General Fans Forum - Kassam Stadium - 7th March @ 6.30pm

[Yellow River]

I think in general under the current stewardship of the club, long standing supporters haven’t been treated with the respect they deserve.

Only the club knows why they have chosen to go down that route.

Perhaps it is that more than anything which is the root cause of a feeling of disconnect between supporters and club? Rip the heart out of a club and you end up with a soulless, corporate entity. Enjoy your activations.

 

[BDJ]

My highlight was @Manorlounger mentioning biscuits.

 

[LeftSideLarry]

My highlight was @Manorlounger mentioning biscuits.

Yes, though Sarge let us down through his failure to mention craft ales and farmhouse ciders. I was ready to shout bingo!

 

[Common Villager]

I think it is imperative that another fans forum with the SLT is held shortly after a decision has been made on the planning application. At this stage more should be known about how the stadium will be funded, the legal framework between club-owners-investors, and the accounts will have been published. We can't leave it until next March / April.

 

[Sarge]

Yes, though Sarge let us down through his failure to mention craft ales and farmhouse ciders. I was ready to shout bingo!

-that was on my list of un asked Q's - though John Clarke did mention in one of his answers that it was a mistake on the plans saying sports bar, it should apparently say 'bar'

 

[m]

It was very clear that they do read this place.

(As @RyanioBirdio has previously stated)

 

[Maurice Earp]

I wasn't able to make it this evening (6:30pm start was too early for me), but managed to catch most of the stream. A few randomly assorted thoughts:

- The issue of how the stadium will be funded still seems largely unclear. Both Grant and Tim skirted the question as to whether or not the owners would be willing to self-fund the stadium if enough investment is not forthcoming. I appreciate there's a lot they still don't know, but I would've liked a bit more certainty as to the board's commitment beyond 'they're currently losing £5-6m a year'. Additionally, what happens in the event that costs exceed budgets and there's a shortfall in funding?

- Grant repeated the fact that the site would have to be used for football regardless of who owned the stadium / club. That's not the crux of the matter though, is it? We could still find ourselves in a situation such as the one we're in now, couldn't we?

- I thought Jonathan Clarke spoke well on the whole. I would've liked to ask him how confident he is that the stadium can be built in time, based on current assumptions as to when we will get a verdict regarding the planning application. I work in construction (albeit I've never worked on a project anywhere near as complicated as the stadium will be) and my humble opinion is that the timescales are unbelievably tight, particularly when you consider just how ambitious the plans are in respect of the environmental credentials

- Tim still doesn't seem to appreciate the benefit of communicating directly with the fan base. Essentially his preference appears to be to talk to us when he has something he wants to say or his boss(es) are coming over for a visit

- I don't quite understand what Jim Goddard's role is, nor why he's been brought back into the club at a seemingly much higher level than he was at before

No mention of Mr Benson???

 

[Maurice Earp]

I have to say I was disappointed. In my view they can consider themselves fortunate not to have received more difficult questions (they didn’t get round to mine).

A few takeaways;

- Fundamentally they’re utterly convinced that the job they are doing is super. Any narrative that doesn’t fit their belief system is never going to be warmly met. This is a problem.

- They couldn’t comprehend the subject of supporter disenchantment. They referenced that it is up to supporters to create a positive atmosphere and communication (whether good or bad) is subjective. The reality is they have to accept much more accountability here. Healthy support, positivity and atmosphere permeates from the top down rather than the bottom up. They left this to supporters to figure it out which is a worry. When morale among supporters ought to be at a near all-time high, it’s nowhere near. They simply could not contemplate this and pinned it largely on supporters. The line about communication being subjective was naive too. It’s universally accepted it wasn’t good enough. I don’t expect radical improvements based off their message.

- The excuse for a lack of a fans forum last year was excused due to being busy, sacking KR, recruiting, LM, losing LM and then the stadium. For me, that’s not a sufficient reason. To dedicate two hours inside 365 days around going’s on in a League One football club outside of normal operating hours is simply not a reasonable enough excuse.

- Adam Benson clearly has the capacity to alienate people. Perhaps I read him wrong, however intuition suggests to me he’s stubborn. It also didn’t reflect well when the gentleman mentioned how much he’d raised (who he’d put a stop to and didn’t applaud). Not a good look.

- Grant is very good at covering for Tim’s lack of diplomacy. On a number of occasions Grant simplified and gave more clarity on a previous answer that Tim had given/butchered. On one occasion Tim snapped very easily at a question around company accounts and what those losses would look like, which he should have breezed.

- Despite the importance of the forum and the time constraints, in typical OUFC fashion, top marks to the guy who asked the final question of the evening with much more important issues yet to be raised… Why wasn’t Des giving the fans a nice wave at the end of each game followed by a request for more inventive half time entertainment. Classic.

Couldn't agree more. He seems to forget that without the fans there would be no club. It's the fans that are at the heart of the club.

 

[Maurice Earp]

Out of interest, what was it tonight that reinforced this for you?

I thought that he was pretty fair tonight and spoke to him before and after the forum and my opinion is that he is listening and things will get better. I don't think he has got everything right, far from it. The same applies to all of the SLT at various points. But this forum has been a wake up call for the club and I think we should judge them on what they do differently as a result.

I do think that Michael North deserved a better answer to the question he asked, and better treatment regarding the work he and others have done for many years, and that will be followed up. However, his question was fumbled by Jim Goddard saying how great his job was and Grant talking about everyone being very busy. In fairness to Adam, he was not given the opportunity to address the key issue and provide an answer.

Totally agree with this point.

 

[uptheus]

Totally agree with this point.

I get the feeling this will get addressed, if not it’ll be an own goal by the club which we could well do without them!! own goal that is!

 

[uptheus]

I think it is imperative that another fans forum with the SLT is held shortly after a decision has been made on the planning application. At this stage more should be known about how the stadium will be funded, the legal framework between club-owners-investors, and the accounts will have been published. We can't leave it until next March / April.

Totally agree. I wonder if it would be possible to dedicate a section (30mins) of the September fans forum which is suppose to be about the footballing side, to cover the latest stadium status, especially if we get the go ahead in June/July, plus further update on bridge situation etc. Would be a great way to engage the fans both on and off the pitch.

 

[Yellow River]

In fairness Tim was correct in his opening (somewhat boring) monologue, in that the supporters were there out of their own free will and travelling expense. Whereas those sat at the high table were paid to be there.

It’s worth remembering that fact.

Tim, Adam, Grant et al are all paid to communicate with the supporters, it’s part of their job.

 

[Yellow River]

It was very clear that they do read this place.

(As @RyanioBirdio has previously stated)

Do Tim and Adam each have their own individual ‘little black book’ of regular posters on YF?

Each poster has A,B,C,D, E or F next to their name depending on whether they are seen as;

(A) Barking Mad.
(B) An irritant.
(C) Glass half empty type.
(C) Cautiously Neutral.
(D) Glass half full type.
(E) A Happy Clapper.
(F) A useful Idiot.

 

[Berliner]

Do Tim and Adam each have their own individual ‘little black book’ of regular posters on YF?

Each poster has A,B,C,D, E or F next to their name depending on whether they are seen as;

(A) Barking Mad.
(B) An irritant.
(C) Glass half empty type.
(C) Cautiously Neutral.
(D) Glass half full type.
(E) A Happy Clapper.
(F) A useful Idiot.

Everyone A and B then?

 

[m]

Do Tim and Adam each have their own individual ‘little black book’ of regular posters on YF?

Each poster has A,B,C,D, E or F next to their name depending on whether they are seen as;

(A) Barking Mad.
(B) An irritant.
(C) Glass half empty type.
(C) Cautiously Neutral.
(D) Glass half full type.
(E) A Happy Clapper.
(F) A useful Idiot.

How will people know which (C) I am?

(It's the 2nd)

 

[BicesterU]

*Dons steel helmet*

I found myself agreeing with TW about comms. Is it the *amount* that matters, or the quality - what he called meaningfulness?

It's also easy to forget that comms is myriad. I was stunned to hear that we only sell 600 programmes per game. Can that really be right? And if it is right, does it justify the time and effort it must demand each week from OUFC employees who - as I think we'd all agree - must have other ways to spend their time?

I would hate to see the programme go, but likewise it's easy enough to understand why online channels with many times the number of followers might be prioritised.

It's also obvious from reading this forum that there's no consensus about what 'good comms' actually is. It's a classic case of being able to please some of the people some of the time, etc...

However, it's obviously good news that TW was talking about monthly Q&As and it'll be interesting to see how the new SLO implements parts of the Fan Engagement Strategy.

 

[Common Villager]

*Dons steel helmet*

I found myself agreeing with TW about comms. Is it the *amount* that matters, or the quality - what he called meaningfulness?

It's also easy to forget that comms is myriad. I was stunned to hear that we only sell 600 programmes per game. Can that really be right? And if it is right, does it justify the time and effort it must demand each week from OUFC employees who - as I think we'd all agree - must have other ways to spend their time?

I would hate to see the programme go, but likewise it's easy enough to understand why online channels with many times the number of followers might be prioritised.

It's also obvious from reading this forum that there's no consensus about what 'good comms' actually is. It's a classic case of being able to please some of the people some of the time, etc...

However, it's obviously good news that TW was talking about monthly Q&As and it'll be interesting to see how the new SLO implements parts of the Fan Engagement Strategy.

I agree with the quality over quantity aspect of Tim's argument, but he backed this up by saying something along the lines of 'what's the point in communicating if I have nothing to say?'. Sometimes nothing is better than nothing. A good example of this would be the delayed submission of the planning application. All he needed to do was come out and explain the reason for the delays (e.g. we want to ensure we've met every single one of the council's requirements in full and this requires an extra few weeks/months of preparation) and most fans would've felt much more comfortable about the situation. Instead they said nothing for weeks after the previously reported pre-Christmas deadline, which resulted in concerns and rumours spreading.

Quality communication is proactive and open, not just an opportunity to share good news.

 

[BicesterU]

I agree with the quality over quantity aspect of Tim's argument, but he backed this up by saying something along the lines of 'what's the point in communicating if I have nothing to say?'. Sometimes nothing is better than nothing. A good example of this would be the delayed submission of the planning application. All he needed to do was come out and explain the reason for the delays (e.g. we want to ensure we've met every single one of the council's requirements in full and this requires an extra few weeks/months of preparation) and most fans would've felt much more comfortable about the situation. Instead they said nothing for weeks after the previously reported pre-Christmas deadline, which resulted in concerns and rumours spreading.

Quality communication is proactive and open, not just an opportunity to share good news.

Completely agree. That kind of 'nothing to say, but here's why' communication also helps improve confidence among the fan base and prevents a vacuum being created that some people are keen to fil with their own theories.

 

[ZeroTheHero]

I found myself agreeing with TW about comms. Is it the *amount* that matters, or the quality - what he called meaningfulness?

It also depends on the medium and what you mean by 'comms'.

Would I want an email a day with a few bits of meaningless, if slightly amusing, stuff in it? No I wouldn't.
Is it very different if that same content is posted on the Artist Formerly Known As Twitter? Yes it is - it isn't invasive, and helps to 'build a brand'.

As someone who subscribes to iFollow, I used to really quite enjoy the pre-match shows on the site. It gave a bit of background, maybe had a couple of silly challenges and was perhaps slightly amateur in an endearing way. You got to see the players in a different light, and the fact that CW and MB are actually supporters (not just employees) really shone through. It helped me get in the mood for the game at the end of the week. Meaningless? Possibly. Did it help to build a sense of being a bit of a club insider and part of the whole thing? Certainly.

The same can be said of the five minutes fans forums. Were they ever a revelation? Not really, but they were a point of contact. If I talk to a friend, I don't always need to have something major to say - of course the club isn't my 'friend' but it needs to be more like that than a grey corporate entity. I want to hear the human faces and voices of those behind the scenes.

The comms I get at the moment is a weekly email (it usually does little other than rehash/point to website content and try to sell me stuff). There is little to get 'involved' with.

 

[Common Villager]

No mention of Mr Benson???

I don't really know what to make of him. He's Head of Commercial, so regardless of how you dress it up, his primary concern is going to be maximising revenue and profit.

I have a bigger issue with Tim, to be honest. He's CEO, his job is to create a vision for and set the tone of the club. The vision he's created is Top-30 club and the tone he's set is customer-not-fan. Benson has been brought in to help deliver that vision, and the way he's approaching that is unsurprising given his boss' numbers over people approach.

I just keep coming back to the fact I don't think Tim is a good CEO. He's undoubtedly an intelligent guy, was probably an excellent accountant, but he just doesn't seem to get people.