National News The Brexit Thread 🇬🇧🇪🇺

[QR]

Well they won’t if they go and find work will they?
And yes I did think before I typed thank you very much

Take out those who are physically incapable of driving HGVs, those who have drug or alcohol addictions, those with mental health problems, those who have children to look after and you'll find we still have a serious problem with a lack of a suitable supply of labour.

 

[bazzer9461]

There are not shortages of the same magnitude in the EU. Believe me. I speak to friends in Germany, France, Italy all the time and they are shocked our government is trying to hide behind this lie. They do not have shortages on shelves or at petrol stations as we do. In some way all medium sized and above businesses have shortages as anytime due to turn over of staff and they get by.

A lot of the food shortages are down to a spike in global gas price increase which caused the two largest fertiliser plants to close which produce the CO2 that is needed for packaging food, so what did the government do? They went and paid these firms to open to operate so as to start producing again to try and avert the crisis.
And I will just leave this here.

EUROPE is experiencing the worst fuel crisis in its history -- a catastrophe made doubly grave by the extreme shortage of food. The fuel crisis ranks in importance with the food shortage, for food and fuel together are the essential sources of energy, human and mechanical.

 

[bazzer9461]

Take out those who are physically incapable of driving HGVs, those who have drug or alcohol addictions, those with mental health problems, those who have children to look after and you'll find we still have a serious problem with a lack of a suitable supply of labour.

So why do we have addiction problems?
Alcohol is down to the individual
Drugs is down to the individual
Yes children need to be looked after if they children have parents one can look after them and the other can go to work.
My wife and I had 3 daughters and we cooed I worked full time and after each of our children were born after 6 weeks or so my wife went back just part time until things could be done for her to return to full time.

 

[QR]

Covid is probably the number one culprit as to the problems we’ve faced over the last two years

It was clear the need to self isolate was causing real problems. But were past that now. So what's the reason now?

 

[Peterdev]

It was clear the need to self isolate was causing real problems. But were past that now. So what's the reason now?

I’d expect it could be there are a lot of jobs available and employees moving on.
In the latest news, as I expected, panic buyers have moved on to buy fuel at the motorway service stations. That’s great, more pollution and demand pushing up prices.
I bet you’ll find there is a government minister or ministers with a vested interest in BP or Shell happy that there shareholding has risen tomorrow. No doubt the forecourts will be profiteering too.
Of course once many drivers are running round on full, they won’t have anywhere to put more.
I bet TESLA shares will be rising on Monday on the back of more orders for their cars.

 

[QR]

So the government is going to send letters to nearly a million people holding HGV licences to try and tempt them back into the business.

Er, sorry, if they really don't know there is a shortage of drivers and that wages are going up I'm not sure they should be behind any wheel!

What a waste of taxpayers' money.

 

[Peterdev]

As a retired driving instructor I’m happy to have left.
Driving examiners set to strike…that will exacerbate the progress of drivers looking to gain their licences.
This situation must have been visible for several months and now we are papering over the cracks.
This government is rapidly losing popularity and losing its way.

 

[Peterdev]

So the government is going to send letters to nearly a million people holding HGV licences to try and tempt them back into the business.

Er, sorry, if they really don't know there is a shortage of drivers and that wages are going up I'm not sure they should be behind any wheel!

What a waste of taxpayers' money.

I can’t see many wanting to come back despite all the reassurances.
Examiners who've retired have also been asked back. Why would they want the stress of it all

 

[QR]

I can’t see many wanting to come back despite all the reassurances.
Examiners who've retired have also been asked back. Why would they want the stress of it all

If they are retired they will be older and therefore more susceptible to stokes, heart attacks etc. Not the best combination with HGVs.

It will be interesting to see how the ending of furlough plays into this. How many will join the jobs market, what's the skill set match, what training will be on offer etc. All things being equal of should help alleviate some shortages.

 

[Peterdev]

I couldn’t agree more QR.
I can see standards falling. Already as I may have mentioned, trailer tests are being abandoned.
Not good for standards.

 

[bazzer9461]

If they are retired they will be older and therefore more susceptible to stokes, heart attacks etc. Not the best combination with HGVs.

It will be interesting to see how the ending of furlough plays into this. How many will join the jobs market, what's the skill set match, what training will be on offer etc. All things being equal of should help alleviate some shortages.

Quite a few I suspect this will be down to unscrupulous employers who have realised working from home they can juggle employ and in doing so can make staff redundant and that is terrible.

 

[Marked Ox]

If they’re trained with a good wage on offer who knows, but if the offer is made even help with the cost towards the training and they refuse then strip them of their benefits, if that is a case of tough then so be it.

You are Jacob Rees-Mogg wanting the Poorhouse back.

 

[Marked Ox]

I thought there were 48% remain voters who could have spoken up in their defence. I may have voted to leave but I was more than happy with the overseas nationals working an honest living in Britain even with my health issues having to go to the hospital fairly regularly and having foreign NHS staff treating me and the occasional British NHS worker helping, so I was /am grateful to the EU nationals and the far wider overseas nationals being here.
Yes there were dickheads who racially abused foreigners and daubed hateful graffiti they’re wankers and have no place in society, they were only a handful and not a majority of the leave voters.
Regarding Farage I would never vote for him but I do believe he was misquoted ( no I’m not taken in by him ) I don’t think he have a toss who was here and where they were from it was the fact that a body of people who were not British weee trying to run Europe and he wanted us U.K. to be accountable, if we want to sell something to the U.K. public and Brussels were saying we weren’t allowed to he and others felt why?

The environment* people lived in changed and the use of constant derogatory language and actions in the media/Farage etc scapegoating foreigners set up that process up, enabling the xenophobes free reign. And it wasn't a handful as you had the Daily Mail, Telegraph, Daily Express, Radio media etc and some of the leading advocates of the Leave Campaign regularly using derogatory language about EU workers over a period of many years. Also, I'm wasn't even talking about racists being emboldened, I'm talking xenophobia but it did also give those racists a similar free reign.

And Farage hasn't been misquoted, for an example the Poster about Turks swamping Britain or did somebody kidnap him and drill his feet to the ground in front of the poster?! This wasn't a one off as you well know.

*It matched up with Theresa May's idea of a "hostile environment".

 

[bazzer9461]

You are Jacob Rees-Mogg wanting the Poorhouse back.

Not at all, have you never known someone who wants to live of the state and not contribute to tax and NI

 

[bazzer9461]

The environment* people lived in changed and the use of constant derogatory language and actions in the media/Farage etc scapegoating foreigners set up that process up, enabling the xenophobes free reign. And it wasn't a handful as you had the Daily Mail, Telegraph, Daily Express, Radio media etc and some of the leading advocates of the Leave Campaign regularly using derogatory language about EU workers over a period of many years. Also, I'm wasn't even talking about racists being emboldened, I'm talking xenophobia but it did also give those racists a similar free reign.

And Farage hasn't been misquoted, for an example the Poster about Turks swamping Britain or did somebody kidnap him and drill his feet to the ground in front of the poster?! This wasn't a one off as you well know.

*It matched up with Theresa May's idea of a "hostile environment".

There was I thinking Blair opened the doors to Romania and Bulgaria and their citizens to be allowed to come here with a meaningful employment and in 2006 I worked at the railways and the amount of times Romanian Gypsies who had been rounded up in Oxford for begging to be returned to where they come from which was Slough, and you’re happy with those type of immigrants coming here?

 

[Marked Ox]

Not at all, have you never known someone who wants to live of the state and not contribute to tax and NI

The number of people you are actually talking about won't get near filling the vacancies that exist.

Also, the definition of who can work is a problem considering the clusterfuck that the system is. I have been through the system when ill and told I had to work when waiting for major surgery/on high levels of pain relief and utterly unreliable because of the pain/illness. I ended up at a tribunal and the Judge made their decision beforehand chucking out the DWP/Agents decision. The DWP tried to start the process again it had taken that long to get through the process but that got stopped after a local legal charity complained to the Ho,e Secretary. Many of the people who aren't working actually have reason for it so pretty lazy to cast all with that particular brush.

 

[Marked Ox]

There was I thinking Blair opened the doors to Romania and Bulgaria and their citizens to be allowed to come here with a meaningful employment and in 2006 I worked at the railways and the amount of times Romanian Gypsies who had been rounded up in Oxford for begging to be returned to where they come from which was Slough, and you’re happy with those type of immigrants coming here?

Our Govt, including the Tories for all those years they've been in charge could have chucked those out under EU rules but they chose not to, so are you going to blame the Tories as well?

Yet again you cast all EU workers, (the vast majority hardworking and honest), as you have with those on benefits, with the same brush because of a small minority of problem immigrants? Precisely my point about the language and change in environment! I can do a squirrel as well in saying we got some beggars whilst Spain and Holland got our drug dealers/organised crime gang members as that went both ways etc etc.

Also, what has a small number of beggars (considering we have plenty of our own troublemakers it hardly is significant especially with our own that left our shores*) got to do with the Daily Mail, Telegraph, Farage/Leave Campaign etc drip feeding hostile/derogatory language about EU workers and all our ills on them?

*Are you happy to have our criminals back?

 

[Oslernorth]

A lot of the food shortages are down to a spike in global gas price increase which caused the two largest fertiliser plants to close which produce the CO2 that is needed for packaging food, so what did the government do? They went and paid these firms to open to operate so as to start producing again to try and avert the crisis.
And I will just leave this here.

EUROPE is experiencing the worst fuel crisis in its history -- a catastrophe made doubly grave by the extreme shortage of food. The fuel crisis ranks in importance with the food shortage, for food and fuel together are the essential sources of energy, human and mechanical.

The EU’s history only stretches back to November 1993. A relatively mild fuel crisis would still be their worst! Yes there is a fuel shortage in the EU, but for some reason (that remains a mystery to the select few) Britain’s shortages a far worse.

 

[bazzer9461]

The number of people you are actually talking about won't get near filling the vacancies that exist.

Also, the definition of who can work is a problem considering the clusterfuck that the system is. I have been through the system when ill and told I had to work when waiting for major surgery/on high levels of pain relief and utterly unreliable because of the pain/illness. I ended up at a tribunal and the Judge made their decision beforehand chucking out the DWP/Agents decision. The DWP tried to start the process again it had taken that long to get through the process but that got stopped after a local legal charity complained to the Ho,e Secretary. Many of the people who aren't working actually have reason for it so pretty lazy to cast all with that particular brush.

I don’t work and yes I had to go to an appeal court as they can’t see you when they make the decision irrespective of whether there is compelling evidence from the Doctor to support your claim. I had to appeal and used the Barstow advice centre and found them to be very helpful and got the right decision.
Yes I agree many can’t work for various health issues I paid my stamp all my working life so to speak so I feel I’m entitled to help. But on the other hand there are many who are physically and mentally fit to work who are just bone idle and don’t want to contribute and expect handouts it s those that I would target and am targeting who should get up of the bony arsesnakd work like the rest are doing or have done.

 

[carefreeoufc]

So… just come back from Denmark and France (week in each) for work where I’ve spoken to 100s (452 people) predominantly from Romania, Bulgaria, Latvia and Turkey working in renewables, haulage and construction to identify potential cases of exploitation or modern slavery.

Of those I spoke to approx 50% were living and working in the U.K. up until the last couple of years in a variety of roles (hotel & hospital porters, dog food factory, HGV, construction etc). Wages ranged from 12 EUR - 18 EUR per hour (almost a days wage in Bulgaria). Aside from the drivers who were moving fresh fish across Northern and Southern Europe the renewables work was low skilled, trench digging.

Based purely on my conversations with them I’d be absolutely amazed if there’s much of a take up on the 10500 temporary roles being made available. They’re being paid better wages on the continent and have freedom of movement. It’s a no brainier to stay where they are.

Just posting for those that are interested in what the “man on the ground” is saying and not the tabloids. To me I think we’ve cut our nose unfortunately and we’ll do well to attract people back. Could be completely wrong but it was relatively compelling when my colleague and I were interviewing them.