The Squad (Scary Viewing)

Mintyshoe

Junior Member
#1
I've just had that sinking feeling looking at our squad - as in players actually contracted to OUFC.

When you see whats been cobbled together here over the summer, and now with an element of hindsight, it's plain to see we're in real trouble here:

Loaned Players...likely to all be returning to parent clubs eventually; disinterested on the whole.
3 DF Luke Garbutt (on loan from Everton)
9 FW Sam Smith (on loan from Reading)
10 MF Marcus Browne (on loan from West Ham United)
11 MF Samir Carruthers (on loan from Sheffield United)
12 MF Ricky Holmes (on loan from Sheffield United)
41 GK Jonathan Mitchell (on loan from Derby County)


Youth Players...some may come good and hold their own.
23 DF Sam Long (despite his age is still not considered a 1st team regular)
25 MF Tsun Dai
26 MF Shandon Baptiste
27 GK Jack Stevens
42 FW Owen James
43 FW Fabio Lopes
44 MF Slavi Spasov


Crocked...to the extent it's unlikely we'll see them play again.
7 FW Robert Hall
13 GK Scott Shearer

From the remaining squad they can be sorted into the following groups (with pushing for a play-off spot in mind):

Unproven/Not good enough
2 DF Cameron Norman
4 DF Rob Dickie (still unproven imo)
19 FW Jamie Mackie (semi-crocked)
20 FW Jon Obika
22 DF Charlie Raglan
14 MF Josh Ruffels (useful squad player among better players)
8 MF Cameron Brannagan (still relatively unproven at this level and hasn't been standout)
15 DF John Mousinho (Makes too many mistakes on a consistent basis)
29 DF Tony McMahon

Play-off Quality
1 GK Simon Eastwood (Injured)
5 DF Curtis Nelson (Highly likely to be leaving on a free)
6 MF Jamie Hanson (Poor so far but has played at a higher level)
16 FW Gavin Whyte (Unproven, but of all looks like the one who could perform at this level)
17 FW James Henry

This is why if we don't strengthen significantly during Jan, we could be in trouble...I can now picture looking back at this squad and thinking "no wonder we went down", which is a big concern.

I hope we will be safe, but even if we are there's a massive rebuild here.
 
#4
Urgh! That's not looking pretty. I think Brannagan has done enough despite being consistently misdeployed - looks a quality player to me but in danger of letting frustration boil over (understandably in my view). Am worried Nelson has lost an important 10% from his game post-injury. Still an elegant player but he looks slower on the turn and as though his body is a step behind his mind a lot of the time. Mousinho could make the cut in a holding MF role perhaps, but agree with you that the mistakes are too many and too often to ignore as a CB. I think the bookies have us about right at evens to go down. What a mess.
 

mooro

Active member
#5
Maybe add an under the bus section of players publicly trashed/humiliated by our leadership:
Norman, Stevens, Raglan, Long (it seems), etc
 

Mintyshoe

Junior Member
#6
I'm not sure I'd put Hanson in the last group. You could argue that McMahon has been poor so far but has played at a higher level as well, doesn't make him play-off quality. Hanson solidly in the "unproven/not good enough" group for me.
Fair enough - I didn't realise how frequently and recent McMahon had played in the Championship, I guess I've just decided he's not good enough already.

Hanson I'm unsure but remain positive that he'll come good given his pedigree.
 

Foley

Well-known member
2018-19 shirt sponsor for Jamie Hanson
#7
Maybe add an under the bus section of players publicly trashed/humiliated by our leadership:
Norman, Stevens, Raglan, Long (it seems), etc
Long trashed humiliated?
Where was he trashed? That's like suggesting that Pep trashed and humiliated Sane.
These players have to be tough if they are to make it to a decent level. I am not sure that being left out as they didn't play well enough is being trashed ....
 

Foley

Well-known member
2018-19 shirt sponsor for Jamie Hanson
#8
As a follow-up to that MAPP genuinely trashed players after the Cambridge game.
Junior Brown was one who was I believe told that he would never play for OUFC again.
He was big enough to prove himself good enough and have a decent career.
We are in trouble if players not deemed good enough are going to cry and not fight to prove the manager wrong..
 

Oxymoron

Junior Member
#9
We are in trouble if players not deemed good enough are going to cry and not fight to prove the manager wrong..
Too damn right. If a player makes a mistake, the crowd are quick enough to let him know - no thought of the consequence there and I'd imagine a couple of thousand people on you case is a damn sight more daunting than a throwaway soundbyte (and the players probably doesn't even get to hear the post-match anyway).

I'd hope that anyone that has managed to make a career in professional football has already been castigated at some point in his development and has come out the other side. If not, then they probably need to look for another job........
 

mooro

Active member
#11
Long trashed humiliated?
Where was he trashed? That's like suggesting that Pep trashed and humiliated Sane.
These players have to be tough if they are to make it to a decent level. I am not sure that being left out as they didn't play well enough is being trashed ....
Sorry, was just looking for a description for those either (i) called out by name by KR (Stevens and now maybe Hanson), (ii) left out in the cold from the off (Raglan) or (iii) those who went from starting XI to not being in the XVIII for the next game without explanation/injury (Norman, Long and also perhaps put McMahon in there as well, although there was eventually mention of an injury when it happened to him, but not at the time) - and therefore at the bottom of KR's list of players to pick - I think some refer to it as the 'bomb squad'.
Not a comment on their attitude/commitment/resiliance, just on the manager's current attitude towards them
 

unification

Active member
2018-19 shirt sponsor for Jamie Hanson
#12
We need to stop pretending Sam Long is good enough. He wasn’t involved in many of our League 2 sides let alone deserving to be involved in a League 1 outfit.

He might have the local connection but he’s never been good enough - just cheap enough to hang on to. Get rid in January.
 
#13
Thanks, Mintyshoe, sobering stuff (not that anyone is drunk with excitement...). In such dire circumstances we might sometimes hope for a 'backs to the wall' feisty reaction of pride, but it simply doesn't feel as if this squad has that capacity. No leadership and too many who are looking towards the door marked exit.
I'd love to be proved wrong by a spirited display at Southend, but I fear a pasting on Saturday.
 

cassox

Junior Member
#14
Got relegation written all over it.....KR needs bombing out NOW and any new man can sift thru the s**t and keep what he thinks good enough and then in January get a few players in,and hope we aint too far behind to catch up...............also hope there are some teams in the same shi1boat we are in
 

tonyw

Active member
#16
Looking at the squad like that it does make me focus some of the blame onto Tiger. For all the bluster I’m not sure that we’ve seen our manager backed as much as was suggested.
Whilst our budget may not be as big as it was in the last couple of years, I find it hard to believe it's worse than middle-of-the-pack for League One.

And I will make an absolute cast-iron guarantee that it's substantially larger than Accrington's - and yet they have four times as many points as we do.

When you start with 5 points from 11 games, there's plenty of blame to share around. But KR has got to take the largest share.........
 
#17
Looking at the squad like that it does make me focus some of the blame onto Tiger. For all the bluster I’m not sure that we’ve seen our manager backed as much as was suggested.
Interesting, if you look at all of those loan players, how much do you think it would cost to buy all of them as a group? Several million (5 million plus) I imagine, we pay a percentage of their wages which even if its only 10% (which it wont be) would be a fair amount for all of those players on their current wage. This also doesn't take into account loan fees and ridiculous relocation fees which are paid now.

We paid fees for Hanson and Whyte, undisclosed maybe but fees were still paid.

Now I think that there is a substantial amount of money there and Tiger has backed his manager. Robinson rolled the dice with those loan signings (He would rather have Smith on loan then sign a Wes Thomas esq Striker at this level on a 1 year deal etc) and he has to take the responsibility for that.

I had no problem with him bringing in loans rather then permanent signings but its unfair to say he hasn't been backed. I imagine a lot of managers in this league would be extremely happy with the budget he has.
 
#18
Looking at the players we sold in the last 12 months and the money that’s been reinvested in the squad is no where near as far as im concerned.

The way I see it (particularly in our current situation) a loan player is like temping at a s**t company. Turn up, take the wages, not too bothered what happens so long as you’re out when agreed.
 
#19
Looking at the players we sold in the last 12 months and the money that’s been reinvested in the squad is no where near as far as im concerned.

The way I see it (particularly in our current situation) a loan player is like temping at a s**t company. Turn up, take the wages, not too bothered what happens so long as you’re out when agreed.
Well first of all it's not just a case of we sold players for x amount so we now spend x amount.

We won't be spending anyway near the sort of fees we recoup as it's far too big a risk. We get players cheapish, then sell them big.

As for loans. It's easy to have that opinion now and most of us probably find it easy to agree now because of where we are in the league.

However when the loans are successful like Roofe, Graham, Baldock, JJ Kenny etc we are not too bothered.
 

yellowbow

Well-known member
2018-19 shirt sponsor for Jamie Hanson
#20
Well first of all it's not just a case of we sold players for x amount so we now spend x amount.

We won't be spending anyway near the sort of fees we recoup as it's far too big a risk. We get players cheapish, then sell them big.

As for loans. It's easy to have that opinion now and most of us probably find it easy to agree now because of where we are in the league.

However when the loans are successful like Roofe, Graham, Baldock, JJ Kenny etc we are not too bothered.
I’m not so sure I agree. I know it’s the modern way for lower league teams but I remember how pig sick I feel when the good ones get recalled.
 
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