General Politics and OUFC - Cause for concerns?

[WitneyU]

Are you a swindon supporter or more negative than some including me?

Just worried about what else might come out the closet with this. Explains the delays. There were allegations of match fixing and human rights abuses when the Bakrie's took over an Australian club last year. Just hope our current owners have done due diligence. Indonesian business and politics are notoriously corrupt.

 

[oxfordkits]

Reading the article prior to reading others' thoughts here on YF. My initial thoughts are that Oxford United may be being used as a vehicle to silence this Wenda chap??

The new investors have come to Oxford with vast wealth and promises of spending multi-millions on a new stadium and investing in local sports facilities for Oxford. The cynic in me wonders if this splashing of cash has a caveat (veiled or otherwise) that the City of Oxford must distance itself from Wenda and his Free West Papua Campaign?? Especially when there is so much at stake in terms of extracting future mineral wealth from West Papua.

Of course, no doubt there is money to be made in the property side of any stadium development, but it all seems too much of a coincidence that very, very powerful people in Indonesia take an interest in the city of Oxford, the exact place where a vocal and problematic thorn in their side is located and given a voice.

 

[Orkney Islands Yellow]

What do you mean? Be more specific.

I don’t know anything about the situation here but I’m aware that Indonesia hasn’t had a great human rights record, e.g. in East Timor, and have been concerned that our owners might be drawn into something controversial

Sometimes people are determined to be offended by something. The writer of this article has decided this obscure issue is going to be his cause.

Would Bakrie taking over OUFC give Indonesia access to resources in West Papua? Would OUFC being owned in part by some Indonesians cause suffering to everyday people in West Papua?

Let's not forget many nationalities are involved in the consortium not just Indonesian. Do they all want to be in Oxford to intimidate a regional leader who happens to have an office down the Cowley Road?

The council obviously know about Wenda by giving him the freedom of the City (as they did with the Myanmar leader which they hastily revoked after she was not as innocent as she seemed) and they've been happily working closely with Bakrie and Co so that suggests to me they're happy with the proposed new owners.

There's two sides to every story and I'm yet to be convinced how our multi national board are causing injustice thousands of miles away from Oxford.

 

[Essexyellows]

Sometimes people are determined to be offended by something. The writer of this article has decided this obscure issue is going to be his cause.

Would Bakrie taking over OUFC give Indonesia access to resources in West Papua? Would OUFC being owned in part by some Indonesians cause suffering to everyday people in West Papua?

Let's not forget many nationalities are involved in the consortium not just Indonesian. Do they all want to be in Oxford to intimidate a regional leader who happens to have an office down the Cowley Road?

The council obviously know about Wenda by giving him the freedom of the City (as they did with the Myanmar leader which they hastily revoked after she was not as innocent as she seemed) and they've been happily working closely with Bakrie and Co so that suggests to me they're happy with the proposed new owners.

There's two sides to every story, one man's freedom fighter is another man's terrorist after all.

Indeed so!

 

[YellowinBirmingham]

Sometimes people are determined to be offended by something. The writer of this article has decided this obscure issue is going to be his cause.

Would Bakrie taking over OUFC give Indonesia access to resources in West Papua? Would OUFC being owned in part by some Indonesians cause suffering to everyday people in West Papua?

Let's not forget many nationalities are involved in the consortium not just Indonesian. Do they all want to be in Oxford to intimidate a regional leader who happens to have an office down the Cowley Road?

The council obviously know about Wenda by giving him the freedom of the City (as they did with the Myanmar leader which they hastily revoked after she was not as innocent as she seemed) and they've been happily working closely with Bakrie and Co so that suggests to me they're happy with the proposed new owners.

Yep. Bloody woke brigade. You can't even have your military kill half a million people any more without some people being determined to take offence.

This is important. Every Oxford fan has a right to know where the money is coming from, how it was earned and why it's being spent.

 

[Orkney Islands Yellow]

Yep. Bloody woke brigade. You can't even have your military kill half a million people any more without some people being determined to take offence.

This is important. Every Oxford fan has a right to know where the money is coming from, how it was earned and why it's being spent.

Indeed, it's not immediately obvious that the board are linked to human rights issues though nor if they issued orders to cause atrocities it just seems the author of the article is suggesting they're guilty by association because they're prominent Indonesians.

 

[Orkney Islands Yellow]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1533428757821853696

 

[AbsoluteZero]

Seems an awful lot of money to spend on a football club just to shut up one guy and achieve political aims. I think we need to find what the motives of the author are in making a non-story so public especially after sitting on it for so many years. And why the City of Oxford got so close to Wenda and why they felt the need to get involved in the first place, and then with a bribe of money for the carnival they switch stance.

The UN seem to reject the West Papau claims and there has been no noise about any goings on with the Indonesian government mistreating of people, at the moment it all seems a bit too convenient to be likely and more of a means of inconvenience to the football club, unless of course some credible, reliable and real facts are added to the story. But even then if some sort of proof was discovered there are lots of other football clubs with ownerships of dubious means or origin. Whether it is Newcastle or even Swindon's dodgy ownership, which should have had a points deduction penalty but seems to have gone very quiet, if we start taking bad words or guilty by association to the extreme no one would be allowed to own a football club.

 

[battman]

Surprised at the amount of people dismissing this as nothing to see. It seems to me to be too big a coincidence that big Indonesian money-men have chosen Oxford as the place to set up shop when it's the exact place a prominent separatist refugee now calls home. West Papua is strategically important for the Indonesian economy, and for the rich men (i.e Bakrie) to keep getting richer by mining resources in the region. Any leverage of an independence movement on the international stage would be a hammer-blow for them.

We have to be very careful that them being at the helm of this club doesn't mean that one of West Papua's biggest proponents in Benny Wenda - and their independence movement in general - doesn't get silenced or oppressed. Freedom of speech, especially when it comes to the self-determination of over 1.1 million people, is important. The fact that you're not even allowed to fly a West Papua flag in the country unless you want to spend 15 years in prison is alarming, and that's before we go into the amount of people who've been killed in conflicts in the region. I'd find it very concerning that we'd have someone in charge of the club who not just condones, but actively supports this kind of thing.

 

[battman]

Indeed, it's not immediately obvious that the board are linked to human rights issues though nor if they issued orders to cause atrocities it just seems the author of the article is suggesting they're guilty by association because they're prominent Indonesians.

Bakrie literally profits from the mining of natural resources in West Papua, so he's an active participant and has a vested interest in keeping West Papua as part of Indonesia.

 

[battman]

Seems an awful lot of money to spend on a football club just to shut up one guy and achieve political aims. I think we need to find what the motives of the author are in making a non-story so public especially after sitting on it for so many years. And why the City of Oxford got so close to Wenda and why they felt the need to get involved in the first place, and then with a bribe of money for the carnival they switch stance.

The UN seem to reject the West Papau claims and there has been no noise about any goings on with the Indonesian government mistreating of people, at the moment it all seems a bit too convenient to be likely and more of a means of inconvenience to the football club, unless of course some credible, reliable and real facts are added to the story. But even then if some sort of proof was discovered there are lots of other football clubs with ownerships of dubious means or origin. Whether it is Newcastle or even Swindon's dodgy ownership, which should have had a points deduction penalty but seems to have gone very quiet, if we start taking bad words or guilty by association to the extreme no one would be allowed to own a football club.

It would be, but once you factor in all the other reasons to buy the club (international name, promotion potential, property deal to be done), then it just adds to value of buying the club if they can help silence the biggest proponent for West Papua's independence movement at the same time.

Also I think it's quite disrespectful to the people of West Papua to call this a non-story. You can question the motives and timing, but I don't think this is a trivial issue.

 

[werthersoriginal]

Surprised at the amount of people dismissing this as nothing to see. It seems to me to be too big a coincidence that big Indonesian money-men have chosen Oxford as the place to set up shop when it's the exact place a prominent separatist refugee now calls home. West Papua is strategically important for the Indonesian economy, and for the rich men (i.e Bakrie) to keep getting richer by mining resources in the region. Any leverage of an independence movement on the international stage would be a hammer-blow for them.

We have to be very careful that them being at the helm of this club doesn't mean that one of West Papua's biggest proponents in Benny Wenda - and their independence movement in general - doesn't get silenced or oppressed. Freedom of speech, especially when it comes to the self-determination of over 1.1 million people, is important. The fact that you're not even allowed to fly a West Papua flag in the country unless you want to spend 15 years in prison is alarming, and that's before we go into the amount of people who've been killed in conflicts in the region. I'd find it very concerning that we'd have someone in charge of the club who not just condones, but actively supports this kind of thing.

I have no insights into this, but I’ve been concerned about our owners’ closeness to the Indonesian government. It does seem a lot of effort to go to in order to silence one critic - it’s more likely to be the exercise of soft power in general. We can’t just say, oh it’s nothing to do with the football, when a lot of people have derided Newcastle and Man City for their ownership.

 

[werthersoriginal]

Think it’s also right to question reporter ‘Dominic Brown’ & why he’d right a article like this out of the blue… just saying

He’s a journalist, he’s found out about a story, researched it, and now written it- that’s how it works

 

[RyanioBirdio]

At least this should finally make people realise how much money is behind the club and why promotion is expected ASAP. Sports washing isn’t cheap and is dependant on success to be effective.

 

[Oxford1996]

The US government arranged a meeting between Indonesia and the Netherlands resulting in the New York Agreement which in 1962 gave control of West Papua to the United Nations.

One year later transferred control to Indonesia following a referendum.

 

[OxfordYankee]

I bet Horst is gutted. He thought he was shutting down the Kassam rather than a West Papuan.

 

[YellowinBirmingham]

He’s a journalist, he’s found out about a story, researched it, and now written it- that’s how it works

AH.... "Dominic Brown" isn't difficult to find out more about https://www.dominicbrown.com/

He's made a film about West Papua. It's clearly an area he is interested in.

There isn't a conspiracy here.

 

[Sarge]

The US government arranged a meeting between Indonesia and the Netherlands resulting in the New York Agreement which in 1962 gave control of West Papua to the United Nations.

One year later transferred control to Indonesia following a referendum.

.... referendum results are referendum results and have to be adhered to ( as we all well know here in the UK - 'brexit means brexit, as the Torygraph kept proclaiming !)

 

[willybum]

Looks like a robust referendum, too:

The Act of Free Choice was a poll held between 14 July and 2 August 1969 in which 1,025 people selected by the Indonesian military in Western New Guinea voted unanimously in favor of Indonesian control.[1][2]

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Act_of_Free_Choice]

I think there are causes for concern related to the story and certainly a reason to scrutinise the takeover even more closely. Not sure we should panic about it, but neither should we dismiss it as meaningless.

 

[WokinghamYellow]

Maybe Dominic brown lives in kidlington