Home Match Build Up 18/4/2023 L1: OUFC v Portsmouth

[Foley]

Ciaron Brown himself says he is a centre back and Sam Long player there as a youth player until he was converted to a right back when it was felt he hadn’t grown tall enough to be a centre back. All of Longs best performances in the last couple of years have come at centre back as well.

They are not proper full backs, they can do a job but to have had these two as full backs for virtually an entire season is one reason we are down where we are, neither of them offer enough coming forward and Long is particularly shaky at times defensively at right back, age and injuries have taken that position from him.

Long has hardly played at CB since the youth team.
He has played what 200 games at right back? Putting him at CB seems to me to be putting round pegs in square holes!

 

[Marked Ox]

3-0 to Pompey

 

[holdsteady]

Long has hardly played at CB since the youth team.
He has played what 200 games at right back? Putting him at CB seems to me to be putting round pegs in square holes!

He has played at centre back and in a back 3 over the last couple of seasons when we have been short there, in fact they have been his best performances.

 

[East Stand Fan]

If Murphy starts on Tuesday then I probably wont even get out of the car and just drive home. Looking at LM's interview, I don't think he will though.

 

[tonyw]

Right now I'll take defenders who can defender, midfielders who can break up play and create chances, and attackers who can score or assist others to score.

Everything else is bonus stuff right now.

The problem is that we haven't signed any midfielders who can break up play, and we don't have any attackers who can score at the moment.

Given Cambridge's form, we're not now going to be able to draw our way to safety, we have to win a couple of games - which means we're going to have to take a risk here and there.

Been saying 3-5-2 for months now, and I still think it's the way to go with this squad - Anderson & Fleming give us natural width, and their defensive vulnerabilities won't be as badly exposed playing wingback. McGuane and Cam are a natural midfield two in that system.....and then there's numerous ways you can go with the front three, but I'd probably try Browne playing behind Joseph and Smith or GOD.

 

[IsleofWightYellow]

The problem is that we haven't signed any midfielders who can break up play, and we don't have any attackers who can score at the moment.

Given Cambridge's form, we're not now going to be able to draw our way to safety, we have to win a couple of games - which means we're going to have to take a risk here and there.

Been saying 3-5-2 for months now, and I still think it's the way to go with this squad - Anderson & Fleming give us natural width, and their defensive vulnerabilities won't be as badly exposed playing wingback. McGuane and Cam are a natural midfield two in that system.....and then there's numerous ways you can go with the front three, but I'd probably try Browne playing behind Joseph and Smith or GOD.

IF Anderson is fit then a back three with Anderson and Fleming as wingbacks seems almost a no-brainer. It will be disappointing and worrying if Manning doesn’t at least try it, while results aren’t going our way at least.

 

[Carpy]

It will be disappointing and worrying if Manning doesn’t at least try it, while results aren’t going our way at least.

All I want is for this, if it doesn't work, fine, but we need to try every trick we can think of to pull a win out of the bag.

 

[RyanioBirdio]

I think the issue at this point is that rightly or wrongly, Manning has picked his formation and the way he’s going to try to get out of it. He’s spent over a month drilling a certain shape and way of playing into the players. I don’t think he’s going to change that now, and maybe that’s for the best in the here and now.

Arguably we went from having a bad season to being stuck in a death spiral when Robinson reached the ‘change absolutely everything until something sticks’ stage of panic and chaos. “Drop Findlay! Play four at the back with Djavan on the right! No, I’ve decided he’s a liability, get Longy back in there! Try wing backs and stick Yanic up front! Now get Josh Murphy at wing back and stick Baldock up front! s**t, they’re crap and injured again, go back to a four! I’ve got it! Take the armband off Elliott and make Longy and Cam co-captains!”

I thought a back three with wing backs was the most logical choice when Manning showed up, but he didn’t go that way. Would it actually be worse to lob everything in the bin now? Would the players start thinking, “Oh here we go, another bloody tinker man stuck in a tailspin”?

 

[christenedinjericho]

Long has hardly played at CB since the youth team.
He has played what 200 games at right back? Putting him at CB seems to me to be putting round pegs in square holes!

Unfortunately, Sam seems hell bent on passing back 90% of the time. Probably time now to have a series of encouraging words in his shell like especially, with just 5 games to go! However, he is not alone though. It's time for Manning to release the brakes from the very first minute and not wait for us to go one down. Portsmouth are certainly there to be taken. Just f*cking go for it on Tuesday ffs.

COYY'S

 

[RgYellows]

I think the issue at this point is that rightly or wrongly, Manning has picked his formation and the way he’s going to try to get out of it. He’s spent over a month drilling a certain shape and way of playing into the players. I don’t think he’s going to change that now, and maybe that’s for the best in the here and now.

Arguably we went from having a bad season to being stuck in a death spiral when Robinson reached the ‘change absolutely everything until something sticks’ stage of panic and chaos. “Drop Findlay! Play four at the back with Djavan on the right! No, I’ve decided he’s a liability, get Longy back in there! Try wing backs and stick Yanic up front! Now get Josh Murphy at wing back and stick Baldock up front! s**t, they’re crap and injured again, go back to a four! I’ve got it! Take the armband off Elliott and make Longy and Cam co-captains!”

I thought a back three with wing backs was the most logical choice when Manning showed up, but he didn’t go that way. Would it actually be worse to lob everything in the bin now? Would the players start thinking, “Oh here we go, another bloody tinker man stuck in a tailspin”?

But then equally, are we going to insist our Manager makes no tactical changes because the players will lose respect for him if his initial idea - before he'd ever worked a day with any of these players - wasn't bang on? Won't the players lose respect for him if we carry on picking up 0.8 points per game and he still insists this is the only way we can play?

He only gets to 'start again' so many times without getting it right, I agree. But I think he gets to do it at least once, and gets more credit the sooner he realises something isn't working.

 

[IsleofWightYellow]

I think the issue at this point is that rightly or wrongly, Manning has picked his formation and the way he’s going to try to get out of it. He’s spent over a month drilling a certain shape and way of playing into the players. I don’t think he’s going to change that now, and maybe that’s for the best in the here and now.

Arguably we went from having a bad season to being stuck in a death spiral when Robinson reached the ‘change absolutely everything until something sticks’ stage of panic and chaos. “Drop Findlay! Play four at the back with Djavan on the right! No, I’ve decided he’s a liability, get Longy back in there! Try wing backs and stick Yanic up front! Now get Josh Murphy at wing back and stick Baldock up front! s**t, they’re crap and injured again, go back to a four! I’ve got it! Take the armband off Elliott and make Longy and Cam co-captains!”

I thought a back three with wing backs was the most logical choice when Manning showed up, but he didn’t go that way. Would it actually be worse to lob everything in the bin now? Would the players start thinking, “Oh here we go, another bloody tinker man stuck in a tailspin”?

I get what you’re saying, but we’re yet to win a game in this formation in 5 attempts, and switching to a back three is a simple change, which the players are used to. But you do have a point.

I actually think (and have said before, I know) the Ipswich to Wycombe game really marked the end of Karl’s reign here. We beat Ipswich playing with 3 at the back and Anderson and Fleming as the wingbacks. It was our third win in four games. We then immediately went back to 4-3-3 at Wycombe, got absolutely dicked and… haven’t won a game since? Is that right? We haven’t won a game since? Jesus.

Bring it back!

 

[IsleofWightYellow]

Long has hardly played at CB since the youth team.
He has played what 200 games at right back? Putting him at CB seems to me to be putting round pegs in square holes!

He’s played quite a few times as right CB in a back three, and done pretty well at it.

 

[SirAndyOfCrosby]

But then equally, are we going to insist our Manager makes no tactical changes because the players will lose respect for him if his initial idea - before he'd ever worked a day with any of these players - wasn't bang on? Won't the players lose respect for him if we carry on picking up 0.8 points per game and he still insists this is the only way we can play?

He only gets to 'start again' so many times without getting it right, I agree. But I think he gets to do it at least once, and gets more credit the sooner he realises something isn't working.

For me, the slight nagging issue with LM thus far is that he should have had a better idea of what works or doesn't work before he even took on the role.

Whilst he may well have man-managed players better than his predecessor - leading to a better functioning unit - what we have seen is a side and set-up very much of old. That performance yesterday could easily have been us in September - soft underbelly, go behind, then plenty of ball but nothing to show for it.

I'm genuinely not having a pop at LM here, but we had a thorough recruitment process whereby the winning candidate could surely demonstrate where we'd been going wrong and how he was going to do it differently - beyond 'I reckon I can get more out of them'.

If we've wasted 5 games to get to 'oh s**t, we need to try something else' then that is alarming in itself.

 

[RyanioBirdio]

But then equally, are we going to insist our Manager makes no tactical changes because the players will lose respect for him if his initial idea - before he'd ever worked a day with any of these players - wasn't bang on? Won't the players lose respect for him if we carry on picking up 0.8 points per game and he still insists this is the only way we can play?

He only gets to 'start again' so many times without getting it right, I agree. But I think he gets to do it at least once, and gets more credit the sooner he realises something isn't working.

I’m not saying he can’t or shouldn’t change it, I’m merely pondering whether it’s likely and if teaching them a totally new system at this stage is going to be better than trying to improve on the one he’s been trying to hammer them into shape with since his first day. Would we have enough time to get it going? Have we gone too far down the road in terms of the time that’s left? Would tearing it all up halfway through a ten game season be bold and decisive or brazen and destructive? Would it leave the players less clear on what they’re meant to be doing when by all accounts the thing they like the most at present is that they know exactly where they’re meant to be playing and what is expected of them?

The truth is that we would only really know by the time the season is over whether it was right or wrong, and if it were the latter it would probably be far more damaging for Manning long term. I’m glad it’s not me having to make the call, that’s for sure.

 

[Twiggy85]

I get what you’re saying, but we’re yet to win a game in this formation in 5 attempts, and switching to a back three is a simple change, which the players are used to. But you do have a point.

I actually think (and have said before, I know) the Ipswich to Wycombe game really marked the end of Karl’s reign here. We beat Ipswich playing with 3 at the back and Anderson and Fleming as the wingbacks. It was our third win in four games. We then immediately went back to 4-3-3 at Wycombe, got absolutely dicked and… haven’t won a game since? Is that right? We haven’t won a game since? Jesus.

Bring it back!

This exactly, when we beat Ipswich fortuitously and I think Accrington before them. The playoffs were a possibility - since then we have not won .

As for formation I can’t help thing that the player that made 4-3-3 work was Gorrin - he was the player that enabled the full backs to push forward safely knowing that he would cover. It’s mind blowing that he has been out for two seasons and this still has not been fixed. 3 at the back seems the obvious fix but I think it relies on Anderson being fit (which to date under manning he hasn’t been) it deffinately should be tried since on a paper would suit the players we have available.

 

[uptheus]

I'm not sure that the intensity helped us, everything was rushed and panicky.

We desperately need composure and making the right decisions at the right time. Get over the ball and hit the target every time. Take an extra touch and set yourself before shooting and put your laces through it.

It's the sort of thing you coach at a very early age, but fear and lack of confidence means that everything is 100mph, shots are snatched at, players shoot when there are better options open to them, or pass out of fear of missing.

Despite what some suggest, the ability is there within this squad, but it desperately needs unlocking. It sounds impossible with everything we've seen these last few months, but an early goal, and a second to give a bit of breathing space and we'll see a very different Oxford United.

We just need to ensure that we are mentally set up to take the game to the opposition rather than not concede from the off.

 

[RyanioBirdio]

I actually think (and have said before, I know) the Ipswich to Wycombe game really marked the end of Karl’s reign here. We beat Ipswich playing with 3 at the back and Anderson and Fleming as the wingbacks. It was our third win in four games. We then immediately went back to 4-3-3 at Wycombe, got absolutely dicked and… haven’t won a game since? Is that right? We haven’t won a game since? Jesus.

Bring it back!

He played wing backs at Cambridge a few weeks later and we were dreadful, although for some unknown reason he played Murphy as one of them.

It’s all a bit weird.

 

[Scotchegg]

Anderson has only just returned, so I'm not sure that wing backs would have been am option from the off. Manning has had to work with who he has available, and that is why he is playing a similar system to what came before - because he's had no one else.

At the moment we're talking about 4 at the back or a back 3/5. But in fairness our defence is the one area that has shown improvements and we're only looking at making changes because those further forward have been less effective.

I've no issue with keeping the back 5 pretty much as it is. It's the 6 in front of them that we need to rethink. I think Browne has looked one of the most positive players, and he gets a bit of a free run playing off the striker. But at the same time he is taking up some of the positions that Cam has been finding himself in. So we have 2 of those most likely to have a game winning moment fighting for the same space. We've also had Joseph and GO'D working their balls off upfront to hold the ball up, but without anyone to feed off them. Maybe Tyler Smith alongside either of them would be more effective. Goodrham is great to watch, and he seems to get people going around him, but where does everyone fit in?

I guess the best way to get everyone involved is to play Brannagan and McGuane in the middle with Cam given licence to get up to the edge of the box whilst attacking, Browne on the left, Goodrham on the right and Joseph and Smith through the middle. It would need huge changes, and it would allow for Browne, Goodrham and Joseph to drop a little if we're looking to hold on to a result.

Not perfect I know, but perfect seems a long way off at the moment!

 

[Yellow There!]

Anderson has only just returned, so I'm not sure that wing backs would have been am option from the off. Manning has had to work with who he has available, and that is why he is playing a similar system to what came before - because he's had no one else.

At the moment we're talking about 4 at the back or a back 3/5. But in fairness our defence is the one area that has shown improvements and we're only looking at making changes because those further forward have been less effective.

I've no issue with keeping the back 5 pretty much as it is. It's the 6 in front of them that we need to rethink. I think Browne has looked one of the most positive players, and he gets a bit of a free run playing off the striker. But at the same time he is taking up some of the positions that Cam has been finding himself in. So we have 2 of those most likely to have a game winning moment fighting for the same space. We've also had Joseph and GO'D working their balls off upfront to hold the ball up, but without anyone to feed off them. Maybe Tyler Smith alongside either of them would be more effective. Goodrham is great to watch, and he seems to get people going around him, but where does everyone fit in?

I guess the best way to get everyone involved is to play Brannagan and McGuane in the middle with Cam given licence to get up to the edge of the box whilst attacking, Browne on the left, Goodrham on the right and Joseph and Smith through the middle. It would need huge changes, and it would allow for Browne, Goodrham and Joseph to drop a little if we're looking to hold on to a result.

Not perfect I know, but perfect seems a long way off at the moment!

With Wildschut and Murphy both massively underperforming and the current back four showing themselves capable of keeping at least a couple of clean sheets that does seem a fair choice. I worry about Brown and Long at fullback, soooo slow and Long can’t pass to save his life. Maybe Anderson on for a bit of pace and creativity on the right, especially against the - in theory - less threatening teams. Has worked before.

Would we be happy with:

Eastwood
Long Moore Findlay Brown
Goodrham McGuane Brannagan Browne
Smith Joseph

 

[BeechRoadBokelberg]

It's got draw written all over it..... 5-5