General Fans’ Forum: VOTE

[werthersoriginal]

Scotchers, we're not all itk like you. Some of us would like to hear directly from the club as to what measures have been put in place to ensure last season's debacle is not repeated. If we were all as well connected as you I'm sure we'd all be a lot more confident going into the summer, but unfortunately the majority of the fan base have to make do with what the club tells us, which, at present, is very little (unless you consider "yeah, probably could've acted sooner, lol" communication).

The reluctance to stage a fans' forum only reinforces the arm's length approach employed by Brent and Keenan to date.

I wouldn’t imagine they’d say anything much about the past season or give away anything confidential. But the club really needs an identifiable focal point from senior management and an open event would help. Not much good if they then disappear for six months though.

 

[Steve Gilbert]

I wouldn’t imagine they’d say anything much about the past season or give away anything confidential. But the club really needs an identifiable focal point from senior management and an open event would help. Not much good if they then disappear for six months though.

An open day would be a start. I’m sure @Sarge said this was discussed at the AGM?

 

[MJB]

The most disheartening thing is that a hastily arranged Fans’s Forum post-FGR was such an open-goal for Williams and Ferguson, and yet they’ve still, inexplicably, managed to f**k it up.

(Par for course as an analogy given our striker recruitment situation on their watch, of course).

They’re just useless at fan engagement and it’s bread and butter for both of their roles.

Completely out of their depth and too arrogant to ever admit it.

 

[SirAndyOfCrosby]

I know I'll get shot down for it, but how many of the 10,000 home fans that turned up to the Accrington game actually want a fans forum?

150 voted on here, but this forum only represents a pretty small proportion of the wider fan base, and those that would actually attend would be far fewer.

Personally, I'd like a fans forum, but not to point the figure at people but to find out what the plans are moving forward. I'm sure others want their pound of flesh, which is fine but there's only so much you can get from that when the response is almost certainly going to be "we're sorry, we've learnt, we're listening, we'll make things right". Especially when those wanting to hold them to account won't believe a word they say.

Maybe on reflection having a forum when there is more information about the stadium, there are some real changes behind the scenes, and we can see how our recruitment is going.

But it's only an opinion, and I'm sure I'll be told that I'm not a real fan etc!!

You're the kid at school who would remind the teacher to set homework.

 

[Scotchegg]

I wouldn’t imagine they’d say anything much about the past season or give away anything confidential. But the club really needs an identifiable focal point from senior management and an open event would help. Not much good if they then disappear for six months though.

I'm not saying that there shouldn't be a forum, and I've said for a long time that the communication is shocking. But just think that actions speak louder than words and maybe a preseason forum would have more value than one now.

 

[bazzer9461]

What I would say is that it is interesting no one has jumped all over the latest comments from Manning.
He has said he will learn from his mistakes at MK and the relegation fight here.
He has said we are already well under way with our recruitment.
He has said that he hopes to bring players in earlier rather than later.

Time will tell, we’ve heard this in th last 9 transfer windows and it never happened, hopefully Manning and Hoggy will show us they mean business very soon, just hope Tweedle Dee and Tweedle Dum don’t interfere when there is no need.

 

[Scotchegg]

You're the kid at school who would remind the teacher to set homework.

Not the "you're not a real fan" rubbish I was expecting but almost as bad!

 

[SirAndyOfCrosby]

Not the "you're not a real fan" rubbish I was expecting craving but almost as bad!

Fixed that for you.

 

[ZeroTheHero]

While it isn’t good at all that they have gone back on their word,

That is certainly a major factor in the annoyance about this. If they really aren't that bothered about keeping their word about something that is actually so easy for them to do, then why on earth should we believe a single thing they say - especially if what they promise is at all difficult?

But there is also a large factor in the fact that they should being visible and engaged with the people they are asking to stump up for next season (and many of whom have already shown their support by doing just that). The 'customers' are currently - in general at least - happy with the youth team, the women's team, the new manager, the season ticket offers and progress on the stadium and aren't exactly going to be a hugely hostile crowd at a fans forum. Yes, there will be a few questions about their slowness to act re KR, some about the lack of meaningful communication (of which this is just another example of course) and some about the lack of control the board actually seemed to have during KRs tenure (and maybe some DoF discussion) but nothing that a quick apology, a 'we will learn from it' and 'some exciting signings over the summer' wouldn't put right.

If they are really that thin skinned that they cannot take a bit of healthy criticism, then they aren't the men for this job. What would they have done if we had been relegated? Taken a Trappist vow of silence and moved into a sealed nuclear bunker?

 

[Steve Gilbert]

That is certainly a major factor in the annoyance about this. If they really aren't that bothered about keeping their word about something that is actually so easy for them to do, then why on earth should we believe a single thing they say - especially if what they promise is at all difficult?

But there is also a large factor in the fact that they should being visible and engaged with the people they are asking to stump up for next season (and many of whom have already shown their support by doing just that). The 'customers' are currently - in general at least - happy with the youth team, the women's team, the new manager, the season ticket offers and progress on the stadium and aren't exactly going to be a hugely hostile crowd at a fans forum. Yes, there will be a few questions about their slowness to act re KR, some about the lack of meaningful communication (of which this is just another example of course) and some about the lack of control the board actually seemed to have during KRs tenure (and maybe some DoF discussion) but nothing that a quick apology, a 'we will learn from it' and 'some exciting signings over the summer' wouldn't put right.

If they are really that thin skinned that they cannot take a bit of healthy criticism, then they aren't the men for this job. What would they have done if we had been relegated? Taken a Trappist vow of silence and moved into a sealed nuclear bunker?

I personally just don’t think they are very good PR people which is fine if they have someone on board that is, which they currently don’t.
I think they do listen to fans, the season ticket package shows this IMO.

What is very much up in the air is what they expect from next season. I guess we will learn that over the summer with what type of player we bring in.

We all know the goal is too 30 club and that timescale has probably shifted after this season but I would say we are going into next season a bit unknown of what is expected.

Is it to finish top half? Is it to flirt with the play offs? Is it to get into the play offs?

Another question is how seriously are they going to take the cup competitions. Do we want to focus on the league to reach the play offs or do we want to try and have a good cup run and finish as high as possible in the league?

Those are the questions I’d like to know the answers too.

I’m not too fussed when it comes to budgets because at the end of the day, we are losing multiple millions a year which the owners are stumping up so I feel it is down to them how much they want to invest right now considering they want to put millions into a new stadium. As a fan base though it would just be good to know what the short term ambition is.

 

[Manorlounger]

Ok, my thoughts.
First of all, and, as highlighted by the OUSP, fan engagement is a given as set by the EFL. Not engaging via a fans forum or otherwise is not acceptable. OxVox have just highlighted this in their latest update. Very diplomatically they have excused the lack of announcement of a date but, there is no doubting their irritation.

Secondly, a fans forum was absolutely promised by the club. The delay in announcing a date was excused as the replacement for KR was being recruited. That counts for an acceptable delay not, total denial.

Third, we have all just been through one of the most trying and destructive seasons for many, many years. Fan engagement is now vital. The new stadium needs our support, needs our participation. A fans forum to engage with the supporter/fan base is imperative.

I find all of this further confirmation that both Tim Williams and Grant Ferguson hold the fan base in contempt. This is unacceptable. if the owners are condoning this kind of behaviour then things are seriously worrying.

 

[greatunclekip]

As I've said before, a fans forum serves no purpose with the current incumbents in place. The Chuckle Brothers would use it to either spout cliches or get all defensive. It doesn't change the fact that we have two people utterly unsuitable to running a league 1 football club, running a league 1 football club. They proved that with their actions, they are still in denial, they take the "customers" for mugs, it's pointless.

In all honesty, actions will speak louder than words this summer. My bar is set very low whilst those two are involved.

Maybe they'll turn it around. Maybe I'll marry Salma Hayek.

 

[Steve Gilbert]

As I've said before, a fans forum serves no purpose with the current incumbents in place. The Chuckle Brothers would use it to either spout cliches or get all defensive. It doesn't change the fact that we have two people utterly unsuitable to running a league 1 football club, running a league 1 football club. They proved that with their actions, they are still in denial, they take the "customers" for mugs, it's pointless.

In all honesty, actions will speak louder than words this summer. My bar is set very low whilst those two are involved.

Maybe they'll turn it around. Maybe I'll marry Salma Hayek.

Like I said before, I’m not sure they are the wrong people to do the jobs they do but what they need is a good PR person to interact with the fans. We have a SLO who no one actually hears from. We need to replace him with someone who will interact with the fans properly.

 

[Joey]

Absolutely incredible that there are people here saying they don't see the point in a forum, basically because fans will be annoyed and won't listen to the answers. A week today a team who have been in League 2 while we've been in League 1 will be booking their place in the Premier League and we've got fans who don't see any point in asking what mistakes the board think were made this season, what the plans are to rectify it, what have they learned etc.

I don't understand what is to be lost by having one. Why do we need to be so accepting of failure and pandering to a couple of people who seen to hold us in contempt? If we have another failure of a transfer window should we not bother asking any questions come September as the damage has already been done and we'll have more important things to concentrate on going forwards? They should be held to account rather than hiding away, and there should certainly be no fans excusing them hiding or suggesting it doesn't really matter. Standards are set from the top of an organisation and theirs are woeful. They should be facing the music, never mind the fact that they promised one off their own back and were entitled to it anyway.

Even if it is a hundred fans calling them dickheads for an hour it might at least sharpen their focus for next year rather than thinking we're accepting of them completely taking the P**s. Not saying that would be helpful but don't dismiss it as damaging or pointless, we should have some pride in our club and demand more. A passive shrug of the shoulders and an "oh well it's done now" is a huge part of the reason Robinson was here for several months longer than he should have been dragging us into the crap.

 

[ZeroTheHero]

As I've said before, a fans forum serves no purpose with the current incumbents in place.

Nope - sorry I don't agree. That is the inverse of the 'lets wait until the new season' argument. 'Lets no bother because the current incumbents are poor' is not a reason for them to not hold one or for us to not want them to stand by their promises to hold one.

The point is that those in charge of our club *need* to communicate with the supporters. All the time. Properly. Whether the season had been good or bad, if they fancy it or not. Despite Tim Williams apologising for calling us 'customers' early in his tenure, it really does seem that is how they see us. I applaud the efforts of OxVox and OUSP that have resulted in a halfway decent season ticket offering, and well done to the club for doing something on that front. But a football club is more than just putting 'product' out that people will buy - it is about creating a 'whole club' mentality, about a community, a unity of purpose. You can't do that if you simply ignore the main part and point of the club - the support.

You may well be right that the current off field management simply isn't up to it, I suspect the reluctance to hold a fan's forum is because that might become very apparent if they did.

 

[Swaby39]

The proof will very much be in the pudding though and my word they have a lot to do on and off the pitch to do to convince some of us that they know what they are doing.

Yep, so surely fast tracking that would be quite high on the agenda. It’s an opportunity to a) build a bridge with their biggest critics and b) demonstrate they know better than last season. Sure, actions will be what matters, but this would at least show they aren’t just interested in the fans who will boomerang in silence no matter how they run the club.

A lot of their comments earlier in the season have aged incredibly badly when looked at vs the standards and expectations that they themselves wanted to be measured against (regular fan engagement, promotion etc). Grant’s end of season roundup was frankly a joke. If we aren’t going to hold them to that and unpack it when they fall pathetically short, then who will? Are we any better than absent owners if we just forget it because it’s in the past? How can we expect anything to change? Do we just pray?

Having the forum would at least show we’re on the same page and that at least a fraction of them is upset by how we did this year and motivated to change it. I don’t think they care, personally. They’ve changed the manager which they fought incredibly hard not to do - you could argue the fans forced it and it’s why we’re a L1 club for next season. But other than that, have they visibly changed anything for the better that you don’t need a contact inside the club to tell you? Maybe, but the point is we don’t know if they don’t tell us.

The disconnect between boardroom and fans grew larger and larger throughout the season and it’s currently a disaster. More questions are being asked without answers and people naturally start to guess. Why, with season tickets launching last week, would you not want to fix that and re-group with the fans? ‘Here’s what happened, here’s where we’re at and here’s what we’ve changed’. It’s not a big ask and would very likely boost sales unless they make an absolute hash of it.

I very much agree with the previous post that suggests it smacks of 2 blokes who know they don’t have the answers and being put on the spot terrifies them.

 

[MJB]

Yep, so surely fast tracking that would be quite high on the agenda. It’s an opportunity to a) build a bridge with their biggest critics and b) demonstrate they know better than last season. Sure, actions will be what matters, but this would at least show they aren’t just interested in the fans who will boomerang in silence no matter how they run the club.

A lot of their comments earlier in the season have aged incredibly badly when looked at vs the standards and expectations that they themselves wanted to be measured against (regular fan engagement, promotion etc). Grant’s end of season roundup was frankly a joke. If we aren’t going to hold them to that and unpack it when they fall pathetically short, then who will? Are we any better than absent owners if we just forget it because it’s in the past? How can we expect anything to change? Do we just pray?

Having the forum would at least show we’re on the same page and that at least a fraction of them is upset by how we did this year and motivated to change it. I don’t think they care, personally. They’ve changed the manager which they fought incredibly hard not to do - you could argue the fans forced it and it’s why we’re a L1 club for next season. But other than that, have they visibly changed anything for the better that you don’t need a contact inside the club to tell you? Maybe, but the point is we don’t know if they don’t tell us.

The disconnect between boardroom and fans grew larger and larger throughout the season and it’s currently a disaster. More questions are being asked without answers and people naturally start to guess. Why, with season tickets launching last week, would you not want to fix that and re-group with the fans? ‘Here’s what happened, here’s where we’re at and here’s what we’ve changed’. It’s not a big ask and would very likely boost sales unless they make an absolute hash of it.

I very much agree with the previous post that suggests it smacks of 2 blokes who know they don’t have the answers and being put on the spot terrifies them.

Yep, and the longer they take with engaging, the bigger the pressure builds on them and the club as it creates a vacuum.

They are so passive, it’s unreal.

Zero agency.

 

[RyanioBirdio]

Yep, and the longer they take with engaging, the bigger the pressure builds on them and the club as it creates a vacuum.

They are so passive, it’s unreal.

Zero agency.

If you want to leave something behind, you confront it and bury it on the spot.

This isn’t difficult.

 

[MJB]

If you want to leave something behind, you confront it and bury it on the spot.

This isn’t difficult.

They’ve learnt nothing from their Robinson debacle. Worrying.

 

[Swaby39]

They’ve learnt nothing from their Robinson debacle. Worrying.

So little, in fact, that we are doing it all again. We’re again at the mercy of a manager to find the formula for success. The average time served by a manager is 2 years so it’s hardly a sustainable way to operate. Whether it goes extremely well or extremely wrong, we’ve got a problem.