How will you vote on Thursday?

[Sarge]

Child homelessness rises by 80% in 9 years ( under tory led governments )

Child homelessness surges by 80% under Conservative-led government, figures show

New household found to be homeless every five minutes, data shows

www.independent.co.uk

 

[Deleted member 462]

How is it a wasted vote, otherwise why vote for any National Parliament MP?

National parliament doesn't vote on planning issues in Abingdon but have provided some funding though (iirc) via the HIghways England to part fund the A34 slip which the rest is being provided from local funds and from S106 funding.

Planning in Abingdon is dealt with by the Vale of White Horse, so only they could link any surrounding development to providing S106 funding for the A34 slip and clauses on the timing for building houses against the A34 slip build. But the Vale is still reliant on Highways England starting the work on time for the A34 slip.

As Sarge pointed the VOWHDC has only recently gone back under Lib Dem control after being under Tory control for a number of years when these housing schemes got planning permission. The Lib Dems can now control/direct local policies in Abingdon and the rest of the Vale but they have to do this while sorting out the finance issues left by the Tories. So previously, the Lib Dems haven't been able to control local policy as the Tories have been in control of the VOWHDC.

You really seem to be conflating national and local politics/policy making. Also, the A34 is managed by Highways England so they always had to be brought onboard which seems to have happened.

No ur getting confused between now and then. I know very well they have just taken control i live here, im talking about previous votes for lib dems not future. And i said hopefully now they are in control they can make a difference . Previously, as has been proven voting for them meant nothing as they have achieved nothing other than some very good ideas. And thats Without getting confused about shops that havnt been there since the 90s [emoji6]

 

[Marked Ox]

No ur getting confused between now and then. I know very well they have just taken control i live here, im talking about previous votes for lib dems not future. And i said hopefully now they are in control they can make a difference . Previously, as has been proven voting for them meant nothing as they have achieved nothing other than some very good ideas. And thats Without getting confused about shops that havnt been there since the 90s [emoji6]

Well, the Council under them was competently run (financially and policy wise) previously and development wasn't a free for all which happened under the last Tory administration as they didn't have a local plan until recentish (after binning off the Lib Dem one as soon as they took power as already explained). The Guildhall plans were going along nicely as well under the Lib Dems until the Tories also binned them off and the Guildhall has only now picked up due to the Cinema going in.

What exactly did the Lib Dems fail to do in their last spell that you are talking about?

 

[Sarge]

No ur getting confused between now and then. I know very well they have just taken control i live here, im talking about previous votes for lib dems not future. And i said hopefully now they are in control they can make a difference . Previously, as has been proven voting for them meant nothing as they have achieved nothing other than some very good ideas. And thats Without getting confused about shops that havnt been there since the 90s [emoji6]

Gotta say, I dunno much about shops that haven't been there (Abingdon) since the 90s?.... as I haven't lived there since the 90s ( returning 'home' to OX3 in the 90s)....I think the Gainsborough Green shops ( my handy local ones when I lived in Abingdon) are similar to what was there nearly 30 years ago ?

 

[Deleted member 462]

Well, the Council under them was competently run (financially and policy wise) previously and development wasn't a free for all which happened under the last Tory administration as they didn't have a local plan until recentish (after binning off the Lib Dem one as soon as they took power as already explained). The Guildhall plans were going along nicely as well under the Lib Dems until the Tories also binned them off and the Guildhall has only now picked up due to the Cinema going in.

What exactly did the Lib Dems fail to do in their last spell that you are talking about?

Thats the point! And maybe im just not coming across clearly. im not talking about their last spell or future spells. Im talking about votes for them in between. Ive said these votes have been pointless as they havnt been able to put in place the good ideas they have had. U seem to be arguing against a point im not making, u have even said “what did i expect them to do, they didn’t have control”. I know thats what im saying. And ill repeat again, hopfully they are now in control they can action those plans.

 

[Marked Ox]

Thats the point! And maybe im just not coming across clearly im not talking about their last spell or future spells. Im talking about votes for them in between. Ive said these votes have been pointless as they havnt been able to put in place the good ideas they have had. U seem to be arguing against a point im not making, u have even said “what did i expect them to do, they didn’t have control”. I know thats what im saying. And ill repeat again, hopfully they are now in control they can action those plans.

That is just democracy then.

 

[Deleted member 462]

That is just democracy then.

Quite, as with my original post i hope now that under a new yellow democracy they can investigate the current plan, and hopefully get it back closer to all the things they have campaigned for while not in control. Which were a lot more sensible that where were currently at.

 

[Marked Ox]

Gotta say, I dunno much about shops that haven't been there (Abingdon) since the 90s?.... as I haven't lived there since the 90s ( returning 'home' to OX3 in the 90s)....I think the Gainsborough Green shops ( my handy local ones when I lived in Abingdon) are similar to what was there nearly 30 years ago ?

Gainsborough Green has been been tidied up but it is essentially the same. The Chippy, Bookies and Convenience Store are still there.

 

[Deleted member 462]

Gainsborough Green has been been tidied up but it is essentially the same. The Chippy, Bookies and Convenience Store are still there.

Along with the 3 cars with no wheels [emoji23]

 

[Sarge]

Gainsborough Green has been been tidied up but it is essentially the same. The Chippy, Bookies and Convenience Store are still there.

same as it was when I was last over there

 

[Marked Ox]

same as it was when I was last over there

It is becoming a bit gentrified now as it has a restaurant, pharmacy and the Saxton Arms is being changed into flats ( ).

 

[gofish2]

You mean like they did when we joined?

As a trading bloc the EEC worked,
However it has become a product of its own success. It is little more than an insidious leech taking from those who play by the rules and "redistributing" the wealth it collects to many others at a cost.
You would do well to remember this fact... no country’s population voted in a majority to join the union. A few half hearted referendums voted at by a minority of the populations of the relevant countries but mostly decided by those who would benefit the most.
They are now reaping what they sowed.
The EU was, from its inception, the antithesis of “government of the people, by the people, for the people.”
It is, instead, an “uber-government of the political leaders, for the political leaders, by the political leaders." and that is what the people are kicking back against.

All of this may well be so, but you fail to consider;

The vast majority of economic projections suggest that Brexit will harm UK economic growth A large number of economic studies have now been produced which attempt to quantify the likely longer-term impact of Brexit on UK economic output. These studies focus on estimating how the level of UK output in around the year 2030 is likely to compare, post-Brexit, to the level of output that would have been produced in that year if the UK had remained a member of the EU. Economists have attempted to predict this difference on the basis of the extensive body of economic evidence that examines the relationship between the strength of trade, investment and migratory links between countries and their economic growth. This demonstrates that stronger links between countries have in the past (and in other parts of the world) been associated with faster economic growth. There is broad agreement among UK-based economists that stronger trade, investment and migratory links boost a country’s economic output. These insights – coupled with a prediction that Brexit is likely, overall, to raise barriers to trade between the UK and other countries – lead most economists to believe that Brexit will hamper UK economic growth. The vast majority of the Brexit impact studies suggest the UK economy will grow more slowly after Brexit than it would do as a member of the EU, with those predictions ranging from a negligible cost to an 18% reduction in output in 2030 compared to a world in which the UK remained a member of the EU. The predictions are more pessimistic for scenarios in which significant barriers to trade develop between the UK and EU – for example, if the UK and EU were to trade with each other on World Trade Organization (WTO) terms. Only one study – that produced by Economists for Free Trade – (Institute for government -2018)

And...
If there is no deal before Brexit, the UK will become a third country to the EU come March. UK researchers would lose access to three major Horizon 2020 funding lines that make up about 45 per cent of the €4.79 billion (£4.19 billion) received by UK organisations since 2014.

Besides hard cash, Britain is set to lose less tangible science currency – influence and reputation. “All Brexit deals look like different shades of bad” for UK research, says Mike Galsworthy, director of the pro-EU campaign group Scientists for EU. “If we have a deal, our policy influence steps down but we are still loosely in the ecosystem.” A no-deal Brexit would be a “sudden shock” with “lots of broken contracts all over the place to catch up on,” he says. Science would become just one, lower-priority item on a long list of issues for the government to negotiate.
Prof Alison Smith, a plant scientist at the University of Cambridge, who has been involved in several EU-funded projects, says her field of algae biotech needs easy cooperation across borders and disciplines to develop. “In my field you have to be able to know about engineering, regulation, how to scale up. It’s not possible to do with just one lab,” she says. Negotiations have already slowed down cooperation, made it harder to recruit the best researchers and “limit the opportunities for the UK to have leadership” in a still-growing area, she adds.
While a survey in the journal Nature showed that most UK researchers opposed Brexit, some see a silver lining – freeing the country from constrictive EU regulations. (science focus- November 2018)

And this is just the tip of the iceberg. So I take it you were aware of this when you voted?

 

[Deleted member 462]

Morning. OK, I'll go first.

As a Remainer and dreading a Brexit Party landslide I found plenty to smile about in the Euro election results.

Brexit Party didn't do quite as well as polls were predicting (32% share of vote rather than the 37% in the most recent poll), given the Tory/Labour shambles and the lack of a unified Remain option.

Tories and Labour given the bloody nose the incompetents deserved. UKIP annihilated, achieving a lower share of vote than the hopelessly bland ChangeUK. Staunchly pro-Remain parties (LibDems, Green, ChangeUK, Scottish Nationalists and Plaid) got a combined share of over 40% of the vote.

In the UK, certainly looks like the people voted for another referendum, with 'Remain' clearly back on the table as an option. (Just my thoughts )

I think its hard to say the 40% voted pro remain. Anyone voting brexit party or ukip 100% did so for one reason. Votes for the remain parties wouldnt have been based purely on remain, but also green and lib dems EU policies. Its as close as ever, not sure there will be the swing to remain that many think. Thats a lot of votes for a party that didnt even exist a few weeks ago, with a largely hated individual in charge.

 

[Marked Ox]

I think its hard to say the 40% voted pro remain. Anyone voting brexit party or ukip 100% did so for one reason. Votes for the remain parties wouldnt have been based purely on remain, but also green and lib dems EU policies. Its as close as ever, not sure there will be the swing to remain that many think. Thats a lot of votes for a party that didnt even exist a few weeks ago, with a largely hated individual in charge.

That is an utterly lame excuse about the hard remain parties. And you are Ann Widdecombe and I claim my £5.

 

[Deleted member 462]

I did say 40% voted for staunchly pro-Remain parties, not single agenda pro-Remain parties.

I know, just saying its harder to say if those votes were for that sole reason like they are with the leave parties. However their will also be protest votes for leave parties that wouldnt vote that way come a general election or possible 2nd referendum.

 

[Marked Ox]

Morning. OK, I'll go first.

As a Remainer and dreading a Brexit Party landslide I found plenty to smile about in the Euro election results.

Brexit Party didn't do quite as well as polls were predicting (32% share of vote rather than the 37% in the most recent poll), given the Tory/Labour shambles and the lack of a unified Remain option.

Tories and Labour given the bloody nose the incompetents deserved. UKIP annihilated, achieving a lower share of vote than the hopelessly bland ChangeUK. Staunchly pro-Remain parties (LibDems, Green, ChangeUK, Scottish Nationalists and Plaid) got a combined share of over 40% of the vote.

In the UK, certainly looks like the people voted for another referendum, with 'Remain' clearly back on the table as an option. (Just my thoughts )

And predictably the no deal Brexiteers like Boris, Farage using it as a justification for a hard Brexit whilst blatantly ignoring (Hi Ann Widdecombe, Mark Francois and Richard Tice) that hard remain parties polled a higher number of votes.

 

[bashamwonderland]

If you take it at face value Brexit Party won. If you perform some speculative maths and mash a few hilarious assumptions in there, the "pro-remain parties" won.

IMO the BBC are actually reporting the result accurately. Great result for the new Brexit Party but country still split down middle.

We'll all go again at a GE, perhaps early next year?

 

[Foley]

I did say 40% voted for staunchly pro-Remain parties, not single agenda pro-Remain parties.

By the way, feel sorry for Tommy Robinson, Finished eighth in the NW Region, losing his deposit. Apparently it was due to his social media ban, not the fact that he's a nasty fascist thug.

I think that it is likely that if there were another vote it could again be very close either way.
I am erring towards a second vote but do have worries about this.
Say it was 1% towards leave? What then?
Or say 1% towards the remainers? This would inevitably make a lot of leaves very angry.
Whatever, yesterday hardly made things any clearer

 

[Deleted member 462]

That is an utterly lame excuse about the hard remain parties. And you are Ann Widdecombe and I claim my £5.

Ive seen both sides claiming victory by using the results that suit their agenda. Ultimately it hasn’t proven anything other than the country is still massively divided, i wouldnt be confident either way should it go to another vote. What it does need is a clear bloody end game, what ever the vote is

 

[Marked Ox]

Ive seen both sides claiming victory by using the results that suit their agenda. Ultimately it hasn’t proven anything other than the country is still massively divided, i wouldnt be confident either way should it go to another vote. What it does need is a clear bloody end game, what ever the vote is

Oh I agree that it hasn't proved anything. The turnout won't be anything near a referendum anyway.