National News Official 2019 General Election Thread

[Gary Baldi]

Well that was the most appallingly fought General Election I have ever seen. Some of the posts I've seen, from both red and blue supporters have been shocking, this being a particularly bad example...

View attachment 2598

People need to look at themselves, we now have aggressive posts from the defeated side and childish gloating from the 'victors'.

Our country has embarrassed itself over the last month, hopefully we can find some way to unite and move forwards, and move away from this negative soundbite driven divisiveness and Trump-style pettiness which has become our politics

I agree to a point, but frankly, with the amount of abuse that the left, in particular Coybyn's many acolytes, have doled out, they need to eat the abuse and chipping they are getting back today or perhaps review why people are doing it in the first place.

The below just highlights the disrespect, anger and abuse towards people voted Conservatives in the election - some of the comments are verging on death threats.


My feeling is the abuse is only going to continue because the hardcore believers just cannot fundamentally accept people don't agree with them and they will continue to lash out as they have done to anyone that doesn't agree. The best decent and honest Left leaning people like you can do is persistently disavow them like many on the right do. I abhor people who post that meme above - it's cheap and nasty and harmful - and those far right morons who just incite the left because it's so easy.

Admitting you a Tory leaver on the internet opens you up to all sorts of abuse in a way a Labour Remainer won't get it - I'm not asking to be victim at all or feel like one; I kind of don't care anymore. I have called for a long time for it be toned down, but some cannot help digging at Tories because they so vehemently hate our views and assume we all hate the poor, etc and the cycle persists. I hope that now we have majority Govt, we can deal with Brexit and start to help our local communities get better, step by step.

But for today, you lefties are a bunch of whiny and sulky losers . Tomorrow as the dust settles, let's all move on together.

 

[Sarge]

I agree to a point, but frankly, with the amount of abuse that the left, in particular Coybyn's many acolytes, have doled out, they need to eat the abuse and chipping they are getting back today or perhaps review why people are doing it in the first place.

The below just highlights the disrespect, anger and abuse towards people voted Conservatives in the election - some of the comments are verging on death threats.
View attachment 2603

My feeling is the abuse is only going to continue because the hardcore believers just cannot fundamentally accept people don't agree with them and they will continue to lash out as they have done to anyone that doesn't agree. The best decent and honest Left leaning people like you can do is persistently disavow them like many on the right do. I abhor people who post that meme above - it's cheap and nasty and harmful - and those far right morons who just incite the left because it's so easy.

Admitting you a Tory leaver on the internet opens you up to all sorts of abuse in a way a Labour Remainer won't get it - I'm not asking to be victim at all or feel like one; I kind of don't care anymore. I have called for a long time for it be toned down, but some cannot help digging at Tories because they so vehemently hate our views and assume we all hate the poor, etc and the cycle persists. I hope that now we have majority Govt, we can deal with Brexit and start to help our local communities get better, step by step.

But for today, you lefties are a bunch of whiny and sulky losers . Tomorrow as the dust settles, let's all move on together.

 

[Sarge]

And Corbyn has not stood down, yet. He will not lead Labour in another campaign, but he will hang on to oversee whatever refurbishment of the party is attempted.

Very principled man ,he'll stay as Islington MP until the next GE is announced, then, at 75 yo, he'll retire Id guess

 

[Northstandboy]

Yes, but it is what it is.

Didn't UKIP voters said the same thing when they got most votes but 0 seats!

 

[QR]

I fear for Labour, I really do.

This was a worse result than Michael Foots disastrous campaign in 1983 and look how long and difficult it was to turn the party round from that awful result. I’m not sure the will is in the current Labour Party and it’s backers/influencers to make the changes that will be needed to make them electable.

There are too many in the party who are in complete denial about the reasons they lost so badly. Yes Brexit played its part, in particular Corbyn’s bizarre and useless stance on it. But the stench of anti semitism hanging over the party had a huge impact, also the worry and concerns about Corbyn and our national security.

Agree. It seems like some of them would rather stick to their ideology and have no power rather than to compromise in order to have some chance of holding power. And I thought people went into politics in order to change things.

 

[QR]

Calm down, no need to be so angry.


If we had PR the Greens wouldn’t step aside and not stand, and therefore the LDs would gain less votes.

You're doing it again.

 

[Essexyellows]

But we don't have PR, we have first past the post, so your point is irrelevant. If Scotland were an independent country the SNP would form a government with a massive majority.

The point is that the SNP want IndyRef2............................ so when those 1.4+ million folk vote AGAINST independence, as they did in 2014, then they win.
That is irrespective of the disproportionate number of seats the SNP win with their 1.2 million.


Give the Scots 2 years of "No Barnett formula" and see if they still fancy it when they lose 20% of the block money.

 

[Northstandboy]

Swinson's losing speach now on BBC News.

 

[Essexyellows]

@Pete Burrett .............. just look at the numbers from 2014!!

In 2011 they had 69 seats...... then Alex Salmond called the "once in lifetime referendum" for 2014..................... and lost.

 

[chuckbert]

@Pete Burrett .............. just look at the numbers from 2014!!

In 2011 they had 69 seats...... then Alex Salmond called the "once in lifetime referendum" for 2014..................... and lost.

Yes, but England hadn't just jumped off a cliff in 2014 ...

 

[Essexyellows]

Where is the current analysis that shows how many of the 1.4 million non-SNP voters in Scotland are against independence? You're making assumptions you can't prove or substantiate. (Using a laughing emoji doesn't equate to substantiation).

Really? http://whatscotlandthinks.org/quest...-independence-referendum-if-held-now-ask#line

Anyway NS isn`t going to be getting her wish anytime soon. I`ll keep smiling. ?

 

[SteMerritt]

I've never abused another poster on here for their views. I've disagreed strongly, and always given reasons for the views I hold. I haven't referred en bloc to 'righties' or suggested they're whiny or sulky or applied any other generalised derogatory term. How do you feel able to lump non-Tory supporting Remainers together, while always playing the victim of nasty 'lefties' yourself?

I'm guessing you've applied the 'ignore' button in respect of my posts, but we'll see.

I haven't either, and have found the abuse from both sides quite staggering at times.

 

[tonyw]

Affluent Londoners?! Large parts of the Labour vote in London are right up there with some of the most deprived areas in the country. Bit lazy to characterise Londoners as all affluent? and to say they havent felt austerity is rubbish

Apologies FFOD - it was late, I was tired and it was a lazy post.
What I basically meant was that it was in the most affluent London seats (the likes of Richmond, Walton, Twickenham etc. etc.) where you actually saw the biggest vote shift away from the Tories, mostly to the Lib Dems. Having lived in London for large chunks of my life, I'm more than aware that not everyone lives in Mayfair penthouses, and not everyone is insulated from the effects of austerity.

As far as I can tell from looking at the results.....in the parts of London already controlled by Labour, not much changed at all.

 

[Fistfullofdollars]

Apologies FFOD - it was late, I was tired and it was a lazy post.
What I basically meant was that it was in the most affluent London seats (the likes of Richmond, Walton, Twickenham etc. etc.) where you actually saw the biggest vote shift away from the Tories, mostly to the Lib Dems. Having lived in London for large chunks of my life, I'm more than aware that not everyone lives in Mayfair penthouses, and not everyone is insulated from the effects of austerity.

As far as I can tell from looking at the results.....in the parts of London already controlled by Labour, not much changed at all.

Yeah fair enough, it just came across as a bit of a lazy stereotype
Results wise, there was a bit or movement, my constituency of Edmonton is Labour heartland, but still saw a drop off of 7% in their share of the vote. Still returned a majority of 16k though. Similar in other local constituency where the average drop off seems to be between 5-10% from the Labour vote, with a mixture of Conservative or Lib Dem picking up the slack.
In short, Labour went backwards in London, but from a higher starting position and probably not to the same degree they did in other parts of the country

 

[unification]

I agree to a point, but frankly, with the amount of abuse that the left, in particular Coybyn's many acolytes, have doled out, they need to eat the abuse and chipping they are getting back today or perhaps review why people are doing it in the first place.

The below just highlights the disrespect, anger and abuse towards people voted Conservatives in the election - some of the comments are verging on death threats.
View attachment 2603

My feeling is the abuse is only going to continue because the hardcore believers just cannot fundamentally accept people don't agree with them and they will continue to lash out as they have done to anyone that doesn't agree. The best decent and honest Left leaning people like you can do is persistently disavow them like many on the right do. I abhor people who post that meme above - it's cheap and nasty and harmful - and those far right morons who just incite the left because it's so easy.

Admitting you a Tory leaver on the internet opens you up to all sorts of abuse in a way a Labour Remainer won't get it - I'm not asking to be victim at all or feel like one; I kind of don't care anymore. I have called for a long time for it be toned down, but some cannot help digging at Tories because they so vehemently hate our views and assume we all hate the poor, etc and the cycle persists. I hope that now we have majority Govt, we can deal with Brexit and start to help our local communities get better, step by step.

But for today, you lefties are a bunch of whiny and sulky losers . Tomorrow as the dust settles, let's all move on together.

I think you’re giving too much credence to the value of social media in all of this, GB. I agree that its hard to avoid when you’re on it and nastiness is abundant when you can easily hide behind an avatar. People act in a certain way on social media that they wouldn’t do in real life – or at least most of us wouldn’t do, there have been some very unpleasant personal attacks on politicians.

I am however in agreement with you in terms that the general direction of the sticks and stones has been mostly from ‘the left’ to ‘the right’. What’s changed there though? If you drew up in inner city Liverpool in the 1980s, you grew up to hate the Tories and Thatcher. You rioted against the Poll Tax and drew anti-graffiti on the walls. The battlefield has switched somewhat from the streets to social media but in essence nothing has changed much. You shout to ‘Vote Labour’ in Liverpool in the 80s and those around you will listen. Do it on social media in 2019 and you have the same echo chamber response. The thinking to both remains insular.

Social media only affects a few. If my London-ish timeline was to go by in the days leading up to the election, you would have expected a Corbyn landslide. However, there are huge numbers who don’t give a toss what social media thinks, the like-and-shares are ignored and despite all the noise, new media and new ways to consume media, they gather their views from newspapers and the 10pm news.

It would be great to go back to a nicer and far duller form of politics. Think Major v Blair where the battle is pitched somewhere in the middle. However, it doesn’t take long before one side to blame the other and resort to ‘whataboutery’.

 

[Peterdev]

I quite like Sturgeon too. She’s stood up for her country, and had an Increase in votes and seats.
it is clear that Scotland should have another referendum, which will result in them leaving the union.If it is going to be a mess like brexit then so be it I suppose.
They will need a new currency. How they achieve being run by the EU I’m not sure though. Would they have to reapply as a new sovereign country?

 

[tonyw]

On reflection, after sleeping on it, and then having a good look at the results this morning.....

As it turned out, almost nothing changed in London and the South of England. Tories and Lib Dems swapped a couple of seats in the London suburbs; Tories and Labour swapped a single seat in central London. Otherwise, it's exactly how you were.

No, this was an election that was for the midlands and the North, who have unequivocally decided that Brexit and Conservative government is the way to bring prosperity back to their regions. I hope they're right......I think they're wrong.


Beyond that, my overarching feeling is one of sadness. As a fairly ardent pro-European, yesterday was the day that the game was up and the last hope died. Brexit will happen now, and it won't be a soft Norway+ kind of Brexit either.

So emotionally very down. But intellectually.....it's going to be interesting. We're actually going to get answers to all those previously hypothetical questions we've been asking over the past four years. What trade deals will Britain actually be able to strike? What will the economic impact of Brexit be? What will actually happen at the Irish border?

 

[Foley]

Just seen Lib dem share of the vote increased by 50% (8% to 12%) but number of seats fallen from 12 to 11!!! (before St Ives vote is on). Yo democracy!

It's the way that the voting system has been for centuries.
I am not saying that it is right, but everybody knows the rules and it is all about getting seats that matters ( if it was all about number of voted, the tactics of all of the parties will have been different)
Dont forget that there was tactical voting going on as well

 

[Foley]

On reflection, after sleeping on it, and then having a good look at the results this morning.....

As it turned out, almost nothing changed in London and the South of England. Tories and Lib Dems swapped a couple of seats in the London suburbs; Tories and Labour swapped a single seat in central London. Otherwise, it's exactly how you were.

No, this was an election that was for the midlands and the North, who have unequivocally decided that Brexit and Conservative government is the way to bring prosperity back to their regions. I hope they're right......I think they're wrong.


Beyond that, my overarching feeling is one of sadness. As a fairly ardent pro-European, yesterday was the day that the game was up and the last hope died. Brexit will happen now, and it won't be a soft Norway+ kind of Brexit either.

So emotionally very down. But intellectually.....it's going to be interesting. We're actually going to get answers to all those previously hypothetical questions we've been asking over the past four years. What trade deals will Britain actually be able to strike? What will the economic impact of Brexit be? What will actually happen at the Irish border?

With regard to the trade deals, one of the big ones will be the trade deal with Europe of course.
Scotland and Ireland issues will be very interesting.

 

[Foley]

They will need a new currency. How they achieve being run by the EU I’m not sure though. Would they have to reapply as a new sovereign country?

In theory Scotland will have to apply as a new Country that will need to go into the Euro. I am not sure that Europe have a huge amount of wriggle room based on the Catalonia situation in Spain ( I suspect that Europe wont make it too easy for Scotland)
Then of course there is the Scottish border ( will it need to be a hard border?)
Scotland will need some EU subsidies to reduce the hit they will inevitably have through leaving the UK.
If that happens....