Transfer News Transfer targets summer 2019

[Grumpy Git]

Thorne might be a class act when fit, but so were Holmes and Curruthers.
We can’t afford to keep carrying crocks.

 

[greatunclekip]

Agreed. Striker is everything.

 

[bazzer9461]

who did the tackle to cause it? really sad for him

Naismith

 

[FatOldSun]

I'd go bananas if we signed him.

I'll get mt coat...

I hope you have an umbrella, someone's already run off with your coat.

 

[horseman]

Did we have our trousers pulled down when getting Elliott Moore? How about Ben Woodburn? Alex Gorrin Rodriguez? Did things drag on with Tariqe Fosu? Anthony Forde?

It's easy to throw emotive statements out, but they look pretty stupid when the facts show otherwise.

were 2 of those not suddenly offered deals so we had to pay a few quid ?

i prefer to give an "opinion" as i see things at the time and there's no getting away from the fact that for all the whyte is going nowhere, that deal was concluded rather quickly don't you think? yet our alleged targets seem to attract complications and i stick by my opinion that if players Agents other clubs are taking the proverbial then we should walk away.. Again my Opinion is that a player who turned his back on us before is along with his club showing signs of doing so again and i don't believe they're doing so because of some photo.

 

[Neville60]

He might be wondering where the money's coming from. Or who the debt will be due to.

Maybe a few Bury supporters wish they'd been asking more questions as they galloped towards promotion.

Questions aren't bad.

I agree that questions aren't bad.

 

[Scotchegg]

were 2 of those not suddenly offered deals so we had to pay a few quid ?

i prefer to give an "opinion" as i see things at the time and there's no getting away from the fact that for all the whyte is going nowhere, that deal was concluded rather quickly don't you think? yet our alleged targets seem to attract complications and i stick by my opinion that if players Agents other clubs are taking the proverbial then we should walk away.. Again my Opinion is that a player who turned his back on us before is along with his club showing signs of doing so again and i don't believe they're doing so because of some photo.

Again very loose use of facts! Fosu and Agyei were both offered extended contracts but both before we enquired. That is the way clubs manage young players so that they are able to gain from the development compensation rules. This wasn't invented just to screw over Oxford!!

You use the Gavin Whyte deal as a bench mark for how deals should be done, but with all due respect, that's insane. Cardiff were the only club offering a deal at that time. After a little bit of bouncing between the clubs, they met our valuation and were allowed to speak with Gavin. They offered him a significantly increased deal in a higher league. Cardiff are a top end Championship/lower PL club. Their facilities are beyond anything we have. They were therefore able to get Gavin in, complete the medical, tie up all the contracts and conclude the transfer very quickly to everyone's satisfaction.

If you then look at someone like Matty Taylor. He has a year remaining on his deal at Bristol City at a wage much higher than we would offer. He had some interest from Charlton this summer and could attract more interest from the Championship in January. He would also attract interest from several sides in league one, not just Oxford. Most of these clubs would prefer to do a loan deal and share the wages. Bristol would rather not pay anything so would prefer a permanent transfer, or hold out for the largest contribution. Taylor is probably looking at the last big contract of his career and will want the best deal he can get. All of this takes lots of negotiations and that takes time. Agents play a part of course, but that's hardly a new thing or an issue for Oxford alone.

This is the way transfers often take place, and were it not for the photo on the Oxford Mail then most of this would be going on without any knowledge of any of us.

But the idea that we are having our pants pulled down, or that there are complications, or that the deal is dead, or there is something fundamentally wrong with our recruitment has not factual basis. You say that there is no getting away from the facts, but you are miles away from them to be honest!!! Just my "opinion"!

 

[Victor1986]

Very well put Scotchegg!

 

[Shosho]

I would be hesitant about getting Taylor in permanently. Is 29, like Scotchegg says - will want a hefty contract.

Do we want to plough big money into a short term asset? It hasn't really be our MO of late - although I accept we can't always sign youngsters with resale.

 

[LeftSideBoy]

I would be hesitant about getting Taylor in permanently. Is 29, like Scotchegg says - will want a hefty contract.

Do we want to plough big money into a short term asset? It hasn't really be our MO of late - although I accept we can't always sign youngsters with resale.

Why are people talking as though 29 is old and past it? He's at the prime of his career and a 3 year deal would make sense to all parties. If he left on a free at the end of that term, after banging in 20 goals to take us into the championship then so be it.

The financial reward from going up, far outweighs what we'd be paying him a week and as he is a proven goalscorer at this level, the risk/reward is definitely favourable, in my opinion.

 

[battman]

Why are people talking as though 29 is old and past it? He's at the prime of his career and a 3 year deal would make sense to all parties. If he left on a free at the end of that term, after banging in 20 goals to take us into the championship then so be it.

The financial reward from going up, far outweighs what we'd be paying him a week and as he is a proven goalscorer at this level, the risk/reward is definitely favourable, in my opinion.

Yeah, I think the occasional purchase of a player with little resale value is allowable, especially considering a good portion of the squad (Dickie, Moore, Brannagan, Sykes, Agyei to name a few) do.

 

[Shosho]

Why are people talking as though 29 is old and past it? He's at the prime of his career and a 3 year deal would make sense to all parties. If he left on a free at the end of that term, after banging in 20 goals to take us into the championship then so be it.

The financial reward from going up, far outweighs what we'd be paying him a week and as he is a proven goalscorer at this level, the risk/reward is definitely favourable, in my opinion.

29 generally is on the wrong side of the age curve - signing someone this age...fine. Going big on the budget and sinking big money into it maybe isn't so clever.

All depends on the £££. I would welcome Taylor joining (any striker with calibre (Baldock!)) but it requires a little bit of nuance rather than just throwing down a big expensive contract to get him in.

 

[mooro]

Were the other targets spotted in conversation with Robinson ?

Sorry but a football manager having a conversation with a much sought after striker - possible filling a position that has been a millstone around our neck for 18 months - in the tunnel in full glare of the media is absolutely newsworthy.

The Oxford Mail were 100% within their rights to report this. They wouldn’t be doing their job if they didn’t jump all over it. The whole idea of news/media outlets is to report stuff that we, the general public, are not privy to.

My issue (as with some others it appears) is not necessarily that the OM decided to 'do their job' and publish the picture and report the story, but that in doing so, they have acted out of step compared to their coverage (or not) of a number of other players who have/have not been linked to the club, have/have not been at a game, etc etc.
Why publish this one and not others?
Level 1 conspriacy theory - It could almost be that they knew that they could drag up the 'handshake' history in order to get supporters arguing with each other about whether we should have him back - ie. generating comments on their website
Level 2 conspiracy theory - that they knew that it could put a spanner in the works in terms of annoying Bristol City to the extent that it might put them off.
Level 3 - someone at the OM doesn't want him back, so is actively trying to scupper the move.....
...though most likely - Level 0, they forgot to edit that photo out of the gallery before they uploaded the lot as they just wanted to go to the pub

 

[LeftSideBoy]

29 generally is on the wrong side of the age curve - signing someone this age...fine. Going big on the budget and sinking big money into it maybe isn't so clever.

All depends on the £££. I would welcome Taylor joining (any striker with calibre (Baldock!)) but it requires a little bit of nuance rather than just throwing down a big expensive contract to get him in.

Generally speaking, yes. However, we're not speaking generally here, we're talking specifically about Matty Taylor and over the last 2/3 seasons, he has definitely proven his worth. I do however agree that we still need to remain savvy to ensure we are getting the best deal for the club and I trust our recruitment team to do just that.

As you say, it depends on the money involved and as @battman rightly pointed out, we have a squad of players that will generate a lot of money for the club in the next 2/3 seasons. Personally, I would urge the club to get this one over the line. If we are serious about going up, this is the kind of gamble that we must be willing to take.

 

[horseman]

Again very loose use of facts! Fosu and Agyei were both offered extended contracts but both before we enquired. That is the way clubs manage young players so that they are able to gain from the development compensation rules. This wasn't invented just to screw over Oxford!!

You use the Gavin Whyte deal as a bench mark for how deals should be done, but with all due respect, that's insane. Cardiff were the only club offering a deal at that time. After a little bit of bouncing between the clubs, they met our valuation and were allowed to speak with Gavin. They offered him a significantly increased deal in a higher league. Cardiff are a top end Championship/lower PL club. Their facilities are beyond anything we have. They were therefore able to get Gavin in, complete the medical, tie up all the contracts and conclude the transfer very quickly to everyone's satisfaction.

If you then look at someone like Matty Taylor. He has a year remaining on his deal at Bristol City at a wage much higher than we would offer. He had some interest from Charlton this summer and could attract more interest from the Championship in January. He would also attract interest from several sides in league one, not just Oxford. Most of these clubs would prefer to do a loan deal and share the wages. Bristol would rather not pay anything so would prefer a permanent transfer, or hold out for the largest contribution. Taylor is probably looking at the last big contract of his career and will want the best deal he can get. All of this takes lots of negotiations and that takes time. Agents play a part of course, but that's hardly a new thing or an issue for Oxford alone.

This is the way transfers often take place, and were it not for the photo on the Oxford Mail then most of this would be going on without any knowledge of any of us.

But the idea that we are having our pants pulled down, or that there are complications, or that the deal is dead, or there is something fundamentally wrong with our recruitment has not factual basis. You say that there is no getting away from the facts, but you are miles away from them to be honest!!! Just my "opinion"!

i am certainly not saying that the Whyte deal is how things should be done quite the opposite actually which has been my stance from the start and what difference did it make that Cardiff were the only club who made an offer for a player we stated was not going anywhere and 4m was the figure used to be sought to even think of starting a chat.

never said the deal was dead never even spoke about our recruitment i mentioned that i don't believe a deal would be pulled by Bristol because of a photo when imho it's about the money surprise surprise...if they were wanting to get him off the payroll i don't think seeing a photo would change their mind suddenly...

 

[Mystery Yellow]

I don't think we need Thorne. Plus he is an injury waiting to happen. I'd much rather we put the money into getting the much needed striker over the line. Then another winger.

KR keeps hanging on about getting another DCM in when talking about getting transfers in & I agree we don’t need one but I personally would look at someone like Josh McEachran who’s still hasn’t got a club as I think GT is to much of a risk

 

[tonyw]

The financial reward from going up, far outweighs what we'd be paying him a week and as he is a proven goalscorer at this level, the risk/reward is definitely favourable, in my opinion.

The financial reward from going up - if we played the following season with the same squad or at least the same wage bill - would be significant. Multiple millions.

But if we did that, we would probably have the smallest wage bill in the Championship by an absolute mile.
No - our fans would demand that we sign a bunch of Championship-level players to remain somewhat competitive, and we'd most likely lose more money in that league than we do in League One. Most Championship sides do. And most Championship sides have bigger stadia (which they own) and much bigger gates than we could even if we filled the Kasstad every week.

We should never trick ourselves into thinking that the Championship is a magic money tree, when history would suggest it's really a money pit.
And we should never put our financial future at risk to get ourselves there.
Now the Premier League on the other hand...…..

 

[LeftSideBoy]

The financial reward from going up - if we played the following season with the same squad or at least the same wage bill - would be significant. Multiple millions.

But if we did that, we would probably have the smallest wage bill in the Championship by an absolute mile.
No - our fans would demand that we sign a bunch of Championship-level players to remain somewhat competitive, and we'd most likely lose more money in that league than we do in League One. Most Championship sides do. And most Championship sides have bigger stadia (which they own) and much bigger gates than we could even if we filled the Kasstad every week.

We should never trick ourselves into thinking that the Championship is a magic money tree, when history would suggest it's really a money pit.
And we should never put our financial future at risk to get ourselves there.
Now the Premier League on the other hand...…..

I agree, we would be somewhat punching above our weight in areas but we have seen similar teams go on to achieve success beyond their expectations (Bournemouth being the prime example).

Lets look at the players that we
currently have that I believe could/will go for millions in the next 2/3 seasons, if they fulfill their potential:

Dickie
Brannagan
Sykes
Moore
Avgyei
Jones
Baptiste
Fosu

And there may be more, who knows?

Lets (for the sake of discussion) say that, on average, each of those players go for £3mil. That is £30mil in player sales. That is a huge amount of ROI from a group of players that cost, in total, 20% of their prospective re-sale value.

Would I expect a certain amount of loyalty from these players by sticking with us if we go up, for one season at least? Yes. Will we get that? Thats debatable. Would I mind selling players at a profit to keep the club competitive and sustainable at a higher level? Absolutely not.

My point is, we have valuable assets on the pitch. Our model is based on investing/nurturing and selling on at a proft and I believe this is the best way to go, until we own our own stadium (and maybe beyond).

Not many teams adopt this strategy due to having other revenue streams (complacency?) and I think that is why some, end up struggling.

 

[tonyw]

I agree, we would be somewhat punching above our weight in areas but we have seen similar teams go on to achieve success beyond their expectations (Bournemouth being the prime example).

Lets look at the players that we
currently have that I believe could/will go for millions in the next 2/3 seasons, if they fulfill their potential:

Dickie
Brannagan
Sykes
Moore
Avgyei
Jones
Baptiste
Fosu

And there may be more, who knows?

Lets (for the sake of discussion) say that, on average, each of those players go for £3mil. That is £30mil in player sales. That is a huge amount of ROI from a group of players that cost, in total, 20% of their prospective re-sale value.

Would I expect a certain amount of loyalty from these players by sticking with us if we go up, for one season at least? Yes. Will we get that? Thats debatable. Would I mind selling players at a profit to keep the club competitive and sustainable at a higher level? Absolutely not.

My point is, we have valuable assets on the pitch. Our model is based on investing/nurturing and selling on at a proft and I believe this is the best way to go, until we own our own stadium (and maybe beyond).

Not many teams adopt this strategy due to having other revenue streams (complacency?) and I think that is why some, end up struggling.

I agree 100%.

And that's why pushing the boat out financially to sign players like Matt Taylor and George Thorne is not something we should be doing now. 29 year olds and 26 year old crocks are not valuable assets.
(although if they'll come here on League One wages, or some sort of deal where their parent club is sharing their wages - great).

I had no problem with us paying a transfer fee for someone like Elliott Moore because if he works out, then he's going to be worth many times more than we paid for him.

 

[Scotchegg]

I agree 100%.

And that's why pushing the boat out financially to sign players like Matt Taylor and George Thorne is not something we should be doing now. 29 year olds and 26 year old crocks are not valuable assets.
(although if they'll come here on League One wages, or some sort of deal where their parent club is sharing their wages - great).

I had no problem with us paying a transfer fee for someone like Elliott Moore because if he works out, then he's going to be worth many times more than we paid for him.

It's still about getting the right balance. Look at what we get from the likes of Eastwood, Mous, Henry and Mackie despite knowing that we'll probably not get any resale returns. We've got more saleable assets than we've probably ever had, but their development and value will increase because of the oldies and crocks that you deride.