National News Joey Barton

[SteMerritt]

It is the suggestion that a woman pundit could never understand top-level men's football which I find a step too far. Our women's team have just played in a World Cup Final, to suggest that their experiences are not sufficient to firstly understand the game and secondly their experiences of pressures being an elite footballer and playing in big occasions is irrelevant, is frankly baffling. We have superb female pundits in Cricket, there is no reason why we can't have the same in football.

 

[chuckbert]

I think that's ultimately the point.

But that’s not Joey Barton’s point, and everyone who says “he’s got a point” is pandering to a stronger opinion than that.

 

[MustardYellow]

It is the suggestion that a woman pundit could never understand top-level men's football which I find a step too far. Our women's team have just played in a World Cup Final, to suggest that their experiences are not sufficient to firstly understand the game and secondly their experiences of pressures being an elite footballer and playing in big occasions is irrelevant, is frankly baffling. We have superb female pundits in Cricket, there is no reason why we can't have the same in football.

Of course there's no reason we can't have that, but the issue is we don't have that. Most female football pundits (particularly those on Sky), aren't great to put it nicely.

 

[SteMerritt]

Of course there's no reason we can't have that, but the issue is we don't have that. Most female football pundits (particularly those on Sky), aren't great to put it nicely.

The issue for some is we don't currently have that, but there is also the suggestion by others that women could never do the job, that's what I'm getting from Barton via the tweets shared on here.

 

[MustardYellow]

But that’s not Joey Barton’s point, and everyone who says “he’s got a point” is pandering to a stronger opinion than that.

I haven't read all of his comments, but from the one's I have read he's basically saying Eni Aluko is a bad pundit (granted in a very inflammatory way), which she is (my opinion). As I say, the issue stems from the belief a lot of people have that she wouldn't be in the roles she is if she were a man.

 

[dickwalton1964]

It is the suggestion that a woman pundit could never understand top-level men's football which I find a step too far. Our women's team have just played in a World Cup Final, to suggest that their experiences are not sufficient to firstly understand the game and secondly their experiences of pressures being an elite footballer and playing in big occasions is irrelevant, is frankly baffling. We have superb female pundits in Cricket, there is no reason why we can't have the same in football.

The only way men’s and women’s football is relatable is that the ball is round and you have two goals to kick in to - thats it, in my opinion. Didn’t Barton say England men would beat England women 40-0 ? That’s perhaps pushing it but I think they win 25-30 nil, a goal every three minutes or so. A local non-league team would fair about the same, why not pluck random pundits from non-league teams to cast their view each week ? When the disparity is so great I think it is impossible for a woman player to give informed views on the men’s game. I think he’s absolutely bang on when he says a woman pundit cannot grasp top level men’s football - it’s the manner in which he’s portraying that point that’s the problem.

 

[SteMerritt]

The only way men’s and women’s football is relatable is that the ball is round and you have two goals to kick in to - thats it, in my opinion. Didn’t Barton say England men would beat England women 40-0 ? That’s perhaps pushing it but I think they win 25-30 nil, a goal every three minutes or so. A local non-league team would fair about the same, why not pluck random pundits from non-league teams to cast their view each week ? When the disparity is so great I think it is impossible for a woman player to give informed views on the men’s game. I think he’s absolutely bang on when he says a woman pundit cannot grasp top level men’s football - it’s the manner in which he’s portraying that point that’s the problem.

Women's coaches will work to and qualify for the same badges as the men - to suggest they are different sports is completely wide of the mark. And to suggest that it is impossible for any female to understand the game and always will be is just bonkers. It is completely possible for a woman who has played the game to understand how it works, just because they are physically weaker doesn't mean that understanding tactics, positions, movements is beyond them.

Of course the men's side would beat the woman's team, that is completely irrelevant.

 

[MustardYellow]

The only way men’s and women’s football is relatable is that the ball is round and you have two goals to kick in to - thats it, in my opinion. Didn’t Barton say England men would beat England women 40-0 ? That’s perhaps pushing it but I think they win 25-30 nil, a goal every three minutes or so. A local non-league team would fair about the same, why not pluck random pundits from non-league teams to cast their view each week ? When the disparity is so great I think it is impossible for a woman player to give informed views on the men’s game. I think he’s absolutely bang on when he says a woman pundit cannot grasp top level men’s football - it’s the manner in which he’s portraying that point that’s the problem.

I suppose the question isn't necessarily whether women should do punditry, and more if anyone who hasn't played at the highest level of the men's game should do punditry?

My issue with female pundits isn't that they're women who haven't played in the men's game, it's that I often feel like they just don't know their stuff. Getting information wrong, not knowing players names - regardless of your experience in football if you're a pundit you should know this stuff. It seems more common amongst the female pundits than the male.

 

[SteMerritt]

more if anyone who hasn't played at the highest level of the men's game should do punditry?

That'll rule Jose Mourinho out of media work then... You just don't need to have played at the top level to have valuable insights into the game.

 

[Osei Yaw]

Anyone who wants to be a football pundit should first be judged by how many keep-ups they can do.

I think you need to be able to do at least 100 to be able to talk about the Premier League on TV. 75 for The Championship, 50 for League 1 and 25 for League 2.

 

[chromeyellow]

Anyone who wants to be a football pundit should first be judged by how many keep-ups they can do.

I think you need to be able to do at least 100 to be able to talk about the Premier League on TV. 75 for The Championship, 50 for League 1 and 25 for League 2.

Great idea- in fact they should be doing their keepy-uppies on camera as they do their punditry.

 

[SteMerritt]

Anyone who wants to be a football pundit should first be judged by how many keep-ups they can do.

I think you need to be able to do at least 100 to be able to talk about the Premier League on TV. 75 for The Championship, 50 for League 1 and 25 for League 2.

That would be Lineker sacked then, he went into how bad he has always been at them on his podcast a few months ago.

 

[chuckbert]

I haven't read all of his comments, but from the one's I have read he's basically saying Eni Aluko is a bad pundit (granted in a very inflammatory way), which she is (my opinion). As I say, the issue stems from the belief a lot of people have that she wouldn't be in the roles she is if she were a man.

Well, I recommend you go and look at some more before you align yourself with him.

If all he did was criticise a pundit for being bad, we wouldn’t even be discussing him.

 

[chromeyellow]

No time for anyone claiming the wifebeater and thug "has a point". he should have had a lifetime ban from the game after stubbing a cigar out in a colleague's eye.

 

[Osei Yaw]

That would be Lineker sacked then, he went into how bad he has always been at them on his podcast a few months ago.

Probably because he's too busy trying to eat tofu.

 

[Osei Yaw]

Great idea- in fact they should be doing their keepy-uppies on camera as they do their punditry.

That may be a better way of doing it actually. You can only talk whilst you're doing keep-ups. As soon as the ball drops then you have to stop talking.

That would really sort the men from the boys (and women, apparently).

 

[unification]

That’s boys and girls though, by the age of 15 they have gone so far apart that an under 15s boys team can beat a top class women’s team, so that’s a huge gap opening up very quickly.

This argument is a tired one. The boys' teams don't magically become better and more skillful, they get stronger and quicker. The gap is a physical one and not a skill-based one. The boys will be able to run faster, quick the ball harder and physically hold off an opponent far more than any senior womens' side could. I find it frustrating when women's teams agree to those sort of matches. It does their cause no favours whatsoever because it gives ammunition that their game is inferior. They play other women's teams because, you know, they're equally matched physically.

The only way men’s and women’s football is relatable is that the ball is round and you have two goals to kick in to - thats it, in my opinion. Didn’t Barton say England men would beat England women 40-0 ? That’s perhaps pushing it but I think they win 25-30 nil, a goal every three minutes or so. A local non-league team would fair about the same, why not pluck random pundits from non-league teams to cast their view each week ? When the disparity is so great I think it is impossible for a woman player to give informed views on the men’s game. I think he’s absolutely bang on when he says a woman pundit cannot grasp top level men’s football - it’s the manner in which he’s portraying that point that’s the problem.

My point above stands again. Why do so many men want to see womens' teams beaten by mens' sides? So they know their place? Barton being Barton, it's probably not far from his favourite hobby bearing in mind his comments.

That would be Lineker sacked then, he went into how bad he has always been at them on his podcast a few months ago.

Wasn't that on Quickly Kevin? The punchline from that episode was that he hustled the person who challenged him on it and he was good at keep ups.

 

[andystroud]

That may be a better way of doing it actually. You can only talk whilst you're doing keep-ups. As soon as the ball drops then you have to stop talking.

That would really sort the men from the boys (and women, apparently).

This would open the door for more female pundits, as we all know that only women can multitask

 

[SteMerritt]

Wasn't that on Quickly Kevin? The punchline from that episode was that he hustled the person who challenged him on it and he was good at keep ups.

No, I heard him talk about it on 'The Rest is Football'. He was talking about his transfer to Barcelona, and they had him and Mark Hughes presented to a large crowd. He was worried they would want them to do keep ups and said he just couldn't do them.

 

[Yellow River]

Football is a very simple game.

Managers, coaches, pundits, journalists all deliberately over complicate it.

We as fans are guilty of it too. I suspect deep down we all know it’s an incredibly simple game and we try and justify our obsession with it by trying to make out it’s somehow complicated and needs deep analytical discussion.

It’s a complete gravy train from ex player to pundit. The majority of ex players whether they be black, white, male, female, in my view offer very little insight, most of it is bland, cliche ridden with a bit of bantz thrown in for ‘entertainment’ value.

Some pundits are definitely worse than others for their awfulness.