Conference Torquay United

[tonyw]

If you include Macclesfield as a conference side then I’d say you have to class Chester as the same.
Chester being my local side for the last 10 years, I have to say that their fans deserve to have non league football, they aren’t the nicest bunch of fans and are very entitled.

Macclesfield have played in the football league for a total of 17 seasons (having been founded in 1874)
Chester are not quite as old (founded 1885) but played in the football league for 74 seasons.

Think that's why old-timers (my age upwards!) will think of Chester as a football league club, but not Macc.


Also while I'm at it - Walsall should be in the all-time 3rd tier league. They've spent the most seasons (75!) of any club at that level, and it's not particularly close.

 

[Foley]

I'd like to think we could become a top 41 club but would struggle to be much more than a top 42 to top 44 club.
Staying in the Championship seems to rely on there being either very poor teams and/or clubs with severe financial problems.
However a new stadium bounce would hopefully boost crowds and team performance.

Not sure that has happened to Luton, Plymouth Huddersfield, Brentford, Milwall over recent seasons?

 

[cecantena]

Despite lazy journalism to the contrary, the Club is NOT IN ADMINISTRATION but has filed for protection in the court which will enable an initial seven day window which can be renewed by the Directors. So there is a window of opportunity here to stop the 10pt deduction, and transfer ownership, appoint a new Manager and push forward with the support of the fan base. Let's wish them well!

 

[holdsteady]

Ah, Kevin Toms - programming legend. Good Call. Here's a screenshot...

View attachment 17943

(I had to pick Man City to start the game, so replace them with Reading).

You can play the Spectrum version of Football Manager online here: https://torinak.com/qaop/play/manager

Cheers, that brings back memories, the bottom 5 smells of the old fourth division as well.

We can improve football by just going back to calling the divisions by the proper names rather than the silly ones we have now.

 

[Paul Cannell]

Ah, Kevin Toms - programming legend. Good Call. Here's a screenshot...

View attachment 17943

(I had to pick Man City to start the game, so replace them with Reading).

Reading was too easy for Turkey supporters to get to?

A proper division 4 replace 3 of the Southron teams with Barrow, Workington and Gatesheed.

 

[holdsteady]

Reading was too easy for Turkey supporters to get to?

A proper division 4 replace 3 of the Southron teams with Barrow, Workington and Gatesheed.

That’s more division 3 north isn’t it?

 

[Paul Cannell]

That’s more division 3 north isn’t it?

Not without Crook Town, Spennymoor and Bishop's Auckland it isn't.

 

[unification]

Sir, please may I enter the following name for your consideration:

Scunthorpe United

Division 2, or 3?

Fourth tier. Ignore their Andy Crosby-inspired run up to the second tier. Scunthorpe vs Hartlepool screams fourth tier.

I'd probably swap Huddersfield Town for Swansea City, and MK Dons for Walsall, if you are looking for 'typically third tier'

The latter definitely. As @tonyw has put it, Walsall have spent 75 years in tier three. Recency bias at them being so rubbish got in the way.

I'd also push Portsmouth up a tier and add Notts County to the third tier. Brentford v Notts County could only ever be a third tier league fixture.

 

[Wandering Yellow]

Walsall are a team I find hard to imagine in the Championship or non-league. A middling EFL club in the middle of the country. I've always thought supporting Walsall or Gillingham must be unbelievably depressing. The two most boring teams in the two most boring non-descript towns imaginable. Even boring kits and boring stadiums.

 

[holdsteady]

Not without Crook Town, Spennymoor and Bishop's Auckland it isn't.

I read a book about north east football years back and they were all in it, the far corner I think it was called, actually the author went round the same clubs years later in a second book which was a bit pointless as they are the sort of places where not much changes in twenty years, enjoyed reading them though.

 

[Paul Cannell]

I think the coal didn't do a lot for them. And urban sprawl has swallowed whole parts of Northumberland, as was; dunno about Durham as I didn't like to go that far south in me youth. I did see a youth international at South Shields tho, I think.

Those teams were quite strong back then, North Shields won the Vase and challenged for several years, Tow Law and of course Blyth - the only one that's really grown. Gateshead were in Div 3 North.

How the poor old north has declined.

 

[SteMerritt]

Walsall are a team I find hard to imagine in the Championship or non-league. A middling EFL club in the middle of the country. I've always thought supporting Walsall or Gillingham must be unbelievably depressing. The two most boring teams in the two most boring non-descript towns imaginable. Even boring kits and boring stadiums.

Well if you hadn't been so lazy and actually got born a few years earlier you would have seen them in the second tier. Wallsall 1 Oxford 5, with 4 from Richard Hill. I was there, not lazing about in 'pre-life'... Kids today!!!

 

[Wallop]

Well if you hadn't been so lazy and actually got born a few years earlier you would have seen them in the second tier. Wallsall 1 Oxford 5, with 4 from Richard Hill. I was there, not lazing about in 'pre-life'... Kids today!!!

I was there too, I think Walsall were rock bottom of the table and went ahead before we spanked them in the second half.

My first ever away game was there too in an earlier season with PRB scoring a winner in a top of the table clash and a certain John Aldridge making his debut (I think).

 

[Thomas/Brock/Jones]

I was there too, I think Walsall were rock bottom of the table and went ahead before we spanked them in the second half.

My first ever away game was there too in an earlier season with PRB scoring a winner in a top of the table clash and a certain John Aldridge making his debut (I think).

Steve Hardwick with a fabulous penalty save

 

[Marked Ox]

Confirmed that Torquay have been deducted 10 points:

National League Statement: Torquay United - The Vanarama National League

Torquay United have been deducted ten points from the 2023/24 National League South table after the club submitted its intention to appoint administrators.

www.thenationalleague.org.uk

Amazing they can get the full 10 points, unlike 'picked upon Everton' when they break the rules.

 

[Steve Gilbert]

Confirmed that Torquay have been deducted 10 points:

National League Statement: Torquay United - The Vanarama National League

Torquay United have been deducted ten points from the 2023/24 National League South table after the club submitted its intention to appoint administrators.

www.thenationalleague.org.uk

Amazing they can get the full 10 points, unlike 'picked upon Everton' when they break the rules.

To be fair going into administration is well known to carry a -10 point punishment.
Everton’s was the first of its kind, also it’s the premier league who do tend to just make it up as they go along. Just look at how Man City still aren’t having their 115 charges looked at until autumn NEXT year!

 

[Marked Ox]

To be fair going into administration is well known to carry a -10 point punishment.
Everton’s was the first of its kind, also it’s the premier league who do tend to just make it up as they go along. Just look at how Man City still aren’t having their 115 charges looked at until autumn NEXT year!

The PL gave them a 10 point deduction as per the rule. The independent appeals panel let them off of 4 points because of Everton's crying because they gave the wrong numbers 'honestly' which the original Disciplinary Committee found otherwise. Their Accountants (internal or external)should be sacked if the Everton ownership told them to produce honest original accounts and submitted what they did.

Everton then break the same rule again in the following period. I reckon they'll get let off the full 10 again, and probably at worst for them, get a small number like the 4 difference from the 1st penalty so not relegated.

It must amaze Everton and their ownership that Wolves stopped signing players they couldn't afford under the limits to stay within the rules.

The administration rule deduction as it now is also had to have a first time as well.

If you hadn't guessed, because of the blatant breaches (they after all accepted wrongdoing) I hope they get relegated as it may finally register with clubs that taking the P**s isn't acceptable.

If Man City have been proven to have broken the rules I hope they get taken to the cleaners as well.

Likewise we at Oxford can't complain if we were to break the rules. I didn't think much of Luton's crying about their points deductions back in the day either. And Reading can do one as well but likewise the EFL have gone soft on them because it isn't 'fair' yet they stopped others keeping a Championship spot just as Everton have with a PL place.

 

[Steve Gilbert]

The PL gave them a 10 point deduction as per the rule. The independent appeals panel let them off of 4 points because of Everton's crying because they gave the wrong numbers 'honestly' which the original Disciplinary Committee found otherwise. Their Accountants (internal or external)should be sacked if the Everton ownership told them to produce honest original accounts and submitted what they did.

Everton then break the same rule again in the following period. I reckon they'll get let off the full 10 again, and probably at worst for them, get a small number like the 4 difference from the 1st penalty so not relegated.

It must amaze Everton and their ownership that Wolves stopped signing players they couldn't afford under the limits to stay within the rules.

The administration rule deduction as it now is also had to have a first time as well.

If you hadn't guessed, because of the blatant breaches (they after all accepted wrongdoing) I hope they get relegated as it may finally register with clubs that taking the P**s isn't acceptable.

If Man City have been proven to have broken the rules I hope they get taken to the cleaners as well.

Likewise we at Oxford can't complain if we were to break the rules. I didn't think much of Luton's crying about their points deductions back in the day either. And Reading can do one as well but likewise the EFL have gone soft on them because it isn't 'fair' yet they stopped others keeping a Championship spot just as Everton have with a PL place.

Oh I do agree that the situation around Everton is a shambles and I can’t see why they should be let off again. Everton should have had this point deduction last season but they wanted to push it into this season and the PL let them. To then break the rules again they should have the whole 10 points deducted and it should be in this season too.

Nottingham Forest I am sure will also get a points deduction but there is a bit of a grey area as part of their losses was when they were in the EFL but even so, surely that just shows they over spent to get to the promised land.

As for Reading and Wigan, they deserve everything they get. They have over spent for years and don’t seem to learn.

 

[tonyw]

Nottingham Forest I am sure will also get a points deduction but there is a bit of a grey area as part of their losses was when they were in the EFL but even so, surely that just shows they over spent to get to the promised land.

Nottingham Forest are bringing out the Brennan Johnson defense.

Their claim is that they could have sold him in the previous fiscal year, and that would have brought them into compliance with FFP. But they got a much bigger fee by waiting until deadline day 2023. So it was to the financial benefit of the club to wait, even if it left them temporarily non-compliant. And surely the Premier League wouldn't want them to do something to their financial detriment just to line up with the rules?

Not sure it's the most convincing argument, but I bet it gets them only a small deduction.

 

[Marked Ox]

Nottingham Forest are bringing out the Brennan Johnson defense.

Their claim is that they could have sold him in the previous fiscal year, and that would have brought them into compliance with FFP. But they got a much bigger fee by waiting until deadline day 2023. So it was to the financial benefit of the club to wait, even if it left them temporarily non-compliant. And surely the Premier League wouldn't want them to do something to their financial detriment just to line up with the rules?

Not sure it's the most convincing argument, but I bet it gets them only a small deduction.

It definitely isn't a convincing argument, the rules are known, they should have sold others or not signed others. The precedent is set so at most they'll get 6 points.