Home Match Day Thread Home goals conceded - goalkeeping

[NottsYellow]

In 6 home league games, the opposition have only had 11 shots on target from which they have scored 7 goals.
Yesterday Wycombe only had two shots on target, other games MK 4, Burton 1, Morecambe 1, Lincoln 3, Cambridge 0.
This is a shocking statistic of goals conceded from shots on target.
The good aspect is the team must be doing something very well in preventing the opposition from getting shots on target, but as soon as it is on target they just seem to be going in. Eastwood was flat footed yesterday for the goal and generally seems very slow to react to shots.
In the odd game you are always going to concede a goal and lose a game from 1 or 2 shots on target but not have such a poor record over 6 games.
I really feel it is time to drop Eastwood and give McGinty a go. Stevens seems to be doing OK at PV but nothing special to suggest he will be the answer if he comes back in Jan.

 

[BigLad]

Played 11 games and got Mot M in three of them

 

[holdsteady]

I’m not Eastwoods biggest fan, think he has been not good enough for a few years now but I don’t think you can blame him for yesterday, it was just a good goal. The problem was that a poor team scoring one goal was enough to stop us getting anything from the game despite the fact they sat back on it for the entire of the second half, a decent team turns that around and comes back to get 3 points.

 

[RyanioBirdio]

Stevens seems to be doing OK at PV but nothing special to suggest he will be the answer if he comes back in Jan.

Based on what? Because the two Port Vale fans that my brother works with think he’s the best thing since sliced bread. They can’t believe how amazing our goalkeepers must be if we don’t even want him on the bench.

A new manager and you will see the Jack Stevens we all saw previously. I can almost guarantee you that.

 

[QR]

We need someone who can catch like this.

FFS!

https://twitter.com/x/status/1578799751235272705

 

[tim lane]

In 6 home league games, the opposition have only had 11 shots on target from which they have scored 7 goals.
Yesterday Wycombe only had two shots on target, other games MK 4, Burton 1, Morecambe 1, Lincoln 3, Cambridge 0.
This is a shocking statistic of goals conceded from shots on target.
The good aspect is the team must be doing something very well in preventing the opposition from getting shots on target, but as soon as it is on target they just seem to be going in. Eastwood was flat footed yesterday for the goal and generally seems very slow to react to shots.
In the odd game you are always going to concede a goal and lose a game from 1 or 2 shots on target but not have such a poor record over 6 games.
I really feel it is time to drop Eastwood and give McGinty a go. Stevens seems to be doing OK at PV but nothing special to suggest he will be the answer if he comes back in Jan.

Hang on a minute! Only two teams in League 1 have conceded fewer goals than Oxford. Leaders Plymouth have conceded more. Are you seriously suggesting that Simon Eastwood's form is one of the more serious causes for concerns?

 

[Yellow River]

Based on what? Because the two Port Vale fans that my brother works with think he’s the best thing since sliced bread. They can’t believe how amazing our goalkeepers must be if we don’t even want him on the bench.

A new manager and you will see the Jack Stevens we all saw previously. I can almost guarantee you that.

Similar senario to George Baldock situation at MK I believe.

Michael Appleton couldn’t believe his luck when KR deemed that GB was the weakest of his three available right backs and let him go on loan to Oxford.

Perhaps KR isn’t very good at identifying and/or managing goalkeepers and fullbacks?

 

[Notaswindonfan]

Similar senario to George Baldock situation at MK I believe.

Michael Appleton couldn’t believe his luck when KR deemed that GB was the weakest of his three available right backs and let him go on loan to Oxford.

Perhaps KR isn’t very good at identifying and/or managing goalkeepers and fullbacks?

Or winger’s playing at fullbacks, fullbacks playing at wingbacks, forwards playing as midfielders etc etc.

 

[nige01ox]

Hang on a minute! Only two teams in League 1 have conceded fewer goals than Oxford. Leaders Plymouth have conceded more. Are you seriously suggesting that Simon Eastwood's form is one of the more serious causes for concerns?

For me, that means nothing. Absolutely nothing. First off, we've had the kindest fixture list of any team in the League, playing 9 of the other 11 sides that currently make up the bottom half of the table. Also, if you're playing against Oxford this season and go 1 up, why would you keep attacking at full throttle? We are so toothless, devoid of creativity and ideas, slow, placid. Score 1 against Oxford and in most cases you will at worst get a point, so just sit in, defend compactly and save those small energy percentages for those games in December and January where you will need every ounce. Contrast that to last season - teams would score 2 against us and that would often not be enough to get away with a point.

Another thing, I pay attention to who posts what, and you are always a staunch defender of Eastwood. I don't think anyone is saying he is completely crap, but what is wrong with wanting better? He does still make some good saves, just as he's made plenty of errors over the last 2 years. I think he's very good in 1 on 1 situations (May at Cheltenham, that last gasp save at Charlton last week), but his all round goalkeeping is not at the level for where we are aiming to be. What we need is a keeper performing like Stevens in 20/21, who wins you points and can change your season. Lets not forget his penalty save at home to Charlton with the last action of the game, that earned us a 0-0 draw. Three days later, he saved another penalty away at Swindon, in a game that eventually ended 2-1 to us. What happened at the end of the season? We snuck into the playoffs on the final day.

Last season, Stevens was a long way off those standards. He obviously had long term illness as a possible mitigating factor, so for me it remains to be seen whether 20/21 was the exception and he was just temporarily performing above his normal ability, or if indeed the illness hampered him so much and he needed longer to recover. That's why I think it was actually a decent idea to get him out on a season loan to a team at this level where he'll go and play 40+ games. Also experience of another dressing room, new voices to listen to, and learn and develop different routines. I'm very happy to read Ryan's post above about how it seems to be going for him so far. However, I fully expected that meant we would go out and bring in a new number 1. I assumed we rated McGinty highly enough that we intended him to be our starter, maybe after a being allowed a month or so to settle in to his new country and new surroundings. But given we are just seeing him in the odd cup game, clearly he's very much seen as number 2 and a young keeper to develop. For me then it's strange we brought in a young prospect in this position, given we already kind of have that with Stevens, who is still relatively young in goalkeeping terms.

All put together, this is why many supporters are less than happy with the current goalkeeping situation. But on reflection it's not really that surprising, given the chaotic and disordered shambles of a transfer window has left us with similar concerns over virtually every other position on the field.

 

[tim lane]

For me, that means nothing. Absolutely nothing. First off, we've had the kindest fixture list of any team in the League, playing 9 of the other 11 sides that currently make up the bottom half of the table. Also, if you're playing against Oxford this season and go 1 up, why would you keep attacking at full throttle? We are so toothless, devoid of creativity and ideas, slow, placid. Score 1 against Oxford and in most cases you will at worst get a point, so just sit in, defend compactly and save those small energy percentages for those games in December and January where you will need every ounce. Contrast that to last season - teams would score 2 against us and that would often not be enough to get away with a point.

Another thing, I pay attention to who posts what, and you are always a staunch defender of Eastwood. I don't think anyone is saying he is completely crap, but what is wrong with wanting better? He does still make some good saves, just as he's made plenty of errors over the last 2 years. I think he's very good in 1 on 1 situations (May at Cheltenham, that last gasp save at Charlton last week), but his all round goalkeeping is not at the level for where we are aiming to be. What we need is a keeper performing like Stevens in 20/21, who wins you points and can change your season. Lets not forget his penalty save at home to Charlton with the last action of the game, that earned us a 0-0 draw. Three days later, he saved another penalty away at Swindon, in a game that eventually ended 2-1 to us. What happened at the end of the season? We snuck into the playoffs on the final day.

Last season, Stevens was a long way off those standards. He obviously had long term illness as a possible mitigating factor, so for me it remains to be seen whether 20/21 was the exception and he was just temporarily performing above his normal ability, or if indeed the illness hampered him so much and he needed longer to recover. That's why I think it was actually a decent idea to get him out on a season loan to a team at this level where he'll go and play 40+ games. Also experience of another dressing room, new voices to listen to, and learn and develop different routines. I'm very happy to read Ryan's post above about how it seems to be going for him so far. However, I fully expected that meant we would go out and bring in a new number 1. I assumed we rated McGinty highly enough that we intended him to be our starter, maybe after a being allowed a month or so to settle in to his new country and new surroundings. But given we are just seeing him in the odd cup game, clearly he's very much seen as number 2 and a young keeper to develop. For me then it's strange we brought in a young prospect in this position, given we already kind of have that with Stevens, who is still relatively young in goalkeeping terms.

All put together, this is why many supporters are less than happy with the current goalkeeping situation. But on reflection it's not really that surprising, given the chaotic and disordered shambles of a transfer window has left us with similar concerns over virtually every other position on the field.

I have to say #nige01ox that is an extraordinary well constructed argument, which I fully take on board.

 

[RyanioBirdio]

Last season, Stevens was a long way off those standards. He obviously had long term illness as a possible mitigating factor, so for me it remains to be seen whether 20/21 was the exception and he was just temporarily performing above his normal ability, or if indeed the illness hampered him so much and he needed longer to recover. That's why I think it was actually a decent idea to get him out on a season loan to a team at this level where he'll go and play 40+ games. Also experience of another dressing room, new voices to listen to, and learn and develop different routines. I'm very happy to read Ryan's post above about how it seems to be going for him so far. However, I fully expected that meant we would go out and bring in a new number 1. I assumed we rated McGinty highly enough that we intended him to be our starter, maybe after a being allowed a month or so to settle in to his new country and new surroundings. But given we are just seeing him in the odd cup game, clearly he's very much seen as number 2 and a young keeper to develop. For me then it's strange we brought in a young prospect in this position, given we already kind of have that with Stevens, who is still relatively young in goalkeeping terms.

Stevens is not liked and knows it. He is enjoying being away. Hopefully that will change soon.

As far as keepers are concerned, it really is madness that we suddenly decided to change the type of goalkeeper that we want to use to a sweeper type, and so having loaned out the agile one who is comfortable playing a short game with his feet and signed a third keeper who apparently doesn’t play this way (or isn’t good enough at it), we decide that the best thing to do is train a 33 year old who is known for being very flat footed as a runner to do it. That is truly something else.

 

[SirAndyOfCrosby]

For me, that means nothing. Absolutely nothing. First off, we've had the kindest fixture list of any team in the League, playing 9 of the other 11 sides that currently make up the bottom half of the table. Also, if you're playing against Oxford this season and go 1 up, why would you keep attacking at full throttle? We are so toothless, devoid of creativity and ideas, slow, placid. Score 1 against Oxford and in most cases you will at worst get a point, so just sit in, defend compactly and save those small energy percentages for those games in December and January where you will need every ounce. Contrast that to last season - teams would score 2 against us and that would often not be enough to get away with a point.

Another thing, I pay attention to who posts what, and you are always a staunch defender of Eastwood. I don't think anyone is saying he is completely crap, but what is wrong with wanting better? He does still make some good saves, just as he's made plenty of errors over the last 2 years. I think he's very good in 1 on 1 situations (May at Cheltenham, that last gasp save at Charlton last week), but his all round goalkeeping is not at the level for where we are aiming to be. What we need is a keeper performing like Stevens in 20/21, who wins you points and can change your season. Lets not forget his penalty save at home to Charlton with the last action of the game, that earned us a 0-0 draw. Three days later, he saved another penalty away at Swindon, in a game that eventually ended 2-1 to us. What happened at the end of the season? We snuck into the playoffs on the final day.

Last season, Stevens was a long way off those standards. He obviously had long term illness as a possible mitigating factor, so for me it remains to be seen whether 20/21 was the exception and he was just temporarily performing above his normal ability, or if indeed the illness hampered him so much and he needed longer to recover. That's why I think it was actually a decent idea to get him out on a season loan to a team at this level where he'll go and play 40+ games. Also experience of another dressing room, new voices to listen to, and learn and develop different routines. I'm very happy to read Ryan's post above about how it seems to be going for him so far. However, I fully expected that meant we would go out and bring in a new number 1. I assumed we rated McGinty highly enough that we intended him to be our starter, maybe after a being allowed a month or so to settle in to his new country and new surroundings. But given we are just seeing him in the odd cup game, clearly he's very much seen as number 2 and a young keeper to develop. For me then it's strange we brought in a young prospect in this position, given we already kind of have that with Stevens, who is still relatively young in goalkeeping terms.

All put together, this is why many supporters are less than happy with the current goalkeeping situation. But on reflection it's not really that surprising, given the chaotic and disordered shambles of a transfer window has left us with similar concerns over virtually every other position on the field.

Excellent post.

I would add that the xGA enhances this. Based on chances created against us, we'd actually be expected to have conceded fewer goals than we have.
It may sound odd, but the way you have to think of it, is - who has done better - the keeper who has conceded 12 from 42 excellent chances or the keeper who has conceded 9 from just 12?

I think also that with Eastwood it's not necessarily obvious clangers - dropping a cross, fumbling it through the legs - the sort of stuff everyone obviously notices. Instead it's more positioning and speed of reaction or failing to get across quickly. Perhaps less obvious but still apparent and still detrimental.

Passable as an emergency back up. Not good enough for a No.1 for a side at this level now, certainly not one with designs on promotion.

 

[Yellowmania]

I watched McGinty on the pitch Saturday. He was doing all sorts of flicks & tricks with the ball at his feet. He looked pretty natural at it and not something you see keepers normally do.

 

[werthersoriginal]

Excellent post.

I would add that the xGA enhances this. Based on chances created against us, we'd actually be expected to have conceded fewer goals than we have.
It may sound odd, but the way you have to think of it, is - who has done better - the keeper who has conceded 12 from 42 excellent chances or the keeper who has conceded 9 from just 12?

I think also that with Eastwood it's not necessarily obvious clangers - dropping a cross, fumbling it through the legs - the sort of stuff everyone obviously notices. Instead it's more positioning and speed of reaction or failing to get across quickly. Perhaps less obvious but still apparent and still detrimental.

Passable as an emergency back up. Not good enough for a No.1 for a side at this level now, certainly not one with designs on promotion.

However Stevens had very bad stats last season? It’s good for us in the long term if he’s playing better now.

 

[Oxymoron]

Maybe this is the problem

Wigan face FA rap after taking on Cardiff with one goal BIGGER than the other

CARDIFF’S 3-1 Championship victory at Wigan faces an FA probe after it was played with one goal BIGGER than the other. Bluebirds caretaker boss Mark Hudson revealed two of his coaching staff spotte…

www.thesun.co.uk

 

[holdsteady]

Stevens is not liked and knows it. He is enjoying being away. Hopefully that will change soon.

As far as keepers are concerned, it really is madness that we suddenly decided to change the type of goalkeeper that we want to use to a sweeper type, and so having loaned out the agile one who is comfortable playing a short game with his feet and signed a third keeper who apparently doesn’t play this way (or isn’t good enough at it), we decide that the best thing to do is train a 33 year old who is known for being very flat footed as a runner to do it. That is truly something else.

It just joins the list of mad decisions taken since the end of last season. With the money coming in and the room made in the squad by players leaving, despite a dip in form at the end of 21/22 it was possible to go into the summer full of hope of building up to a bright new dawn under Robinson. Instead it’s just been bad decisions since then that’s led to this mess, with the goalkeeper situation being amongst it.

You always got the feeling that the Eastwood to Stevens change was forced on Robinson by Eastwood being in terrible form and that only Stevens being as good as he was (when he first came in) kept him in the team, anything less and he would of found a way to get Eastwood back in as the strange 3 year extension deal for an ageing, out of form keeper shows, Eastwood is very much part of Robinsons inner circle.

 

[holdsteady]

However Stevens had very bad stats last season? It’s good for us in the long term if he’s playing better now.

So did Eastwood though?

 

[Oxymoron]

he would of found a way to get Eastwood back

Last season, Eastwood played when Stevens had his illness, but as soon as he was recovered, he resumed between the sticks. Eastwood only got back the starting place after that when Stevens had Covid and once again, as soon as he recovered, he played out the rest of the season as first choice. IIRC, Eastwood was not the calamity keeper we had seen in the previous season, but Stevens was always first choice keeper when fit.

 

[holdsteady]

Last season, Eastwood played when Stevens had his illness, but as soon as he was recovered, he resumed between the sticks. Eastwood only got back the starting place after that when Stevens had Covid and once again, as soon as he recovered, he played out the rest of the season as first choice. IIRC, Eastwood was not the calamity keeper we had seen in the previous season, but Stevens was always first choice keeper when fit.

Which one was loaned out though? The youngster with a future and a possible sell on fee or the ageing player on the way down?