Home Match Day Thread 3/10/20 L1 - OUFC v Crewe Alexandra

[Scotchegg]

Having just watched KR's rather excellent post 'match' interview on the situation with Chris Williams where he talks about player welfare, I cannot believe that our club would willingly put our players at risk, as seems to be being inferred in some posts on this thread. If his passion and honesty in this matter are somehow false, he would be the best actor never to be awarded an Oscar and (whatever his faults may be) I do not believe it would be in his nature to do so in a million years.

100% agree.

 

[monsieurgrumpy]

Surely the only relevant questions are:
Why did Beckles chose to not self isolate until he got his test results?
Why did Crewe bring their team to the Kassam when they were aware one of their players had been tested positive?

 

[Oldman159]

Surely the only relevant questions are:
Why did Beckles chose to not self isolate until he got his test results?
Why did Crewe bring their team to the Kassam when they were aware one of their players had been tested positive?

And the second question is the one that really must be answered

 

[RyanioBirdio]

And, I don't know what @RyanioBirdio knew or didn't, nor do I know what the club knew, or didn't. I still believe that the events, as they played out, gives some credence to what was suggested.

Oh I knew it all and kept it secret for a funny joke. Cos I know that I’m so important that I would know something Oxford United didn’t regarding their opponents, especially about something this serious. I’m the centre of the world after all. I saw an opportunity for one of my classic pranks, and kept it firmly under wraps in the hope that Crewe Alexandra wouldn’t tell anybody, would drive to the football stadium, and then walk around the joint as normal, hopefully exposing people to a potentially deadly virus. And guess what? It worked a treat! I also gave Ben Purkiss from the PFA a heads up. That’s why he turned up within 30/40 minutes of this all kicking off - as reported on the Radio Oxford broadcast - despite the fact he doesn’t live remotely locally. As soon as I told him, he wanted to be there to watch it all unfold, slap his knee and go, “What a cracking gag! Oh god, you’ve really been had this time! Look at all your faces! Woooo!”

Genuinely, one of my best gags. I’m a proper cad. Christ, imagine if it hadn’t all been a practical joke? Someone might have tried to make out like I’ve willingly tried to endanger a football club on a public forum, for absolutely no apparent reason at all. That would’ve been MENTAL.

 

[tonto]

The fact is the pfa and the efl need to dip their hands in their pockets and pay for testing. Its their players and their competition the clubs are paying for everything else and getting precious little income. Karl was spot on credit to him.

 

[Chesterfield Exile]

Even the government/health professionals have tried to define the differences between a sniffle and Covid symptoms to
try not to draw upon the Covid testing resources, but can understand if someone does and that person/their bubble should self isolate. The difference here is, this player paid for a separate test just to double check because his son was unwell, but we don’t know the severity of his symptoms which may have just been a cold.

I went to the hairdressers the other day and the Hairdresser’s son was feeling unwell that day (at school), so went home, so what should he do knowing that his son potentially has a cold? Does he close the shop down, do all his customers he had that day, the day before or 7 days before self isolate. Should his son go for a test even if he isn’t showing Covid symptoms? Should the rest of his family self isolate?

It’s not all black & white.

Simple answer = YES

 

[makv]

Surely the only relevant questions are:
Why did Beckles chose to not self isolate until he got his test results?
Why did Crewe bring their team to the Kassam when they were aware one of their players had been tested positive?

Having read the NHS guidelines a bit more - strictly speaking, even though Beckles had taken a test, he didn’t have to self-isolate, as he (allegedly) was not showing symptoms.

Morally and professionally though, he still should have told the club, as a positive test would have put them in a very sticky situation.

Which it did. And which they then right royally screwed up.

 

[West Oxon U’s]

An animated KRob on Crewe Alex. fiasco:

 

[Scotchegg]

Oh I knew it all and kept it secret for a funny joke. Cos I know that I’m so important that I would know something Oxford United didn’t regarding their opponents, especially about something this serious. I’m the centre of the world after all. I saw an opportunity for one of my classic pranks, and kept it firmly under wraps in the hope that Crewe Alexandra wouldn’t tell anybody, would drive to the football stadium, and then walk around the joint as normal, hopefully exposing people to a potentially deadly virus. And guess what? It worked a treat! I also gave Ben Purkiss from the PFA a heads up. That’s why he turned up within 30/40 minutes of this all kicking off - as reported on the Radio Oxford broadcast - despite the fact he doesn’t live remotely locally. As soon as I told him, he wanted to be there to watch it all unfold, slap his knee and go, “What a cracking gag! Oh god, you’ve really been had this time! Look at all your faces! Woooo!”

Genuinely, one of my best gags. I’m a proper cad. Christ, imagine if it hadn’t all been a practical joke? Someone might have tried to make out like I’ve willingly tried to endanger a football club on a public forum, for absolutely no apparent reason at all. That would’ve been MENTAL.

Was is MENTAL is someone pretending that they knew of the situation at 11am, then stating that the it was common knowledge within BOTH clubs without a shred of evidence.

But, in the words of The Donald "it is what it is!"

 

[PottersRightBoot]

Coming to this late in the day, my views;

Crewe are a badly run club. They cut corners.. to put it er ,,,,mildly

Most league 1 clubs don’t have a pot to pee in.

Financial support package for lower leagues ideally needs to include payment for testing in advance of matches. (Of course we don’t live in an ideal world. )

Robinson spoke well and won’t get in trouble. We are the innocent party here.

EFL are making stuff up on the hoof and don’t appear to have any firm Covid protocols in place. Eg weshould be awarded the points.But where’s the governing body guidance on this?

OUFC should put compensation claim against Crewe for costs of staging match if it can be clearly shown there was an identifiable problem the previous day.

 

[unification]

David Artell believed that all he had to do was isolate one player, let OUFC know that he had and all would be well. That's worse than negligent, that's borderline insanity.

And, I don't know what @RyanioBirdio knew or didn't, nor do I know what the club knew, or didn't. I still believe that the events, as they played out, gives some credence to what was suggested. Crewe Alexander do not subscribe, as far as I am aware, to HMG policies in regard to transport of inmates.

Club in transition, are they? Very modern. Don’t tell JK Rowling.

 

[Marked Ox]

The fact is the pfa and the efl need to dip their hands in their pockets and pay for testing. Its their players and their competition the clubs are paying for everything else and getting precious little income. Karl was spot on credit to him.

The EFL is the clubs. The administration doesn't have a secret large pot of money hidden away, income is distributed to the clubs. The only bit that isn't will be for the administration costs which won't be much relatively. The PFA on the other hand....

 

[Manorlounger]

Club in transition, are they? Very modern. Don’t tell JK Rowling.

Oops!

 

[Essexyellows]

Surely the only relevant questions are:
Why did Beckles chose to not self isolate until he got his test results?
Why did Crewe bring their team to the Kassam when they were aware one of their players had been tested positive?

It is guidance that you isolate while waiting for a test result. Good old "common sense" eh?

It is law that you isolate after a positive result.

"You could be fined if you do not stay at home and self-isolate following a positive test result for COVID-19, or if you are contacted by NHS Test and Trace and instructed to self-isolate because you are a contact of someone who has had a positive test result. If you test positive for COVID-19, it will also be an offence to knowingly provide false information about your close contacts to NHS Test and Trace. Failure to comply with these requirements may result in a fine of up to £10,000. These regulations will only apply in England."

Bit difficult if you are on the team coach with 30+ others when the result arrives, or in hotel, or in a football stadium complex.

Beckles is the person who has done something both illegal and incredibly stupid.
His manager seems equally stupid and lacking understanding and has facilitated the movement of someone who is positive amongst many others.

Fine Beckles.
Fine Crewe £10k.
Give us the points.
Minimum.

 

[BrockBuster]

Frankly I'm extremely confused about what the guidance is now for football. Was it not only a couple of weeks ago that West Ham had positive tests for their manager and two players just before a match and yet those players didn't play and the match went ahead as normal?

Crewe have massively dropped the ball here and the less said about their manager and his views the better, but the fact the EFL has given such poor vague guidance with next to no support is for me, the main reason why something this stupid could be allowed to happen.

By making the clubs entirely responsible not only to test, but also to then report those tests places a huge sense of trust on those clubs. Footballers aren't the brightest bunch at the best of times - are you telling me there isn't a single manager in the Football League who if told a couple of their key players had symptoms before a crucial match, wouldn't prefer to dismiss it as a 'mild cold' and play them regardless?

Managers and clubs at this level have an absolutely huge financial pressure to win games, not to mention managers are sacked after a few poor results. To make them entirely responsible for this is blindingly naive and if the EFL aren't aware of it, they're even more clueless than I give them credit for.

 

[guyellow]

And the second question is the one that really must be answered

I gather he was asymptomatic and purely took the test because he had been in contact with another player who had tested +ve. In these circumstances, with no fever, cough or loss of smell/taste no need to self isolate. However once test came back +ve he had to self-isolate immediately. The rest of the squad who travelled with him would be close contacts according to track and trace and I would expect them to be told to quarantine.
You are quite right in that the second question is the imoirtant one here.

 

[unification]

Having read the NHS guidelines a bit more - strictly speaking, even though Beckles had taken a test, he didn’t have to self-isolate, as he (allegedly) was not showing symptoms.

Morally and professionally though, he still should have told the club, as a positive test would have put them in a very sticky situation.

Which it did. And which they then right royally screwed up.

Re-reading the guidelines myself, I believe you’re right. If you’ve gone for a test and you aren’t showing symptoms, you are free to go about your business until your test results come in. See the yellow box on the NHS website here.

Test results for COVID-19 and how to report them

Find out what your NHS COVID-19 rapid lateral flow test result means and how to report it.

www.nhs.uk

In my view, that’s a colossal oversight. If you or anyone in your household is awaiting a result regardless of whether you or they have symptoms or not, you should be self-isolating until the result comes back negative. Just my view of course.

However there is another angle to this. Unless I’m wrong Omar Beckles had a young child who was unwell. Since children aren’t tested, he got tested himself which is sensible. But he then continued to train and chose to travel. The rules suggest that if anyone with symptoms has it, the whole household should self isolate. It doesn’t specify an age limit or suggest children are not part of this.

In fact, our own James Henry had a poorly youngster ahead of the Accrington game. He got tested, self isolated and missed training until the result came back negative. That’s how Beckles should have played it.

Crewe and Beckles will wriggle out of this one as they can argue they followed ‘correct’ procedures. By the rules, they probably just get away with it. Morally though, they’re bang to rights.

 

[Scotchegg]

Re-reading the guidelines myself, I believe you’re right. If you’ve gone for a test and you aren’t showing symptoms, you are free to go about your business until your test results come in. See the yellow box on the NHS website here.

Test results for COVID-19 and how to report them

Find out what your NHS COVID-19 rapid lateral flow test result means and how to report it.

www.nhs.uk

In my view, that’s a colossal oversight. If you or anyone in your household is awaiting a result regardless of whether you or they have symptoms or not, you should be self-isolating until the result comes back negative. Just my view of course.

However there is another angle to this. Unless I’m wrong Omar Beckles had a young child who was unwell. Since children aren’t tested, he got tested himself which is sensible. But he then continued to train and chose to travel. The rules suggest that if anyone with symptoms has it, the whole household should self isolate. It doesn’t specify an age limit or suggest children are not part of this.

In fact, our own James Henry had a poorly youngster ahead of the Accrington game. He got tested, self isolated and missed training until the result came back negative. That’s how Beckles should have played it.

Crewe and Beckles will wriggle out of this one as they can argue they followed ‘correct’ procedures. By the rules, they probably just get away with it. Morally though, they’re bang to rights.

You're right about James Henry, and Sam Long also had poorly family members. Cam Brannagan was also unwell and immediately isolated. This meant that we had at least 3 (I think Robinson said 5?) who were unable to train ahead of Accrington, when we were already depleted by injury. From day one, Oxford United have done everything by the book and ensured that the players and staff have been protected, and all opposition teams are looked after. Regardless of results, we have shown ourselves to be a first class club throughout this crisis. Sadly others have a long way to go to be seen in the same light.

 

[mooro]

As with Orient, beckles is getting stick for actually taking the test whereas those that haven't but are positive and quietly going around infecting others get away scot free.
This incident shows that all 92 clubs need to be testing religiously, funded centrally (whether EPL, EFL, PFA, or afew highly paid players throwing in 1% of their salary) with a proper protocol around how to handle specific results, not leave it up to individual clubs to be open and honest.
As it is, it is unbelievable, yet entirely believable, that there is no clear guidance how to handle such incidents in the current climate

 

[Dilla]

Frankly I'm extremely confused about what the guidance is now for football. Was it not only a couple of weeks ago that West Ham had positive tests for their manager and two players just before a match and yet those players didn't play and the match went ahead as normal?

Crewe have massively dropped the ball here and the less said about their manager and his views the better, but the fact the EFL has given such poor vague guidance with next to no support is for me, the main reason why something this stupid could be allowed to happen.

By making the clubs entirely responsible not only to test, but also to then report those tests places a huge sense of trust on those clubs. Footballers aren't the brightest bunch at the best of times - are you telling me there isn't a single manager in the Football League who if told a couple of their key players had symptoms before a crucial match, wouldn't prefer to dismiss it as a 'mild cold' and play them regardless?

Managers and clubs at this level have an absolutely huge financial pressure to win games, not to mention managers are sacked after a few poor results. To make them entirely responsible for this is blindingly naive and if the EFL aren't aware of it, they're even more clueless than I give them credit for.

Other West Ham players were negative so that's why they could play.

The difference for Crewe is they didn't get everyone tested, so others could have the virus.