National News A Question of Sport

[unification]

One point to make about QoS. BBC still hold the intellectual rights to it so it can stay ‘cancelled’ for as long as they want it.

I suspect it’ll return in another format in the not too distant future.

It’ll still be too ‘woke’ for some because it’s the BBC.

 

[werthersoriginal]

I get what you are saying but why mess up this show and cancel it for that reason? Its viewing figures still held up, it couldn’t perform miracles and bring back family viewing but very, very few if any shows do, be nothing much on the BBC if that was required.

It feels like this has happened because the people that watch it are elderly and not fashionable, the BBC was a bit embarrassed by it, which given the licence fee is not acceptable. It’s also bizarre that the BBC seems to scorn it’s base, the bulk of its viewership, seems embarrassed by the fact that it’s been left with an elderly demographic rather than the hipsters that it wants. It also seems worried about these people dying off and it being left with no one which is wrong headed, as, short of a virus more deadly than Covid, old people always get replaced by more old people.

The BBC does have lots of long running programmes that can’t go on for ever. I kind of agree that they need to cater for older people rather than chasing kids who probably aren’t interested, i mainly watch BBC4 but they’ve starved it of funding and just show repeats now. I like the ancient history/ classic rock docs crossover

 

[tonyw]

It feels like this has happened because the people that watch it are elderly and not fashionable, the BBC was a bit embarrassed by it, which given the licence fee is not acceptable. It’s also bizarre that the BBC seems to scorn it’s base, the bulk of its viewership, seems embarrassed by the fact that it’s been left with an elderly demographic rather than the hipsters that it wants. It also seems worried about these people dying off and it being left with no one which is wrong headed, as, short of a virus more deadly than Covid, old people always get replaced by more old people.

Yeah, but the old people of today love QoS because they used to watch it when they were younger and like the format/gentle humour/terrible jumpers.
Younger people today are not going to turn 50 and suddenly start watching old people TV!

The same is happening in the US insofar as the traditional network broadcasters (CBS, NBC, ABC, FOX) are basically now only watched by old people so they just keep making shows that appeal to them to bring in whatever viewership they can while they still can (as far as I can tell, it's mostly police procedural shows like CSI New Orleans/Sydney/Scunthope.....). The only way they get big viewership any more is by paying eye-watering sums of money for the major sporting events.

The difference is that those broadcasters are owned by major media conglomerates that recognize that when their current generation of viewers die off, they are not going to be replaced by the next - and instead they are diversifying their content and platforms to also own streaming services that provide at least some of what the younger generations want, how they want it. Network TV is going to be stone dead within a generation, and everybody knows it.

But the BBC still seems to be raging against the dying of the light and still trying to stay relevant. It won't and it's doomed if it continues this strategy.
I reckon they should at this point be focused on streaming, because they have a back catalog that can put any other media company (even Disney) to shame, and they could use that (rather than a license fee) to fund the generation of a wide array of new content. But they still seem obsessed with trying to maintain their traditional models to the bitter end.

 

[ECYellow]

The BBC does have lots of long running programmes that can’t go on for ever. I kind of agree that they need to cater for older people rather than chasing kids who probably aren’t interested, i mainly watch BBC4 but they’ve starved it of funding and just show repeats now. I like the ancient history/ classic rock docs crossover

One BBC stalwart show that certainly shouldn’t be going on forever is SPOTY.

Good god, it’s absolute crap nowadays and has been for about a decade or more.

Gone of the days of actually picking the personality of the year. It now feels rather agenda driven and lacking in the very thing it’s supposed to be about, personality and achievement.

 

[MarkG]

Perhaps its a throw back to the 1970s and 80s when there was no pay tv and only four channels.
Grandstand / World of Sport on a Saturday, and formula 1, MOTD, rugby internationals, horse racing, and olympics and international football were all available free to view.
So the general public all saw the same sport, whereas now you would need four or five subscription services to keep up with live football, cricket, F1 etc.
Also having just one light entertainment sports quiz on a Friday night on BBC1 meant that more of the viewing population would watch it. Now they have dozens of choices as well as catchup tv etc

 

[Older Shotts]

One BBC stalwart show that certainly shouldn’t be going on forever is SPOTY.

Good god, it’s absolute crap nowadays and has been for about a decade or more.

Gone of the days of actually picking the personality of the year. It now feels rather agenda driven and lacking in the very thing it’s supposed to be about, personality and achievement.

Totally agree. That woman that won it isn't even a good role model for young girls - she turned up to collect it in her underwear.

 

[werthersoriginal]

Totally agree. That woman that won it isn't even a good role model for young girls - she turned up to collect it in her underwear.

Her underwear, you say?

Gotta say I like Mary Earps and would give to her for the 'f*** off' after the penalty save alone. But I'm never sure if the award is for best achiever or most interesting personality.

 

[unification]

One BBC stalwart show that certainly shouldn’t be going on forever is SPOTY.

Good god, it’s absolute crap nowadays and has been for about a decade or more.

Gone of the days of actually picking the personality of the year. It now feels rather agenda driven and lacking in the very thing it’s supposed to be about, personality and achievement.

What does this mean? It's a public vote and the public chose a female footballer - the second in two years. If the public really wanted to decry the BBC shortlist, they could have voted for someone else. They didn't and went for the Queen of Stops instead and why not? She had a great World Cup and did her bit again in raising the women's game. Unlike previous winners (see below), she has a personality on her as well.

'Odd' years often make the SPOTY shortlist look a bit less stellar. No Olympics and no men's World Cup obviously impact that. I am surprised that Josh Kerr wasn't shortlisted bearing in mind his 1500m win at the World Athletics Championships but there we go.

I don't know why they call it 'Personality' when 'Sportsperson' would work just as fine. A lack of personality hasn't stopped serial dullards in Andy Murray, Lewis Hamilton and Steve Davis winning it in the past

 

[ZeroTheHero]

I don't know why they call it 'Personality' when 'Sportsperson' would work just as fine. A lack of personality hasn't stopped serial dullards in Andy Murray, Lewis Hamilton and Steve Davis winning it in the past

I see your Steve Davis ( he actually *is* quite interesting - see his work with The Utopia Strong) and raise you a Nigel Mansell.

 

[unification]

I see your Steve Davis ( he actually *is* quite interesting - see his work with The Utopia Strong) and raise you a Nigel Mansell.

You’re right. Davis totally buys into the ‘Mr Interesting’ persona and plays up to it to amusing effect.

With Formula 1 being the dullest sport on the planet, it stands to reason that boring people are attracted to it - to watch cars go round in circles and having an interest in driving said cars in circles.

 

[m]

I see your Steve Davis ( he actually *is* quite interesting - see his work with The Utopia Strong) and raise you a Nigel Mansell.

Was going to make this very point!

 

[ECYellow]

What does this mean? It's a public vote and the public chose a female footballer - the second in two years. If the public really wanted to decry the BBC shortlist, they could have voted for someone else. They didn't and went for the Queen of Stops instead and why not? She had a great World Cup and did her bit again in raising the women's game. Unlike previous winners (see below), she has a personality on her as well.

'Odd' years often make the SPOTY shortlist look a bit less stellar. No Olympics and no men's World Cup obviously impact that. I am surprised that Josh Kerr wasn't shortlisted bearing in mind his 1500m win at the World Athletics Championships but there we go.

I don't know why they call it 'Personality' when 'Sportsperson' would work just as fine. A lack of personality hasn't stopped serial dullards in Andy Murray, Lewis Hamilton and Steve Davis winning it in the past

The public vote for one of those who are shortlisted. That shortlist is produced by the BBC's Director of Sport. They literally chose the 6 person shortlist. The BBC, across their network are pushing agendas of all kinds, upon the watching (paying) public. Some can see it and some choose not too, that's no problem.

As for the SPOTY award, a few names that are more deserving of the award, imo are:

- Ronnie O'Sullivan won his 8th UK open title this year, meanwhile remaining the best player in his field, at the age of 48!
- Frankie Dettori has continued to ride winners all over the world, in possibly the most gruelling of sports and has been a the top of horse racing for 30/35 years
- Kevin Sinfield ran 7 (SEVEN!) marathons in 7 days, in support of MND and Rob Burrows. Not only has Sinfield been one of the best to play Rugby league, he has now mastered marathon running on a scale everyone of us could only dream of (not to mention, he has raised millions for MND).

Others that come into the conversation and are more deserving imo, if Earps is seriously in the elite bracket are:

- Katarina Johnson-Thompson won the World Championship Heptathlon this year. This was after being severely hampered by injury for some time. She was the best, across 7 different events. Takes some doing!
- Dave Ryding has flown the flag for Britain in alpine skiing during his long career. In an industry where he gets very little financial support from Sport England/UK athletics (versus his counterparts from France, Austria, Swiss, Italy, USA, Canada etc), the fact he's managed to get multiple podium finishes at World Cup level is astounding. His latest came in February, in Austria.
- Leon Edwards is a world champion (something Earps didn't manage) at welterweight in UFC. A literal world champion. He didn't even make the shortlist

You mentioned Earps has 'done her bit raising the women's game'. While that is unquestionable, when did this award become more about profiling and selling GK shirts, rather than individual and collective achievement? For reference, this is the same GK that made an absolute howler at Wembley last month, which in turn cost England (Playing as Britain) a place at the Olympics next year (they missed out on qualificaton by one goal to the Netherlands).

Personally speaking, it just doesn't feel like this award is based upon solely sporting achievement anymore and that is a shame.

 

[Big Ron]

I see your Steve Davis ( he actually *is* quite interesting - see his work with The Utopia Strong) and raise you a Nigel Mansell.

I think Andy Murray actually has a dry sense of humour but you are spot on here - Lewis Hamilton is dull as ditch water but Mansell is the absolute standout, a hollowed out shell of a man seemingly devoid of any personality traits.

 

[ZeroTheHero]

The public vote for one of those who are shortlisted. That shortlist is produced by the BBC's Director of Sport. They literally chose the 6 person shortlist. The BBC, across their network are pushing agendas of all kinds, upon the watching (paying) public. Some can see it and some choose not too, that's no problem.

As for the SPOTY award, a few names that are more deserving of the award, imo are:

- Ronnie O'Sullivan won his 8th UK open title this year, meanwhile remaining the best player in his field, at the age of 48!
- Frankie Dettori has continued to ride winners all over the world, in possibly the most gruelling of sports and has been a the top of horse racing for 30/35 years
- Kevin Sinfield ran 7 (SEVEN!) marathons in 7 days, in support of MND and Rob Burrows. Not only has Sinfield been one of the best to play Rugby league, he has now mastered marathon running on a scale everyone of us could only dream of (not to mention, he has raised millions for MND).

Others that come into the conversation and are more deserving imo, if Earps is seriously in the elite bracket are:

- Katarina Johnson-Thompson won the World Championship Heptathlon this year. This was after being severely hampered by injury for some time. She was the best, across 7 different events. Takes some doing!
- Dave Ryding has flown the flag for Britain in alpine skiing during his long career. In an industry where he gets very little financial support from Sport England/UK athletics (versus his counterparts from France, Austria, Swiss, Italy, USA, Canada etc), the fact he's managed to get multiple podium finishes at World Cup level is astounding. His latest came in February, in Austria.
- Leon Edwards is a world champion (something Earps didn't manage) at welterweight in UFC. A literal world champion. He didn't even make the shortlist

Of your list, Dettori and KJT *were* among those the public could have voted for - they were on the shortlist. The public chose Earps in preference. So while you might disagree with those included on the shortlist (I think most of them are decent options), there are probably quite a few who deserve to be on there and weren't. I have to admit I hadn't heard of either Dave Ryding or Leon Edwards (neither skiing nor UFC are my sort of thing), so the chances of the public voting for them would have been pretty small, although that doesn't mean they aren't deserving of recognition.

Probably an award that is looking a bit tired now (and comparing achievements in one sport is hard enough without trying to do so across different ones!).

 

[ECYellow]

Of your list, Dettori and KJT *were* among those the public could have voted for - they were on the shortlist. The public chose Earps in preference. So while you might disagree with those included on the shortlist (I think most of them are decent options), there are probably quite a few who deserve to be on there and weren't. I have to admit I hadn't heard of either Dave Ryding or Leon Edwards (neither skiing nor UFC are my sort of thing), so the chances of the public voting for them would have been pretty small, although that doesn't mean they aren't deserving of recognition.

Probably an award that is looking a bit tired now (and comparing achievements in one sport is hard enough without trying to do so across different ones!).

Leon and Dave have done superbly well, despite the limited coverage that they receive from the mainstream, like the BBC. The lack of coverage is most probably why you haven't heard of them. I mean, hand on heart, had you heard of Mary Earps three years ago? Probably not.

Ladies in football were rather fortunate that they got an opportunity to move to an elite level, thanks to untold investment in womens football. It would be great to see some other sports, like UFC and Alpine, be afforded similar opportunities.

 

[unification]

The public vote for one of those who are shortlisted. That shortlist is produced by the BBC's Director of Sport. They literally chose the 6 person shortlist. The BBC, across their network are pushing agendas of all kinds, upon the watching (paying) public. Some can see it and some choose not too, that's no problem.

As for the SPOTY award, a few names that are more deserving of the award, imo are:

- Ronnie O'Sullivan won his 8th UK open title this year, meanwhile remaining the best player in his field, at the age of 48!
- Frankie Dettori has continued to ride winners all over the world, in possibly the most gruelling of sports and has been a the top of horse racing for 30/35 years
- Kevin Sinfield ran 7 (SEVEN!) marathons in 7 days, in support of MND and Rob Burrows. Not only has Sinfield been one of the best to play Rugby league, he has now mastered marathon running on a scale everyone of us could only dream of (not to mention, he has raised millions for MND).

Others that come into the conversation and are more deserving imo, if Earps is seriously in the elite bracket are:

- Katarina Johnson-Thompson won the World Championship Heptathlon this year. This was after being severely hampered by injury for some time. She was the best, across 7 different events. Takes some doing!
- Dave Ryding has flown the flag for Britain in alpine skiing during his long career. In an industry where he gets very little financial support from Sport England/UK athletics (versus his counterparts from France, Austria, Swiss, Italy, USA, Canada etc), the fact he's managed to get multiple podium finishes at World Cup level is astounding. His latest came in February, in Austria.
- Leon Edwards is a world champion (something Earps didn't manage) at welterweight in UFC. A literal world champion. He didn't even make the shortlist

You mentioned Earps has 'done her bit raising the women's game'. While that is unquestionable, when did this award become more about profiling and selling GK shirts, rather than individual and collective achievement? For reference, this is the same GK that made an absolute howler at Wembley last month, which in turn cost England (Playing as Britain) a place at the Olympics next year (they missed out on qualificaton by one goal to the Netherlands).

Personally speaking, it just doesn't feel like this award is based upon solely sporting achievement anymore and that is a shame.

By agenda pushing, do you mean 'making women's football a thing'? It's been done to death on here. If you don't like it, don't watch it. It's remarkably easy to avoid. It's staggering how many GB News-watching types get so up in arms about something they have control over. As mentioned above, I find Formula One boring. If others like it, go ahead and watch it. I'll just skip past any F1 content and not click or comment on stories related to it. You do you.

As @ZeroTheHero says, a number of those people you listed were short-listed. The public decided that Mary Earps deserved it. There's no great conspiracy here. I suspect because Kevin Sinfield has been nominated for something similar before stopped any chance of him being nominated. Plus he isn't active in rugby league any more as far as I know.

Some years it's the person behind the biggest British sporting achievement who wins it (eg, Emma Raducanu in 2021, Andy Murray 2013) and others it can be a culmination of things (Tony McCoy in 2010 with the win in the Grand National being the one to tip it; Ryan Giggs in 2009). It's why its titled sports personality. You can argue to the back teeth why one person's achievements are more deserving of another, but it's a public poll and the public who bother to vote get to decide.

Like all award ceremonies though it is completely subjective. Can you really compare the achievements of a footballer in a team sport versus a heptathlete who has to take on seven events? I did find it amusing one year when Jess Ennis finished third and Phil Taylor, gut bulging out, waddled up to the stage ahead of her in second place. It's at best a chance to dress up (or get halfway there as Earps seemed to) and hand out some gongs for people doing their job. And like all award ceremonies including the Oscars, Grammy's, Golden Globes, BRITs, etc people take it far more seriously than they need to.

 

[Marked Ox]

Leon and Dave have done superbly well, despite the limited coverage that they receive from the mainstream, like the BBC. The lack of coverage is most probably why you haven't heard of them. I mean, hand on heart, had you heard of Mary Earps three years ago? Probably not.

Ladies in football were rather fortunate that they got an opportunity to move to an elite level, thanks to untold investment in womens football. It would be great to see some other sports, like UFC and Alpine, be afforded similar opportunities.

Eurosport is the channel for ski sports. Often watch Dave Ryding in slalom as well as Ski Biathlon which is a great watch.

 

[werthersoriginal]

What does this mean? It's a public vote and the public chose a female footballer - the second in two years. If the public really wanted to decry the BBC shortlist, they could have voted for someone else. They didn't and went for the Queen of Stops instead and why not? She had a great World Cup and did her bit again in raising the women's game. Unlike previous winners (see below), she has a personality on her as well.

'Odd' years often make the SPOTY shortlist look a bit less stellar. No Olympics and no men's World Cup obviously impact that. I am surprised that Josh Kerr wasn't shortlisted bearing in mind his 1500m win at the World Athletics Championships but there we go.

I don't know why they call it 'Personality' when 'Sportsperson' would work just as fine. A lack of personality hasn't stopped serial dullards in Andy Murray, Lewis Hamilton and Steve Davis winning it in the past

I think Andy Murray is quite interesting as a person, he's witty and principled - just comes over as dour when he's playing.

 

[tonyw]

- Kevin Sinfield ran 7 (SEVEN!) marathons in 7 days, in support of MND and Rob Burrows. Not only has Sinfield been one of the best to play Rugby league, he has now mastered marathon running on a scale everyone of us could only dream of (not to mention, he has raised millions for MND).

Eddie Izzard did 43 marathons in 51 days in 2009 for Sport Relief, 27 marathons in 27 days in 2016 and 29 in 29 days in 2020, and then did 32 in 31 days on a treadmill during the pandemic whilst simultaneously interviewing celebrities before doing a virtual comedy gig in the evening every day! Raised millions for charity, and has bags of personality. Should also have won multiple SPOTY awards?

Nah, for better or for worse, this award celebrates the individual that's either won the biggest event in a high profile individual sport, or been the most influential player on a team that's done the best in a high profile team sport. If you play a minor sport, then maybe you've got a chance if you do something truly spectacular in an Olympic year....but no shot the other three out of four.

This year, no Brit won the biggest event in any of the high profile individual sports (tennis, golf, cycling, F1....I guess Tyson Fury is still heavyweight world champ but he didn't have a big fight this year......hell, we didn't even win the snooker!). Men's football team didn't have a tournament; Cricket team failed to win the Ashes or the World Cup.

So it wasn't exactly a banner year for British sport, and pivoting to the Women's football team, who got as close to winning the big one as they ever have, makes sense. Earps was the key player on that team during the tournament so she seems to me to be a very logical winner......

 

[boogaloo]

I have no problem with Mary Earps winning SPOTY. She is the best female keeper in the world, won the golden glove at the World Cup, and played a significant part in helping England reach the final. If it were Jordan Pickford and the men's team had reached the final, he'd have been a shoe-in.

As for the others:-

Stuart Broad - Did fairly well in the Ashes, but this ultimately comes down sentimentality because he retired.
Frankie Dettori - He's only won 30 races this year. He is semi-retired. Like Broad it comes down to sentimentality. Although how he's missed out again on the lifetime achievement award is another matter.
Ronnie O'Sullivan - On merit alone, he would have won it by now, but the fact he's a complete bell-end does not help his cause.
Rory McIlroy - Didn't win any majors. Probably past his best.
Katarina Johnson Thompson - Was a fairly good shout to be fair, although the World Championship probably isn't quite as prestigious as the Olympics.