Manager/Coach Robbo out. Thread number 2

[Thomas/Brock/Jones]

Really strange arguments being made on here by a vocal tiny minority who want KR gone ASAP for whatever reason.
If you say 'well he has got us into the play offs two seasons in a row and a respectable 8th this season I think he deserves another season especially if the budget is increased' ( all the while by playing excellent in the main entertaining style of football) you are suddenly not a fan and just think KR is more important than the club ?! Bizarre

 

[Mellowyellow]

And we conceded the most number of goals in the top 11 teams.

This seems to have been the mantra of the season, disregard the number of goals conceded and concentrate on the number scored. Except, we didn't score enough in many games in order not to lose.

This is a League competition. The final measurement of success comes down to league position. All talk of "improvement" is for the club not, the competition.
The improvement that I want to see is in that league position.

When has egg ever listened to common sense?

 

[greatunclekip]

For the sake of argument then. Next year. Ainsworth is manager. We go up in 2nd place playing terrible football. Then come straight back down. Success? Worth it? I'd rather have two more years finishing 8th in League One and scoring the most goals in the league with some amazing highs.

I guess the question is about what success means to you. And the only people whose opinion matters on that front, ultimately, is the owners.

Yes. We'd have had a season in the Championship and serious money in the coffers for players like Vokes, Stockdale etc.

I couldn't honestly give a s**t about finishing 8th with some lovely passing.

I remember when we were 2nd in the league pushing Hull all the way under Atkins and people moaning. We then brought in Rix on the promise of lovely passing..that went well.

Winning is everything. An empty trophy room but lots of nice words in the press represents a disappointing career.

 

[Swaby39]

Yes. We'd have had a season in the Championship and serious money in the coffers for players like Vokes, Stockdale etc.

What a thrill that sounds.

 

[tonyw]

The prizes are given out based on league position, not points. Whilst they're a useful guide, they can fluctuate season-to-season based on the changing nature of the quality of the opposition. Whilst many teams at the top picked up a lot of points, there were a lot of terrible teams too. In 2018/19, bottom finished with 41 points and the last relegated side had 50. This season, bottom finished on 29 points, 41 points would have seen you safe and 50 points gives you a 10 point buffer to the relegated sides.

Other metrics are a good guide, but I don't think people should be shouted down when they say league position is the most important one.

I pointed this out on the League One run-in thread, but the polarization was pretty extreme in League One this season. Historically so.

Fleetwood stayed up with 40 points and Morecambe with 42.
In literally every other season in the third tier since they went from 2 to 3 points for a win in 1981, someone has been relegated with 43 points or more. Southend once got relegated with 54!

So while there were a bunch of really good teams this year, there were half a dozen terrible teams as well. And that has inflated all of the top teams' point totals.
(we got 26 points in our games against those bottom 6 - or 2.17 PPG)


Which is to say - I don't think it's fair to only look at the final points total, and say that means that we were better this year. I think when you weigh everything, we were actually about the same as last year. A good League One team, not a great team, with some rather obvious flaws in our squad construction.

I certainly don't think we're doing horribly compared to our budget, so I don't think KR should go.
But if he makes the same mistakes, and we end up in the same position next season, then I think I'll change my tune (and I suspect the OUFC board will as well)

 

[Foley]

I pointed this out on the League One run-in thread, but the polarization was pretty extreme in League One this season. Historically so.

Fleetwood stayed up with 40 points and Morecambe with 42.
In literally every other season in the third tier since they went from 2 to 3 points for a win in 1981, someone has been relegated with 43 points or more. Southend once got relegated with 54!

So while there were a bunch of really good teams this year, there were half a dozen terrible teams as well. And that has inflated all of the top teams' point totals.
(we got 26 points in our games against those bottom 6 - or 2.17 PPG)


Which is to say - I don't think it's fair to only look at the final points total, and say that means that we were better this year. I think when you weigh everything, we were actually about the same as last year. A good League One team, not a great team, with some rather obvious flaws in our squad construction.

I certainly don't think we're doing horribly compared to our budget, so I don't think KR should go.
But if he makes the same mistakes, and we end up in the same position next season, then I think I'll change my tune (and I suspect the OUFC board will as well)

I am not sure that the bottom teams have been more 'terrible' than for example Rochdale last season who were 4th from bottom?
My view is that is that the Top half are a lot stringer overall leading to the bottom half having fewer points.

 

[Scotchegg]

I am not sure that the bottom teams have been more 'terrible' than for example Rochdale last season who were 4th from bottom?
My view is that is that the Top half are a lot stringer overall leading to the bottom half having fewer points.

I agree. The top 13 down to Charlton are as strong as I can remember league 1. Look at the kind of money being spent by Bolton and Ipswich in 9th and 11th as an example.

Below 13th we then have the likes of Burton, Lincoln and Shrewsbury who are all solid league one sides, and Cheltenham and Cambridge who've done well since coming up.

There certainly wasn't too many easy games and the fact that those at the bottom struggled for points is more down to the fact that there were some very strong sides to contend with.

 

[werthersoriginal]

I am not sure that the bottom teams have been more 'terrible' than for example Rochdale last season who were 4th from bottom?
My view is that is that the Top half are a lot stringer overall leading to the bottom half having fewer points.

Yes, even Fleetwood and Morecambe were tricky, and the mid table sides were tough opponents. I think it’s more a case of a very strong top ten sides.

 

[tonyw]

Below 13th we then have the likes of Burton, Lincoln and Shrewsbury who are all solid league one sides, and Cheltenham and Cambridge who've done well since coming up.

Burton & Shrewsbury both finished this season in almost exactly the same spot that they finished last season! (Burton were 16th in both; Shrews dropped from 17th to 18th).

Some others (MK Dons, Plymouth) were much better this season. Some (Lincoln, Gillingham) were much worse.

What the stats show is is that the league was much more polarized this year than it has ever been before.

Whether you think that's because the top teams were better or the bottom teams were worse is probably down to each individual's personal prejudices - because unless anyone was regularly watching non-Oxford games, we only saw every team twice this year. Not enough to make an objective assessment.

 

[Scotchegg]

Burton & Shrewsbury both finished this season in almost exactly the same spot that they finished last season! (Burton were 16th in both; Shrews dropped from 17th to 18th).

Some others (MK Dons, Plymouth) were much better this season. Some (Lincoln, Gillingham) were much worse.

What the stats show is is that the league was much more polarized this year than it has ever been before.

Whether you think that's because the top teams were better or the bottom teams were worse is probably down to each individual's personal prejudices - because unless anyone was regularly watching non-Oxford games, we only saw every team twice this year. Not enough to make an objective assessment.

That's a fair point, but observations on teams aren't only made when watching live. Highlights are easily available as are more indepth reports and analysis from various independent sources. There is also our own experience of the league over several seasons that shows that games against the likes of Burton are often far trickier than league position would suggest.

 

[tonyw]

That's a fair point, but observations on teams aren't only made when watching live. Highlights are easily available as are more indepth reports and analysis from various independent sources. There is also our own experience of the league over several seasons that shows that games against the likes of Burton are often far trickier than league position would suggest.

Although they haven't been for us recently! We've absolutely battered them in the league four times in a row now!

 

[Scotchegg]

Although they haven't been for us recently! We've absolutely battered them in the league four times in a row now!

We have, but I doubt that we would have expected that.

 

[werthersoriginal]

Although they haven't been for us recently! We've absolutely battered them in the league four times in a row now!

Burton have seemed feeble recently, they are too open against us. But Cheltenham and Cambridge were tough , we struggle with their style.

 

[bazzer9461]

For the sake of argument then. Next year. Ainsworth is manager. We go up in 2nd place playing terrible football. Then come straight back down. Success? Worth it? I'd rather have two more years finishing 8th in League One and scoring the most goals in the league with some amazing highs.

I guess the question is about what success means to you. And the only people whose opinion matters on that front, ultimately, is the owners.

Well I don’t think the new owners want this and I don’t think the fans would want this.
Yes and more than likely we could come straight back down but have a much bigger budget to go straight back up, or we stay in the championship scrapping around the relegation zone for a couple of season but improving and increasing our income to make us more competitive and start to make our mark in the championship.

 

[bazzer9461]

It doesn't help to make comments like "a football club they claim to support".

Fans can have different expectations and be loyal to managers or players that others disagree with whilst still supporting the club.

You're right, we have been supported financially and more do next season. And the (new) owners will expect results. However they also have complete faith in Robinson achieving those results which is why they continue to back him.

Well he has next season to achieve the result they want.

 

[bazzer9461]

Really strange arguments being made on here by a vocal tiny minority who want KR gone ASAP for whatever reason.
If you say 'well he has got us into the play offs two seasons in a row and a respectable 8th this season I think he deserves another season especially if the budget is increased' ( all the while by playing excellent in the main entertaining style of football) you are suddenly not a fan and just think KR is more important than the club ?! Bizarre

I think that’s fair enough

 

[YellowinBirmingham]

Well I don’t think the new owners want this and I don’t think the fans would want this.
Yes and more than likely we could come straight back down but have a much bigger budget to go straight back up, or we stay in the championship scrapping around the relegation zone for a couple of season but improving and increasing our income to make us more competitive and start to make our mark in the championship.

This is the crux of the thread, I guess.

I'm happy with where we are... I don't think getting promoted is the be all and end all. I think lots of fans feel the same. (Who knows? They may not on the forum making their voices heard. I might be completely wrong.) Thus I'm happy to give KR time.

I understand why some fans might not be, especially after trips to Morecambe, Portsmouth, Accrington, etc, where we didn't feel like a team making progress.

Who is right? We'll probably find out in about 10 years.

Oxblogger's match report after Rotherham summed it up brilliantly.

 

[tim lane]

This is the crux of the thread, I guess.

I'm happy with where we are... I don't think getting promoted is the be all and end all. I think lots of fans feel the same. (Who knows? They may not on the forum making their voices heard. I might be completely wrong.) Thus I'm happy to give KR time.

I understand why some fans might not be, especially after trips to Morecambe, Portsmouth, Accrington, etc, where we didn't feel like a team making progress.

Who is right? We'll probably find out in about 10 years.

Oxblogger's match report after Rotherham summed it up brilliantly.

Well, YB, promotion is the be all and end all for me and so, no, I'm not happy with where we are. Further, given his track record of one promotion in what is now quite a long managerial career, I don't believe we'll reach the Championship under KR. I think the Board may decide to make a change sooner rather than later.

 

[YellowinBirmingham]

Well, YB, promotion is the be all and end all for me and so, no, I'm not happy with where we are. Further, given his track record of one promotion in what is now quite a long managerial career, I don't believe we'll reach the Championship under KR. I think the Board may decide to make a change sooner rather than later.

I understand. And you may very well be right!

I'm interested to know when promotion stops being the be all and end all for you? When we go up to the championship? Is it just about finding the right level for the club? (genuinely interested - I'm not trying to change your mind or imply you aren't right - it mattered a lot more to me in 2010 than it does now!)

 

[werthersoriginal]

Well, YB, promotion is the be all and end all for me and so, no, I'm not happy with where we are. Further, given his track record of one promotion in what is now quite a long managerial career, I don't believe we'll reach the Championship under KR. I think the Board may decide to make a change sooner rather than later.

But you must have enjoyed most of our 20+ home games this season?