General Commercial and Marketing

[Yellow River]

It‘s not that long ago that Sue Trafford and Michael North were worthy nominees for the Oxvox Supporter of the year awards….

 

[Colin B]

I have touched on good stewardship/ownership, how it works, what it looks like, and what it can achieve in my piece for the Bolton Fans View. It's very relevant to this exact situation and the comments that are being made, and references how Bolton's owners are doing things right.

I'm not sure when @Paul B will publish it, as I know he's got a lot on at the moment, but have a read when it's out. In fact, the likes of Adam Benson and Tim Williams should have a read too, they might learn something about supporter relationships.

 

[Essexyellows]

I really dont think there is a credible 'other side' to the story... Sue Trafford and Michael North have been selling current, and pre-loved, club merchandise plus programmes ( matchday and collectables) for many years, raising funds for the clubs own Community Trust charity.
I was told very reliably, that the club has stopped them selling items and raising much needed funds for OUFCs own community trust due to some of the merchandise on offer not being compatible with the clubs brand. Which in my opinion is utter bollox - Old/ preloved OUFC shirts , they were Club items, as were other donated items, are old football programmes ( many of them old OUFC programmes) not club items, produced by the cub?

Driving a(another) wedge between supporters and the club this is- when IS the promised Fans Forum

oh wait a moment the same people who've stopped the clubs charity raising funds have stiched up the supporters by watering down FFs and creating another bollox quango

Don`t let me say "I told you so" but that was the purpose, water down OxVox then create a "democratic board" where the Club hold 4 votes and the supporters 2. Ergo we don`t need those tricky face to face FF`s we`ve got those filters to voice our thoughts through.

Interesting comment. Are you saying that it could be that OxVox are worried about upsetting the owners due to the new stadium?

While I understand that in a way, it doesn’t mean they should sit back and let the club rip the heart out of the club.
The last time an owner/club hierarchy tried to ‘push around’ the fans we lost the ultras.

It's tricky to be truly independent when one has one's finger in the stadium pie.

Maybe the Chair of @OxVox would like to clarify that particular/alleged conflict of interest?

 

[Scotchegg]

Don`t let me say "I told you so"

Whilst saying exactly that at every possible opportunity!

 

[Wandering Yellow]

I am disappointed that I've heard some of the lads who want to wave flags can be victim of overzealous stewarding at Grenoble Rd too. We are really up against it playing at the Sewege farm with three stands without these anti-fan measures.

Looking forward to reading @Paul B fan view and I hope at least someone at the club does read and take note.

 

[Paul P]

Don`t let me say "I told you so" but that was the purpose, water down OxVox then create a "democratic board" where the Club hold 4 votes and the supporters 2. Ergo we don`t need those tricky face to face FF`s we`ve got those filters to voice our thoughts through.


It's tricky to be truly independent when one has one's finger in the stadium pie.

Maybe the Chair of @OxVox would like to clarify that particular/alleged conflict of interest?

Hi all

I have repeatedly stressed that the easiest way to get an answer from OxVox or myself is to email us. It is almost impossible to monitor everything on here then answer questions here too. I sadly don’t really have the time to go on the Forum much any more. I was however pointed here when someone noticed your post @Essexyellows . I’m at a bit of a loss as to what you are asking for but it seems like a strangely vague insinuation by I think @RyanioBirdio was then repeated by @Manorlounger and hence by rule of social media has become a fact that demands an answer?

I have ‘fingers in lots of pies’? I have business interests that affect my neutrality? The OxVox committee does? We are somehow using our position to champion a new ground, not for all the positive benefits it brings our club, but for personal gain?

Perhaps if you guys get your heads together and decide what is being insinuated then we can answer it? Until that is done I will say this. Neither I, nor to the very best of my knowledge, anyone else on the committee has even the slightest to gain from the stadium project other than knowing it is for the benefit of the club we love. In fact the whole process is an expense in both personal time and money to us and i'm sorry but I won’t sit back and let hard working people on the committee be slandered with idle gossip.

While I am here I will quickly address another couple of points. Just because we do not shout all confrontation from the roof tops and because we are mindful of the stadium project, does not mean we are not challenging the club on a number of issues. We have been speaking to the club about the issue with Micheal and Sue for months now and while we have made some progress, we intend to do more. We have a meeting with Adam Benson in the coming weeks where that, fans forums and the new supporters board will be discussed. As of yet we have had no communication about it so remain open minded but we would have serious questions as to the need for another group that may have no real power and could be used to lessen the voice of independent supporters groups. As was mentioned in the last update, we will report back in full after the meeting with Adam Benson.

Apologies for the long post, but sometimes these things need to be addressed.

Paul

 

[Steve Gilbert]

Hi all

I have repeatedly stressed that the easiest way to get an answer from OxVox or myself is to email us. It is almost impossible to monitor everything on here then answer questions here too. I sadly don’t really have the time to go on the Forum much any more. I was however pointed here when someone noticed your post @Essexyellows . I’m at a bit of a loss as to what you are asking for but it seems like a strangely vague insinuation by I think @RyanioBirdio was then repeated by @Manorlounger and hence by rule of social media has become a fact that demands an answer?

I have ‘fingers in lots of pies’? I have business interests that affect my neutrality? The OxVox committee does? We are somehow using our position to champion a new ground, not for all the positive benefits it brings our club, but for personal gain?

Perhaps if you guys get your heads together and decide what is being insinuated then we can answer it? Until that is done I will say this. Neither I, nor to the very best of my knowledge, anyone else on the committee has even the slightest to gain from the stadium project other than knowing it is for the benefit of the club we love. In fact the whole process is an expense in both personal time and money to us and i'm sorry but I won’t sit back and let hard working people on the committee be slandered with idle gossip.

While I am here I will quickly address another couple of points. Just because we do not shout all confrontation from the roof tops and because we are mindful of the stadium project, does not mean we are not challenging the club on a number of issues. We have been speaking to the club about the issue with Micheal and Sue for months now and while we have made some progress, but we intend to do more. We have a meeting with Adam Benson in the coming weeks where that, fans forums and the new supporters board will be discussed. As of yet we have had no communication about it so remain open minded but we would have serious questions as to the need for another group that may have no real power and could be used to lessen the voice of independent supporters groups. As was mentioned in the last update, we will report back in full after the meeting with Adam Benson.

Apologies for the long post, but sometimes these things need to be addressed.

Paul

Thanks for the update Paul, not sure the tone of the post is really needed considering how quiet OxVox have been over certain matters but it is appreciated all the same.

You say you have been in talks with the club for months about the situation about Michael and Sue yet no one knows that until now. Could OxVox not have come out and said they were aware of the matter and it was being discussed? That straight away would have damped some of the recent unhappiness amongst the supporters.

You also mention that you don’t have much time to come onto the forum these days, again, that’s fair enough as I am sure you have plenty of other stuff to do. Having said that, as the 1 and only forum for the football club and the amount of discussion there is about all matters of the club, on a daily basis (more so than any other social media platform) it might be wise for someone from OxVox keeping an eye on things because then we don’t get into a situation where things are said, taken out of context, and then run as facts.

Again, appreciate the update but the tone of it is unnecessary considering how quiet and distant the supporters group have been for far too long now.

 

[Paul Cannell]

Whilst saying exactly that at every possible opportunity!

He did tell you so, though. didn't he?

 

[Scotchegg]

Thanks for the update Paul, not sure the tone of the post is really needed considering how quiet OxVox have been over certain matters but it is appreciated all the same.

You say you have been in talks with the club for months about the situation about Michael and Sue yet no one knows that until now. Could OxVox not have come out and said they were aware of the matter and it was being discussed? That straight away would have damped some of the recent unhappiness amongst the supporters.

You also mention that you don’t have much time to come onto the forum these days, again, that’s fair enough as I am sure you have plenty of other stuff to do. Having said that, as the 1 and only forum for the football club and the amount of discussion there is about all matters of the club, on a daily basis (more so than any other social media platform) it might be wise for someone from OxVox keeping an eye on things because then we don’t get into a situation where things are said, taken out of context, and then run as facts.

Again, appreciate the update but the tone of it is unnecessary considering how quiet and distant the supporters group have been for far too long now.

The suggestion was that members of OxVox and/or OUSP were too close to the club for some kind of personal gain. No one has actually said who or what this is, but mud sticks. I think it is not unreasonable for people being labelled in such a way to counter those allegations.

As someone who has given up my very valuable time to try to do something for the betterment of the club that I care for, it is tiring to hear the same few voices dismiss the work that I and others do. But that was something that I expected beforehand, and most doesn't warrant a response.

However, attack my personal or professional integrity and I will respond in a tone significant worse that anything Paul has used.

As much as I enjoy reading, posting and engaging with others on this forum, this only represents a small proportion of our fan base. I would estimate that 90% of those that reach out to OUSP do not post on here or other social media sites. The vast majority of these are extremely grateful to have an avenue to raise concerns or get additional guidance and support. Due to the individual nature of these engagements, they are rarely shared and therefore there is an assumption that OUSP are irrelevant.
Regular newsletters are provided, along with the minutes of all meetings. It is not always appropriate or possible to respond to everything on here, and both OUSP and OxVox have always advised people to contact them directly rather than posting on here.

There will always be those who are willing and able to contact the club directly, or those who have other avenues to address concerns. Of course there will also be many that have no concerns and are just happy to support the club in their way. But for some, OUSP are a valuable asset and don't deserve the disdain that a couple of individuals constantly give out.

I don't speak for the Supporters Panel collectively, these are my views alone. Equally, I don't speak for OxVox or any individuals associated with them. But I do think that everyone has the right to defend themselves against comments that are personal, especially if there are no foundations for these comments.

 

[Colin B]

Hi all

I have repeatedly stressed that the easiest way to get an answer from OxVox or myself is to email us. It is almost impossible to monitor everything on here then answer questions here too. I sadly don’t really have the time to go on the Forum much any more. I was however pointed here when someone noticed your post @Essexyellows . I’m at a bit of a loss as to what you are asking for but it seems like a strangely vague insinuation by I think @RyanioBirdio was then repeated by @Manorlounger and hence by rule of social media has become a fact that demands an answer?

I have ‘fingers in lots of pies’? I have business interests that affect my neutrality? The OxVox committee does? We are somehow using our position to champion a new ground, not for all the positive benefits it brings our club, but for personal gain?

Perhaps if you guys get your heads together and decide what is being insinuated then we can answer it? Until that is done I will say this. Neither I, nor to the very best of my knowledge, anyone else on the committee has even the slightest to gain from the stadium project other than knowing it is for the benefit of the club we love. In fact the whole process is an expense in both personal time and money to us and i'm sorry but I won’t sit back and let hard working people on the committee be slandered with idle gossip.

While I am here I will quickly address another couple of points. Just because we do not shout all confrontation from the roof tops and because we are mindful of the stadium project, does not mean we are not challenging the club on a number of issues. We have been speaking to the club about the issue with Micheal and Sue for months now and while we have made some progress, we intend to do more. We have a meeting with Adam Benson in the coming weeks where that, fans forums and the new supporters board will be discussed. As of yet we have had no communication about it so remain open minded but we would have serious questions as to the need for another group that may have no real power and could be used to lessen the voice of independent supporters groups. As was mentioned in the last update, we will report back in full after the meeting with Adam Benson.

Apologies for the long post, but sometimes these things need to be addressed.

Paul

Irrespective of the broader discussion here, I find the fact that the Chairman of the Supporters' Trust claims that he doesn't read the only fans' message board for Oxford United fans quite astonishing.

It is the easiest way to gauge the opinion of many of the people you represent, all in one place, and for that reason should not be ignored, and dismissed, just because you're "busy"

How can you accurately expect to represent those fans, if you ignore one of their main mediums?

 

[ECYellow]

Out of interest, what tangible positive impact has the OUSP had since its formation?

OxVox have been terrific for the football club for decades and remain an important voice, but I’d be interested to know what benefit the OUSP actually offer, outside of being a mouth piece that is essentially little more than a token gesture ‘engagement’ with supporters.

 

[Paul Cannell]

He could tell you. But then he'd have to bang you up.

 

[Sarge]

Firstly IMO - both @OxVox & @OUSP Secretary put time and effort into representing supporters views as volunteers , time I don't have to spare, and it is appreciated too. That said, when either supporters group raise issues, frequently it appears that the admin section of the club really don't seem to take issues raised on behalf of supporters as seriously as they ought to, responses reported back come across frequently as being fobbed off at best, as if issues have been heard and subsequently ignored.

'WE' are more than overdue for a full and open Fans Forum- promised by the same two individuals in high places who assured at the Shareholders AGM that communication would improve this season. It has not.

The recent proclaimed announcement that the club were setting up yet another unelected hand picked quango as another layer between supporters and club, along with the intention to water down Fans Forums is absolutely NOT acceptable. Both @OxVox and @OUSP Secretary should, IMO oppose both the quango and watered down approach to Fans Forums vehemently.

The sad, sorry and frankly disgraceful treatment of Sue Trafford and Michael North by the club , is IMO totally wrong and very possibly the proverbial staw that has broken the camels back. Certainly it seems to demonstrate how the club really see and value supporters and supporters views.

Top 30 club?, Improve the matchday experience? improve communication? we've been fed that bullshit, and it certainly appears to be utter B*****s . It doesn't seem that the club value supporters or supporters groups in any way to me, the club are talking loud yet saying and doing less than nothing. Wrong, wrong, wrong

I call on @OxVox and @OUSP Secretary to press the club for a full. open Fans Forum ( as was promised) at the earliest opportunity

 

[LowerSouth]

Thanks for the update Paul, not sure the tone of the post is really needed considering how quiet OxVox have been over certain matters but it is appreciated all the same.

You say you have been in talks with the club for months about the situation about Michael and Sue yet no one knows that until now. Could OxVox not have come out and said they were aware of the matter and it was being discussed? That straight away would have damped some of the recent unhappiness amongst the supporters.

You also mention that you don’t have much time to come onto the forum these days, again, that’s fair enough as I am sure you have plenty of other stuff to do. Having said that, as the 1 and only forum for the football club and the amount of discussion there is about all matters of the club, on a daily basis (more so than any other social media platform) it might be wise for someone from OxVox keeping an eye on things because then we don’t get into a situation where things are said, taken out of context, and then run as facts.

Again, appreciate the update but the tone of it is unnecessary considering how quiet and distant the supporters group have been for far too long now.

I tend to agree that OxVox should be aware of feelings expressed on this forum and feel that it was a mistake not to assign someone to monitor and highlight any concerns raised regarding the governance and lack of fan interaction of the club.
I cannot however agree on “ how quiet and distant the supporters group have been for too long now”
Stadium,stadium, stadium has obviously been the priority.
In recent months and in particular since OCC announced that the Triangle had, subject to conditions,being recommended as an alternative site to SB, OxVox have been largely, but not exclusively ,devoting there time to gaining support for that proposal.
Starting with raising awareness and appealing for helpers to assist with the campaign to leaflet drop , which took place on May 1st,ahead of the Kidlington PC poll on 10/05/23 and ahead of the initial consultancy meetings in late May and early June.
In June/July they were actively involved in raising awareness and the importance of participating In the OCC survey ( as was this site ).
This was followed up by info’ card drops before games at our home games .
In September OCC Cabinet meeting became the main topic and we were all encouraged to lobby the cabinet members( again this forum was also very pro-active ).
In late September, the “Three Point Pledge “ campaign was launched, encouraging supporters to indicate there intended means of travel to the proposed new stadium.
Similarly awareness was raised regarding the stadium exhibition at the Hilton Hotel, Peartree.
In April, representations were made regarding outstanding questions and concerns raised by supporters and holding of a fans forum .
I’m not privy to any further communications with the club regarding this matter.
They have also reported on various other matters- see the OxVox newsletters sent in every month this year ( barring October ?).

 

[Trevor L]

Irrespective of the broader discussion here, I find the fact that the Chairman of the Supporters' Trust claims that he doesn't read the only fans' message board for Oxford United fans quite astonishing.

It is the easiest way to gauge the opinion of many of the people you represent, all in one place, and for that reason should not be ignored, and dismissed, just because you're "busy"

How can you accurately expect to represent those fans, if you ignore one of their main mediums?

Sorry Colin, but I think that's really unfair. Paul didn't say he doesn't read the forum, simply that he didn't read it much any more. It was a plea for fans to contact us directly with questions etc, as many do. You're misrepresenting what he wrote. But more to the point, there are several of us from OxVox on here quite regularly - myself and @Maurice Earp probably being the most obvious.

We're very aware of the strength of feeling on the issues raised on this thread - forums, which we have continually called for; maintenance of the incredibly successful stalls run by Michael, Sue and colleagues; and this, what shall I say, curious advisory board proposal, about which we know diddly squat. As Paul has written, we've had many challenging discussions with the club - don't mistake the lack of a blow by blow account for a reluctance to engage on behalf of fans.

 

[tatabanya]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1729638447512424561

The only brand the club is building is one who doesn’t treat loyal fans with basic respect

 

[TailsWeWin]

Comes back to the mindset of the club viewing and treating supporters as customers.

I don’t think they’re even very good at that.
Every home match at half time I’m reminded of the disdain with which we are treated as “customers “. Absolutely filthy toilets, no hot water and soap to wash your hands, then not even any sort of receptacle to put the dirty used paper towel in. Just a pile on the floor to add to.
A small thing, maybe, but symptomatic of the attitude of the club towards its supporters.
I don’t know of ANY other organisation/business/company that would allow that stinking mess on their premises for their visitors.
Paul P : do you?

 

[Steve Gilbert]

@Scotchegg firstly I take my hat off to every one of you that give up free time to represent the fans and I have to say that the OUSP have been constantly visible on this forum and on twitter engage well with the fan base but I do feel there are issues that arise that come under the umbrella of OxVox due to the make up of the panel.
As for Paul defending himself, again he has every right to but I feel he could have worded it a bit better and to almost dismiss this forum as he doesn’t have time to check it doesn’t come across very well IMO.

@LowerSouth again I agree that OxVox have been excellent when it comes to the new stadium project and have done some excellent things so far in getting fans to engage with the process. I do feel though that by dedicating so much time into this they have neglected a lot of issues, this has caused the club to take advantage and used it to get away with some things such as: promising a fans forum before the end of last season and then not delivering, the promise of better communication and not delivering, the promise of a better match experience and not delivering it, the shambles that was the pre season stadium clean which the club seemed to go with the easy option and blame the landlord, the lack of communication surrounding the cup ticketing issues with ST holders not having their seats reserved and now the clubs disregard to their fan base and especially 2 very loyal, long standing supporters.
Yes, Paul has said they were aware of this but certain things need communicating earlier than they are and that is where I do have an issue with OxVox as communication has dwindled in recent times when it comes to stuff that isn’t stadium related.

The club are taking the P**s out of us as a fan base and OxVox are there to stand up to them and by keeping quiet really doesn’t help anyone.

 

[Chris on a Bike]

Irrespective of the broader discussion here, I find the fact that the Chairman of the Supporters' Trust claims that he doesn't read the only fans' message board for Oxford United fans quite astonishing.

It is the easiest way to gauge the opinion of many of the people you represent, all in one place, and for that reason should not be ignored, and dismissed, just because you're "busy"

How can you accurately expect to represent those fans, if you ignore one of their main mediums?

Christ on a bike! He's already explained he's extremely busy dealing with all manner of things so how can you expect him to be on here all the time reading the same repetitive moaning from a small group of moaners going over the same ground every day? Just send him(them) an email if you're suitably bothered and then he (they) only have to read it once rather than through different threads on here?

 

[Chris on a Bike]

It‘s not that long ago that Sue Trafford and Michael North were worthy nominees for the Oxvox Supporter of the year awards….

Very worthy nominees.

I really dont think there is a credible 'other side' to the story... Sue Trafford and Michael North have been selling current, and pre-loved, club merchandise plus programmes ( matchday and collectables) for many years, raising funds for the clubs own Community Trust charity.
I was told very reliably, that the club has stopped them selling items and raising much needed funds for OUFCs own community trust due to some of the merchandise on offer not being compatible with the clubs brand. Which in my opinion is utter bollox - Old/ preloved OUFC shirts , they were Club items, as were other donated items, are old football programmes ( many of them old OUFC programmes) not club items, produced by the cub?

Driving a(another) wedge between supporters and the club this is- when IS the promised Fans Forum

oh wait a moment the same people who've stopped the clubs charity raising funds have stiched up the supporters by watering down FFs and creating another bollox quango

Christ on a bike! I suppose Sue and Michael are easy targets - what's he going to do about the old stuff that appears on ebay?

I've heard of another situation where, following Manning's departure, Benson stopped the sale of match programmes for the cup game against Chelsea U21 in a fit of pique because it contained notes from the ex manager, and he subsequently refused to sell any copies to local 'mega' collectors who were desperate for a copy. The problem is a box had already been passed to Chelsea for their fans and guess what - they appeared on ebay at 50 quid a copy with no benefit to OUFC of any kind!