the M40. But the whole scheme is actually about finding a reason to build more housing along the road. And no doubt Oxford Council will be looking for sweeteners to persuade them to accept a route, for example funding from central government towards building a new super hospital along the expressway to allow them to sell the JR site and the Churchill site for housing. Or a new sporting village for several sports possibly to act as a national centre for some sports and having a well positioned football/rugby stadium at the centre of it. And having the only professional football club in the county on board as a ready tenant will give the feel of a more community based project and appeal more to government to put money towards it. The football club may have no choice to run with this because there may be no alternative sites whilst this is going on, so the choice becomes join with the Council plan or stick with the current stadium.

This makes good sense. I would prefer to see the club get the option of owning the stadium with some sort of covenant over the link but, that would depend on where the finance is coming from. If the "big boys" anticipated arrival brings cash then it would have to be assumed that they plan on recouping any outlay plus profit. (only natural and no objection from me) However, what we don't want is another FK episode. It may be that working with the local authorities brings about good land availability and if, our owners act with integrity (yeah, I know!) then we might come out of this smelling of roses!

 

[bazzer9461]

This makes good sense. I would prefer to see the club get the option of owning the stadium with some sort of covenant over the link but, that would depend on where the finance is coming from. If the "big boys" anticipated arrival brings cash then it would have to be assumed that they plan on recouping any outlay plus profit. (only natural and no objection from me) However, what we don't want is another FK episode. It may be that working with the local authorities brings about good land availability and if, our owners act with integrity (yeah, I know!) then we might come out of this smelling of roses!

I like your post manor but I have a question about what you said about good land, the club say they’ve identified 5 potential sites in Oxford, but where? the council say they have no land with them asking the surrounding councils to take on their quota of house builds as they have no more space, so with this in mind does that mean the club will be in another part of Oxford?

 

[Yellow River]

I like your post manor but I have a question about what you said about good land, the club say they’ve identified 5 potential sites in Oxford, but where? the council say they have no land with them asking the surrounding councils to take on their quota of house builds as they have no more space, so with this in mind does that mean the club will be in another part of Oxford?

Have they identified 5 potentially sites in Oxford, or just 5 potential sites?

 

[unification]

Have they identified 5 potentially sites in Oxford, or just 5 potential sites?

Land is at a premium within Oxford City Council boundaries. I think any realistic sites would surely be out in the county.

@AbsoluteZero’s post above is a fair shout and a reasonable approach. What it isn’t though is remotely quick! Think how long all the planning, litigation, building etc that that would take. We’d be looking at a move in what, 10 years minimum?

I’m not sure the club could exist under its current arrangement for another decade.

 

[TailsWeWin]

Have they identified 5 potentially sites in Oxford, or just 5 potential sites?

Was it “sites” - or 5 different options? Ie ground share as one of them?

 

[yellowbow]

Who are the builders who’ve been trying to develop Sandy Lane? I have a feeling that they might also be players in this grand scheme of things..

 

[Yellow River]

Was it “sites” - or 5 different options? Ie ground share as one of them?

From the OUFC website,

Oxford United have identified potential sites and has appointed a planning consultant in order to progress its ambition.

So no actual number, and not specifically in the City of Oxford.

Five ‘sites’ have been mentioned elsewhere though I think, fans forum or Ox Mail article?

 

[bazzer9461]

Have they identified 5 potentially sites in Oxford, or just 5 potential sites?

I was led to believe it was 5 sites they’ve identified and from the way I heard it from Niall was potential

 

[bazzer9461]

From the OUFC website,

Oxford United have identified potential sites and has appointed a planning consultant in order to progress its ambition.

So no actual number, and not specifically in the City of Oxford.

Five ‘sites’ have been mentioned elsewhere though I think, fans forum or Ox Mail article?

Led to believe it was within the city of Oxford

 

[Manorlounger]

With regard to sites there are several plots of green belt land that have been considered for development. I have posted on this several times.
All these plots are within easy distance of the city. Some would be impractical and some would only be suitable for housing but, there are some that would/could make complete sense of a sports facility with adjacent "related" civic/entertainment construction.
This is still a big if, and requires central government permission but, the need for housing with related leisure facility could work in the clubs favour.
FK would come out a winner as well (shame) as the present stadium would be surplus. Just how much of that he would be allowed to sell for development given his track record would be interesting.

 

[outsidethebox]

Maybe Mr 5 Cos has becomes Mr 5 Sites?