European Championships 23/03/2023: Euro 2024 qualifier: Italy v England

[bert]

Happy with that result. Italy lose their first euro qualifier in 40 games.

 

[Foley]

Other than Donnarumma, Acerbi and Verratti I've not heard of this Italian team. For a good 15 years I would be able to name a full strength Italian side.

I'm not sure if I'm old, they're now shite, or a bit of both...

Jorginho?

 

[Foley]

This ref needs a go in league one if he wants to see some time wasting.

Wycombe would have 11 red cards

 

[Northstandboy]

Wycombe would have 11 red cards

And they might have still got a point from the game

 

[holdsteady]

A win away in Italy is always a good result, should of been out of sight by half time and made hard work if it second half but you can’t complain about an away win to your biggest rivals in the group to to get started.

I do think Southgate tends to sit back on leads a bit to quickly, I know it’s international football and you have to be a bit defensive minded but we could have kept getting at them.

Probably a sign of how far we have come that we are griping about an away win to Italy in a competitive game though, might not have qualified for the World Cup but they are still European Champions.

 

[unification]

England have beaten Germany far more times in competitive fixtures than Italy. Whatever you think of the current Italian crop, to go to Naples and beat them - with 10 men by the end - is some result.

Sure, the jeopardy isn’t really there since even second place in the group goes through to the finals in UEFA’s overly bloated version of the Euros nowadays, but to get the most difficult game out of the way first with a win means England are surely on easy street now. Beat Ukraine and you can surely faff about for the next two after that with Malta and North Macedonia in June.

 

[Big Ronaldo]

By any standard, beating Italy away is a very tough ask.

 

[tonyw]

Probably a sign of how far we have come that we are griping about an away win to Italy in a competitive game though, might not have qualified for the World Cup but they are still European Champions.

Not sure that anyone's really griping though - it was clearly an outstanding first half performance and result. And it should make qualification a cake walk from here on in.

I've probably been the most negative on this thread, and all I'm saying is 'Great result - but can they do it when the pressure's highest, in a knockout game at a major tournament against a top side?'. Because in my lifetime, the answer has always been no, no they can't.

 

[Golden Dr Otto]

@tonyw you’re using 44 years of stats of which 40 years are irrelevant. This new crop have something more and keep getting better. We bossed the French, we’ve beaten Italy away, our expectations are increasing and we know we’ll reach the quarters these days. At that stage, and ask all the big teams, it’s just a little luck and confidence. The changes made 15 years ago at grassroots have kicked in and I for one am more excited because teams like Italy see us as better than them. We dominated them first half. No England team has ever been capable of that

 

[tonto]

Harry Kane motm not just for the goal but for his excellent hold up play which we really needed in a patchy second half. Was a bit bonkers taking Foden off when the rest of the midfield were looking a bit knackered still we got away with it.

 

[Bath Yellow]

So Kane broke Wayne Rooney scoring record tonight, 18 were penalties where as Rooney only scored 7. As far as i am concerned Rooney would have been way ahead still.

 

[tonyw]

@tonyw you’re using 44 years of stats of which 40 years are irrelevant. This new crop have something more and keep getting better. We bossed the French, we’ve beaten Italy away, our expectations are increasing and we know we’ll reach the quarters these days. At that stage, and ask all the big teams, it’s just a little luck and confidence. The changes made 15 years ago at grassroots have kicked in and I for one am more excited because teams like Italy see us as better than them. We dominated them first half. No England team has ever been capable of that

Frankly, I think this is a big part of the problem.
When the big tournaments get down to the business end, the best sides are often full of arrogant bastards that go out there and get it done. The England football team always gets timid, and afraid of failure, and then cracks under the pressure. Argentina weren't a more talented side than us in Qatar, but they were mentally much tougher. So when the big moments came along, they seized them whilst we forgot to mark Giroud from a simple cross and then had our World Class striker put a pen into orbit.

And the thing that made me really angry about Qatar (and maybe this is just because I've been in America too long)......about half our fans seemed to think our World Cup performance was acceptable. We played well, France were a good side, no disgrace to lose to them.

Well I say B*****s to that. I'm tired of losing. Only one stat I care about from this point on, and that's major tournament victories. I'm done with handing out any plaudits until an England captain is holding a trophy.

 

[OxfordBoy]

So Kane broke Wayne Rooney scoring record tonight, 18 were penalties where as Rooney only scored 7. As far as i am concerned Rooney would have been way ahead still.

12 tournament goals compared to Rooney’s 7 though

Also done it in 40 less games

I’ll bet you £5k Kane ends up with more open play goals than Rooney too?

 

[holdsteady]

Not sure that anyone's really griping though - it was clearly an outstanding first half performance and result. And it should make qualification a cake walk from here on in.

I've probably been the most negative on this thread, and all I'm saying is 'Great result - but can they do it when the pressure's highest, in a knockout game at a major tournament against a top side?'. Because in my lifetime, the answer has always been no, no they can't.

I am 44 as well, I noticed in the last few tournaments that I am more wary of the huge burst if optimism that engulfs the country every time we win a knockout game in a tournament than younger work colleagues, still get excited but it’s just tempered with the years of it going wrong.

But as Ricky Otto says below most of those years are irrelevant, completely different set of players.

The griping was more aimed at me, you know this team must be pretty decent though when you can think of criticism after we have our first win away to Italy in 62 years.

The team may not be perfect but it’s the best we have had for ages, only France in Europe are better and not by a huge distance. A forward line of Kane, Saka, Rashford with Bellingham behind and Foden, Grealish etc to come on is a long way from what we have had In previous years, might not have the best centre backs but not many do these days.

Given that Italy and Germany are not what they were and we are off to a flier in our qualifying group this euros may be our best chance to ever win anything. Very, very early days but I think I am just going to try and enjoy us at the very least being a competitive, competent national team for now, had far worse times supporting England but why let them ruin it?

 

[Oslernorth]

So Kane broke Wayne Rooney scoring record tonight, 18 were penalties where as Rooney only scored 7. As far as i am concerned Rooney would have been way ahead still.

Kane has been a better penalty taker throughout his career though, so deserved all those spot kits.
Obviously England v France not withstanding.

 

[Foley]

Not sure that anyone's really griping though - it was clearly an outstanding first half performance and result. And it should make qualification a cake walk from here on in.

I've probably been the most negative on this thread, and all I'm saying is 'Great result - but can they do it when the pressure's highest, in a knockout game at a major tournament against a top side?'. Because in my lifetime, the answer has always been no, no they can't.

I am unfortunately older than you Tony, and remember us not even qualifying for Euros and WCs.
This is the first time that we have consistently been in with a chance. We are close ( losing on penalties in a Final). I agree that Southgate at times is too negative sitting on a lead, but we are genuinely contenders for the Euros.
Agree that the next step is beating France and the really top teams.

 

[Foley]

Kane has been a better penalty taker throughout his career though, so deserved all those spot kits.
Obviously England v France not withstanding.

I would imagine that injuries permitting, Kane will finish above Rooney on non penalty goals.
I assume Linaker scored a lot of penalties, but not so sure about Bobby Charlton?

 

[holdsteady]

I am unfortunately older than you Tony, and remember us not even qualifying for Euros and WCs.
This is the first time that we have consistently been in with a chance. We are close ( losing on penalties in a Final). I agree that Southgate at times is too negative sitting on a lead, but we are genuinely contenders for the Euros.
Agree that the next step is beating France and the really top teams.

Well we have beaten Germany and Italy, Croatia could be thrown in there as well, so we have beaten good teams and the bigger nations just not done it all the way through tournament yet. France are the stand out in Europe, we were close but no cigar against them but if you keep getting to the later knock out stages with a good team law of averages suggests one of them should come off.

Can't disagree that we need to stay on the front foot a bit more when we have the lead though, although international football is more of a tactical battle than club football where the players know each other better.

 

[bashamwonderland]

So Kane broke Wayne Rooney scoring record tonight, 18 were penalties where as Rooney only scored 7. As far as i am concerned Rooney would have been way ahead still.

Rooney bagged loads of goals against Andorra, Kazakhstan and San Marino. They're basically the same as penalities.

 

[SteMerritt]

So Kane broke Wayne Rooney scoring record tonight, 18 were penalties where as Rooney only scored 7. As far as i am concerned Rooney would have been way ahead still.

Yet if he'd scored one more penalty that doesn't really count against France, we could have a second World Cup final appearance under our belts.