National News Official 2019 General Election Thread

[YellowTaxi]

How does "Green new deal" fit in with a ban on fracking?

There are already retrain/adult education opportunities through the Apprenticeship scheme, I`m doing an apprenticeship funded degree in Leadership & Management.

Security for tenants - Already there to a reasonable degree, Section 21 and all that stuff.

Building new Council Houses - I`ll give you that, the funding arrangement was a failure, but I bought one for next to nothing so it wasn`t all bad.

Nationalise railways- you weren`t alive in the days of British Fail and ASLEF (As lef the train down the track..) I`ll guess.

Free buses......... YES ! Or at least joined up public transport under law.

Educational Maintenance allowances - lets go back to the days when only the clever folk went for degrees and they weren`t in photography or yoga!

Support for small buinesses - Already there across the country - needs to be managed locally not nationally. Start local, then grow.

There is clearly a link.between in investment and productivity but that isnt the only thing.
I always find the French productivity numbers surprising. Is this purely due to investment ?

This blog is quite interesting

It suggests that the difference is in the many medium sized French cities with proper infrastructure. In Britain it tends to be London or nothing. The centralised and lack of proper public transport means Britain is either bloated london lolor neglected.

Germany also has a really robust set of regional cities

 

[Foley]

This blog is quite interesting

It suggests that the difference is in the many medium sized French cities with proper infrastructure. In Britain it tends to be London or nothing. The centralised and lack of proper public transport means Britain is either bloated london lolor neglected.

Germany also has a really robust set of regional cities

That is interesting.
I would suggest that Labour and Conservatives have both failed in tackling the regional issues over the past decades.
I know that HS2 has a lot of opposition but infrastructure of this kind is really needed (and capacity/ efficiency needs improving)
Whether it is HS2 or not - I have heard few sensible alternatives and ideas to seriously try and grow the big British (specifically Northern) Cities.
Do the UK government look at the bigger picture issues and look beyond the next 5 year term enough?

 

[Essexyellows]

The French have much stronger regional and city governance than the UK has ever managed. And it works very well, everyone knows that the local mayor represents his local peoples interests be it agricultural, commercial etc.

It not until you move away from the South/London that you realise how unconnected the other UK regions are.

There seem to be plenty of talking shops (Northern Powerhouse etc etc) but little practical action. Now is that a regional council issue or a central government issue...................or a bit of both?

Here we have a Labour City Mayor who forever blames "Central Government" yet won`t face the electorate by increasing Council Tax above the limit for a local referendum............ again it can`t cut both ways.

 

[Marked Ox]

That is interesting.
I would suggest that Labour and Conservatives have both failed in tackling the regional issues over the past decades.
I know that HS2 has a lot of opposition but infrastructure of this kind is really needed (and capacity/ efficiency needs improving)
Whether it is HS2 or not - I have heard few sensible alternatives and ideas to seriously try and grow the big British (specifically Northern) Cities.
Do the UK government look at the bigger picture issues and look beyond the next 5 year term enough?

On your question no they don't and from my experience local Govt is as bad, regardless of Party. Different Govts (and I include when they remain the same Party) seem to feel they have to be seen to do something or for dogma reasons they can't allow the previous Govt's policies to continue.

Therefore public institutions (when they aren't being replaced themselves*) are in a constant flux of change. The old change programmes are not allowed to complete so we don't know if they work, as the new change policy is introduced.

As a result, we don't get good strategic decision making in general but obviously there are exceptions. Certainly not to get joined up thinking for such things as industrial/infrastructure policy that cuts across Party lines.

It is why I'd like to see more coalitions as they may keep some ownership of previous policies.

*The switch to Clinical Commissioning Groups was an utter waste of time for instance, cost a lot when all they had to do really is change the top management structure with Doctors taking the lead. Especially as a change programme had been in place and whilst not finished, it was having some positive effects.

 

[Marked Ox]

The French have much stronger regional and city governance than the UK has ever managed. And it works very well, everyone knows that the local mayor represents his local peoples interests be it agricultural, commercial etc.

It not until you move away from the South/London that you realise how unconnected the other UK regions are.

There seem to be plenty of talking shops (Northern Powerhouse etc etc) but little practical action. Now is that a regional council issue or a central government issue...................or a bit of both?

Here we have a Labour City Mayor who forever blames "Central Government" yet won`t face the electorate by increasing Council Tax above the limit for a local referendum............ again it can`t cut both ways.

For me HS2 focused the wrong way around. The starting point should have been on that money funding infrastructure across the North and creating an integrated transport system from East to West linking it all up. Then from there using that to develop/improve Manufacturing, Science Parks, housing etc.

The later stages could then link up with the Midlands and London.

Further I would move those public institutions that aren't essential to running Govt that are still in London out to either the North, South west or the Midlands. Will long term be cheaper and will free up property etc in London.

 

[Foley]

On your question no they don't and from my experience local Govt is as bad, regardless of Party. Different Govts (and I include when they remain the same Party) seem to feel they have to be seen to do something or for dogma reasons they can't allow the previous Govt's policies to continue.

Therefore public institutions (when they aren't being replaced themselves*) are in a constant flux of change. The old change programmes are not allowed to complete so we don't know if they work, as the new change policy is introduced.

As a result, we don't get good strategic decision making in general but obviously there are exceptions. Certainly not to get joined up thinking for such things as industrial/infrastructure policy that cuts across Party lines.

It is why I'd like to see more coalitions as they may keep some ownership of previous policies.

*The switch to Clinical Commissioning Groups was an utter waste of time for instance, cost a lot when all they had to do really is change the top management structure with Doctors taking the lead. Especially as a change programme had been in place and whilst not finished, it was having some positive effects.

Sure coalition government could work but not with the Corbyn ( Nationalise, spend hugely and tax ) and Johnson (talk a good game , do little, not resolve much - for example the A&E waiting data released today) polar opposites.
Coalition seems to work in Germany , but absolutely not in Italy.
I have normally been in favour of PR, but whether Brexit has been the big issue with our recent attempts of MPs working together or whether it wouldn't work in the UK?

 

[Foley]

For me HS2 focused the wrong way around. The starting point should have been on that money funding infrastructure across the North and creating an integrated transport system from East to West linking it all up. Then from there using that to develop/improve Manufacturing, Science Parks, housing etc.

The later stages could then link up with the Midlands and London.

Further I would move those public institutions that aren't essential to running Govt that are still in London out to either the North, South west or the Midlands. Will long term be cheaper and will free up property etc in London.

I totally agree with that.
One interesting thing going to watch Oxford is seeing different parts of the Country.
The huge amount of brownfield sites in Rotherham (Millmoor still standing there), Bolton whilst we try and build on every piece of green in the South.
Trying to move about the North between certain Cities is a nightmare.
Thete has been lots of talk of the Northern Power House but as usual more words than action

 

[Marked Ox]

Sure coalition government could work but not with the Corbyn ( Nationalise, spend hugely and tax ) and Johnson (talk a good game , do little, not resolve much - for example the A&E waiting data released today) polar opposites.
Coalition seems to work in Germany , but absolutely not in Italy.
I have normally been in favour of PR, but whether Brexit has been the big issue with our recent attempts of MPs working together or whether it wouldn't work in the UK?

Personally I thought the Tory/Lib Dem coalition worked reasonably well (I'm sure others will have a different view). Unfortunately it didn't work well for the Lib Dems long term.

 

[Gary Baldi]

I totally agree with that.
One interesting thing going to watch Oxford is seeing different parts of the Country.
The huge amount of brownfield sites in Rotherham (Millmoor still standing there), Bolton whilst we try and build on every piece of green in the South.
Trying to move about the North between certain Cities is a nightmare.
Thete has been lots of talk of the Northern Power House but as usual more words than action

As a Southerner, I would much prefer the investment on HS2 was moved to the North - sure HS2 will make the trains north/south run a bit quicker, but the impact of a proper and new rail infrastructure and new rolling stock from east to west, in particular, in the north will do a lot more for the area (and then England) in the medium term than HS2 on our lives. It opens up investment opportunities for businesses in a way that isn't that possible now.

The problem is the South East is the economic engine for the UK, so it still needs investment to keep the wider country going, but there needs to be more thought than chucking billions at lily gilding in projects like HS2. Cross Rail in theory, will be a good project and worth the investment.

 

[LowerSouth]

I totally agree with that.
One interesting thing going to watch Oxford is seeing different parts of the Country.
The huge amount of brownfield sites in Rotherham (Millmoor still standing there), Bolton whilst we try and build on every piece of green in the South.
Trying to move about the North between certain Cities is a nightmare.
Thete has been lots of talk of the Northern Power House but as usual more words than action

Seeing the “forgotten North” really sinks in when visiting away locations.
Governments since the 80’s have never had a plan in place to regenerate and replace the once great industrial might of the North.

 

[Sarge]

 

[Essexyellows]

Lets be careful folks, after 19 pages we are almost in agreement!!

Lets make a bid for power!!! ? ? ?

#oufcparty #YF

 

[SteMerritt]

View attachment 2407

Effectiveness of complaining on internet: 0
Add 100% to that for the effectiveness of voting, you get.... ?

 

[Manorlounger]

Effectiveness of complaining on internet: 0
Add 100% to that for the effectiveness of voting, you get.... ?

To (probably) misquote Spike Milligan, "He's one of Mrs Thatchers incomprehensives"

 

[tonyw]

Personally I thought the Tory/Lib Dem coalition worked reasonably well (I'm sure others will have a different view). Unfortunately it didn't work well for the Lib Dems long term.

I tend to agree - was one of the more effective governments of recent years.

The problem with our 'red, no blue, no red, no blue' style of electing governments is that it means the country is likely to lurch back and forth between left and right, between less government and more government.

What the Tory/Lib Dem coalition did was restrict Cameron & co. from some of their more extreme impulses, and left us with a more centrist government. And I think that's better in the long run - when policies are a result of compromise between opposing views, I reckon they're more likely to hold long term.

Course, it also required the minor partner in the coalition to be pragmatic, and abandon some of their more extreme policy positions and promises - and of course Clegg & co. got absolutely hammered for doing that. So from a political perspective, I can't imagine any small party agreeing to enter into a coalition again. Not until we have some form of PR in our voting.

 

[Marked Ox]

I tend to agree - was one of the more effective governments of recent years.

The problem with our 'red, no blue, no red, no blue' style of electing governments is that it means the country is likely to lurch back and forth between left and right, between less government and more government.

What the Tory/Lib Dem coalition did was restrict Cameron & co. from some of their more extreme impulses, and left us with a more centrist government. And I think that's better in the long run - when policies are a result of compromise between opposing views, I reckon they're more likely to hold long term.

Course, it also required the minor partner in the coalition to be pragmatic, and abandon some of their more extreme policy positions and promises - and of course Clegg & co. got absolutely hammered for doing that. So from a political perspective, I can't imagine any small party agreeing to enter into a coalition again. Not until we have some form of PR in our voting.

It would be interesting if the Lib Dems and Labour had sufficient numbers (this won't happen) to form a coalition whether they would consider a change to a PR model.

 

[YellowTaxi]

The coalition was disastrous. Needless austerity which increased the debt and led to120000 extra deaths according to an Oxford university study.

Cuts in schools. Cuts in the health service 9000 a year student fees. Lack of investment in infrastructure Talking up imagined problems with the EU as a distraction Destruction of Legal Aid. Police Cuts. Removing bursaries for nurses. Cuts in sports and youth work. Making schools sell off playing fields. Cuts in social care.

What was so good about it?

 

[Foley]

The coalition was disastrous. Needless austerity which increased the debt and led to120000 extra deaths according to an Oxford university study.

Cuts in schools. Cuts in the health service 9000 a year student fees. Lack of investment in infrastructure Talking up imagined problems with the EU as a distraction Destruction of Legal Aid. Police Cuts. Removing bursaries for nurses. Cuts in sports and youth work. Making schools sell off playing fields. Cuts in social care.

What was so good about it?

But to give a slightly different perspective the economy was f*****. Some of what you say I agree with but there was no option of simply keep spending as we were.
So as others have said at least having the Libdems as a partner did restrict the more extreme Tory policies.

 

[SteMerritt]

Making schools sell off playing fields.

According to this...

Is it game over for school playing fields?

Some 10,000 playing fields were sold off under the 1979-1997 Conservative governments - and for schoolchildren now the prospects have never been worse

www.telegraph.co.uk

... The last Labour government was selling off more school playing fields than the coalition government...

A staggering 10,000 playing fields were sold off under the 1979-1997 Conservative governments; their Labour successors sold, on average, more than 20 a year; the Coalition is running at 17 annually.

 

[tonyw]

The coalition was disastrous. Needless austerity which increased the debt and led to120000 extra deaths according to an Oxford university study.

Cuts in schools. Cuts in the health service 9000 a year student fees. Lack of investment in infrastructure Talking up imagined problems with the EU as a distraction Destruction of Legal Aid. Police Cuts. Removing bursaries for nurses. Cuts in sports and youth work. Making schools sell off playing fields. Cuts in social care.

What was so good about it?

Well, if you were more liberally inclined, you'd say some combination of the Marriage Equality Act, the raising of the income tax personal allowance, the pension triple lock and the pupil premium.

If you're of a more fiscal conservative bent, you'd say a 50% reduction in the deficit as a share of GDP, while simultaneously steering the country from recession to economic growth of ~2.5% and getting unemployment back down below 6% (when it had been over 8).

Certainly seems to me to be a better scorecard than the governments that preceded and followed the coalition.