Sport New Zealand Test Series

holdsteady said:
Its not like we have swapped winning for being entertaining though is it? Lost 2 in 12 tests winning the others, where as before the change of leadership and approach we were losing tests regularly. We lost by the narrowest margin to draw an away series, no real disaster, especially compared to what was happening before.
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True.
Just in this specific game we should have won it and the series had we not asked them to follow on ( with Stokes unfit to bowl and the seamers shattered)
My comments were really in response to the comment that sport was about entertaining ( implied more than winning)
 
The decision to enforce the follow-on has undoubtedly cost us the series, which is really frustrating. This is my worry for the Ashes, it will be a thrilling series but we have to be smart with our cricket on occasions. I don't want to lose the Ashes because we went all out for a result when we didn't need to when a different tactic would have won the game. I'm not saying we need to roll back on our aggressive cricket, far from it, but just be smarter with it.
 
Great advert for the game,but we do need to be a bit more savvy when it comes to these decisions.
Usually as the match goes on batting conditions become more difficult.So us batting last trying to get more than 150/200 should have been thought about
 
Maybe they view it as an all or nothing approach, apparently they have taken the fear out of playing for England and they don't want to be making decisions that could lead to that creeping back in, players seem to be enjoying themselves which has not always been the case with England so you can't blame them for embracing it completely.
 
holdsteady said:
Maybe they view it as an all or nothing approach, apparently they have taken the fear out of playing for England and they don't want to be making decisions that could lead to that creeping back in, players seem to be enjoying themselves which has not always been the case with England so you can't blame them for embracing it completely.
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I'd have thought that going back it to bat and trying to get 250+ quick runs would still have fitted in with the current attacking ethos. Still, easy to say after the defeat. It will certainly help Stokes and McCullum to grow in their roles - a good bit of experience gained.
 
Its a dilemma that`s for sure - play fearless & entertaining cricket and lose the odd game, or go back to nerves, drudgery and "dull" wins with more defeats.

Yes its about winning, same as football but a 5-4 defeat is always better value than a 1-0. :)
 
Firstly, let’s not forget that there was one run in it. One run. So it’s not like it was a massive error which made us lose massively. Plus it was an absolutely atrocious decision by the umpires not to give a wide in the ball beforehand, a blatant wide, which would have made it a drawn game, and a won series (We also haven’t lost the series don’t forget).

We might well also make very different decisions in the Ashes.

I’d still rather lose like that than an abject failure and lose by an innings, like we were seeing before.
 
HampshireYellow said:
Firstly, let’s not forget that there was one run in it. One run. So it’s not like it was a massive error which made us lose massively. Plus it was an absolutely atrocious decision by the umpires not to give a wide in the ball beforehand, a blatant wide, which would have made it a drawn game, and a won series (We also haven’t lost the series don’t forget).

We might well also make very different decisions in the Ashes.

I’d still rather lose like that than an abject failure and lose by an innings, like we were seeing before.
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yep
 
HampshireYellow said:
Firstly, let’s not forget that there was one run in it. One run. So it’s not like it was a massive error which made us lose massively. Plus it was an absolutely atrocious decision by the umpires not to give a wide in the ball beforehand, a blatant wide, which would have made it a drawn game, and a won series (We also haven’t lost the series don’t forget).

We might well also make very different decisions in the Ashes.

I’d still rather lose like that than an abject failure and lose by an innings, like we were seeing before.
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I would rather lose like that rather than abject failure, but that doesn't mean we can't question the decision to put them back in to bat again when it wasn't needed. We could have played a few sessions of 'T20 Test Match' batting, and set them 450 to win in 2 days. They may still have got there, but we would have given ourselves the best chance at a win and series win. That is, after all, what the new regime is all about. I was surprised with the decision when it was made, and even if we had crept over the line it is a decision that needs to be looked at again.
 
Essexyellows said:
Its a dilemma that`s for sure - play fearless & entertaining cricket and lose the odd game, or go back to nerves, drudgery and "dull" wins with more defeats.

Yes its about winning, same as football but a 5-4 defeat is always better value than a 1-0. :)
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Unless you are OUFC 22/23 in which case I would settle for five 1-0 wins for us right now
 
Not really on topic, but I've read that baseball in USA are making some changes to speed up the game.

The most significant change coming in 2023 is the introduction of a pitch clock.
  • Pitchers will have 15 seconds to start pitching the ball when the bases are empty and 20 seconds to start pitching the ball when runners are on base.
  • Hitters are required to step into the batter’s box within the first 8 seconds.
  • If the pitcher doesn’t comply with the rule, the batter will be awarded a ball.
  • If the hitter doesn’t comply with the rule, the pitcher will be awarded a strike.
Major League Baseball has also decided to limit pickoffs this season.
  • Pitchers are now only allowed three pickoff attempts for runners on base.
  • But there’s a catch — the first two pickoff attempts result in no consequences. However, if a pitcher does not get a runner out on their third attempt, the play is counted as a balk, and the runner advances to the next base

Larger Bases
Given the reduction in offense over the last several years, Major League Baseball has decided to increase the size of each base from 15 inches to 18 inches.

Defensive Shift Limits
MLB is also hoping that offense will increase by eliminating the defensive shift.
  • The defensive team must have a minimum of four players in the infield.
  • The defensive team must have at least two players on either side of second base.
 
SteMerritt said:
I would rather lose like that rather than abject failure, but that doesn't mean we can't question the decision to put them back in to bat again when it wasn't needed. We could have played a few sessions of 'T20 Test Match' batting, and set them 450 to win in 2 days. They may still have got there, but we would have given ourselves the best chance at a win and series win. That is, after all, what the new regime is all about. I was surprised with the decision when it was made, and even if we had crept over the line it is a decision that needs to be looked at again.
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Totally agree with that.
Of course losing like that is far better than abject failure.
But without what seemed at the time, an odd decision, we would almost certainly have won the game and series.
The decision was very questionable and we could have been aggressive scored some very quick runs and still given ourselves a much better chance of winning
The speed of the fast bowlers in the second innings says a lot
 
Essexyellows said:
Its a dilemma that`s for sure - play fearless & entertaining cricket and lose the odd game, or go back to nerves, drudgery and "dull" wins with more defeats.

Yes its about winning, same as football but a 5-4 defeat is always better value than a 1-0. :)
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Not sure there is any dilemma - we weren't winning tests prior to the change in style and even managed to contrive a series loss in West Indies.

They just need to prove the style is adaptable and that Stokes and McCullum are learning.
 
They said during commentary that the forecast at the time was for bad weather on the final day which may have played some part in the decision to try and wrap things up early. Obviously that proved to be unfounded but I think credit also needs to be given the Kiwis for their second innings fightback. It didn’t help that we threw away the key wickets of Brook, Root and then Foakes when we were on course for victory. One thing’s for sure, you don’t get many dull games between us and NZ.
 
Essexyellows said:
Its a dilemma that`s for sure - play fearless & entertaining cricket and lose the odd game, or go back to nerves, drudgery and "dull" wins with more defeats.

Yes its about winning, same as football but a 5-4 defeat is always better value than a 1-0. :)
Click to expand...

But as has been said before - there was no need in this Test to abandon the principles of being hyper-aggressive entertainers.
The third day would have been an absolute blast (for everyone who likes that sort of thing.......) if England's batsmen had head out there with designs on setting the highest possible target within the shortest possible time. And then we would almost certainly have left NZ needing by far the highest run chase in history to win, and our bowlers would have been refreshed after a day's rest.

Enforcing the follow-on wasn't a fearless or entertaining decision......it was just a tactically stupid one.

And if we really want to be the best team in the world and thump the Aussies, we ought to be devastated that we threw away a series that was already won rather than cheerfully talking about what a great game it was.
 
By biggest concern is for Stokes the cricketer. His body really is packing up on him. Last night it was a difficult watch, the guy was clearly in excruciating pain and batted on one leg for a couple of hours. The guy has the heart of a lion, and was never going to do anything other than soldier on and try and get his side home. But I don't want him to suffer any lasting damage that could effect his life long after he's finished playing cricket.
 
Meanwhile the 50 over team edge Bangladesh, with a Malan century.
Archer and Wood in the same team......
 
is ther
Foley said:
Meanwhile the 50 over team edge Bangladesh, with a Malan century.
Archer and Wood in the same team......
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is there any highlights coverage of ODI V Bangladesh?
 
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