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Wenger

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tonyw

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Man, this forum has changed.
A few years ago, if I'd come on here several hours after Arsene Wenger departed, I'd have found a 17 page thread (with 16 and a half of the pages being Baldy, Junior and Boogaloo going back and forth.....).
Now, I'm starting one myself.

But, thoughts people?

Seems to me an Arsenal career that can be neatly divided into two halves - the first half a massive success, bringing an innovative style of football and recruiting policy to produce some of the Premier League's greatest teams, and lead Arsenal through what could have been a rocky financial time and firmly establish them as one of the goliaths of English football. The second half displaying a stubbornness and inflexibility that left the club uncompetitive for the biggest honours, and saw them being passed in the pyramid not only by the moneybags of Chelsea and Manchester City (understandable), but also lately by Liverpool and Spurs (less so, given their lesser resources).

So both one of the great figures of the Premier League era, and someone who held on probably three years too long.

Now let's see a) who they replace him with, and b) whether that individual will actually try and replace Patrick Vieira finally.

Assume this means that Tisdale will also take over the 'longest serving manager in England' mantle?
 
Arsene Wenger, changed the game in this country, he was one of the first to bring the importance in Nutrition, fitness and well being. Out went the drinking culture and in came the proper athletes that we see at the highest level today.
 
tonyw said:
Now let's see a) who they replace him with, and b) whether that individual will actually try and replace Patrick Vieira finally.
Click to expand...

That person may actually BE Patrick Vieira.
Have got an old recording of a report on how the Kassam was going to be built (four sides and everything) on SkySports News. The lead story was Arsene Wenger's first training session. Seems a long time ago now.
 
To me Arsene Wenger helped to change the way that football is played in this Country. I have a friend who goes to a lot of non league games. He maintains that some teams 3-4 levels lower than OUFC try and play football 'the right way'. He maintains that Wenger started the 'revolution' away from the long ball game that many English clubs used to play.

'The invincibles' were not only hugely successful (obviously), but played with huge flair and were great to watch,

I know a number of Arsenal fans though and generally they have bordered on losing respect from Wenger. Watching Arsenal games on TV with swathes of empty seats says a lot.....

Arsenal won the FA Cup what 3-4 years ago and that was their first trophy win for a while. I thought that Wenger should have left then- legacy intact. It is a real shame that since then he has carried on and the team has finished lower and lower. The Arsenal Board are. in my view totally to blame for not 'suggesting' that Arsene left at that stage/ They appear to have done that now but too late to have not tainted his legacy.

Overall though a tremendous contribution to the English game,
 
Think the move from Highbury made a change to how Wenger operated.

Who's next in the manager's seat?
 
For me a very good manager who outstayed his time and got overtaken, should have gone years ago but was at a club that was just happy with fourth place, they are two points above Burnley now so it shows how dangerous that attitude is, hopefully when a bit of time has passed the later period will be balanced a bit with some perspective on his earlier brilliant spell, unfortunately he left a bit of a stain on his record by not knowing when to call it a day, a decision that should not of been his to make really, but Arsenals massive failure in planning probably led to a couple of uncomfortable seasons where there best manager since Herbert Chapman was getting a lot of stick, a lot of it justified.

But he was a pioneer in England, a man of some principles (if a bit one eyed, with that shut when it suited him) a decent (but not a saint) human being, rightly he is getting praise and I am glad he is leaving as another year would of just been painful, now he can take the plaudits and go with the dignity he deserves, his name will be up there with the greats, the missing European success will count him out of being the greatest but no shame in that.

Next season will be the first since 86(?) with neither Wenger or Ferguson at the helm of one club, feels like a bit of an end to an era with those two so linked, a bit sad really.
 
It's a shame he tarnished an incredible legacy by hanging on too long trying to prove he was right. It's been embarrassing to watch a manager once at the bleeding edge of football become a has been.

But anyway, I didn't see it.
 
holdsteady said:
For me a very good manager who outstayed his time and got overtaken, should have gone years ago but was at a club that was just happy with fourth place, they are two points above Burnley now so it shows how dangerous that attitude is, hopefully when a bit of time has passed the later period will be balanced a bit with some perspective on his earlier brilliant spell, unfortunately he left a bit of a stain on his record by not knowing when to call it a day, a decision that should not of been his to make really, but Arsenals massive failure in planning probably led to a couple of uncomfortable seasons where there best manager since Herbert Chapman was getting a lot of stick, a lot of it justified.

But he was a pioneer in England, a man of some principles (if a bit one eyed, with that shut when it suited him) a decent (but not a saint) human being, rightly he is getting praise and I am glad he is leaving as another year would of just been painful, now he can take the plaudits and go with the dignity he deserves, his name will be up there with the greats, the missing European success will count him out of being the greatest but no shame in that.

Next season will be the first since 86(?) with neither Wenger or Ferguson at the helm of one club, feels like a bit of an end to an era with those two so linked, a bit sad really.
Click to expand...

Inspired post.
 
Wenger changed the way football was played and how players conducted themselves in the 90’s. His problem was he didn’t keep ahead of the game and didn’t progress while all the other teams and managers caught up.
Even Big Sam was ahead of Wenger when it came to using technology to assess performances.

Wenger will be remembered for an exciting team in the late 90’s, the invincible and bringing Henry to the premier league. He will also be remembered for being stubborn and out staying his welcome.
 
I have said this before Wenger has taken a lot of unfair stick..there are only 3 domestic trophies and if champions league qualification is not to be included then there are 18 other failures....Along with manure they were dominating the premiership until Chelsea and Lately City bought the title..
For those who say he has stayed too long who else could possibly have stopped Chelsea and City buying the title?

Some Arsenal fans have got their wish but let's see what they achieve in the next 5/6 seasons
 
tonyw said:
Man, this forum has changed.
A few years ago, if I'd come on here several hours after Arsene Wenger departed, I'd have found a 17 page thread (with 16 and a half of the pages being Baldy, Junior and Boogaloo going back and forth.....).
Now, I'm starting one myself.

But, thoughts people?

Seems to me an Arsenal career that can be neatly divided into two halves - the first half a massive success, bringing an innovative style of football and recruiting policy to produce some of the Premier League's greatest teams, and lead Arsenal through what could have been a rocky financial time and firmly establish them as one of the goliaths of English football. The second half displaying a stubbornness and inflexibility that left the club uncompetitive for the biggest honours, and saw them being passed in the pyramid not only by the moneybags of Chelsea and Manchester City (understandable), but also lately by Liverpool and Spurs (less so, given their lesser resources).

So both one of the great figures of the Premier League era, and someone who held on probably three years too long.

Now let's see a) who they replace him with, and b) whether that individual will actually try and replace Patrick Vieira finally.

Assume this means that Tisdale will also take over the 'longest serving manager in England' mantle?
Click to expand...

Sorry, cumbersome way of suggesting that your description could apply to an awful lot of players that have been at Arsenal too
 
tonyw said:
Assume this means that Tisdale will also take over the 'longest serving manager in England' mantle?
Click to expand...

More amazingly, it will mean that Gareth Ainsworth moved up to third place on the list.......!
Eddie Howe and Sean Dyche will top the prem list, both starting their current roles in October 2012
 
horseman said:
I have said this before Wenger has taken a lot of unfair stick..there are only 3 domestic trophies and if champions league qualification is not to be included then there are 18 other failures....Along with manure they were dominating the premiership until Chelsea and Lately City bought the title..
For those who say he has stayed too long who else could possibly have stopped Chelsea and City buying the title?

Some Arsenal fans have got their wish but let's see what they achieve in the next 5/6 seasons
Click to expand...

Agree with this but ultimately, for his OWN sake, he stayed too long. I think he cared too much about the club.
 
Wenger set the bar incredibly high for Arsenal fans. By his own standards, he would seem to have failed in recent years but every club has struggled against the spending might of Russian oligarchs, Arab oil and the most profitable club in the world. Given this failure it's hard to believe he's won 3 of the last 4 FA Cups. Apparently winning the Prem or the Champs League is all that matters to any of us though.

I suspect Arsenal fans are about to discover how difficult it is to follow a class act like Wenger, just as Man Utd struggled after Ferguson. But I think it could be even worse for Arsenal.

Without Ferguson, Man Utd lost the fear factor that every team suffered against them. Without Wenger, Arsenal will just become another of the London clubs. Every manager they appoint will suffer from comparison to Wenger, yet they lack the financial muscle of Man Utd to go out and buy a Paul Pogba.

Arsenal fans have taken Wenger for granted. The brutal reality of how difficult it is to have success in the EPL is slowly going to dawn on them.
 
I think that there were a few times in the later years where it was blindingly obvious that Arsenal needed to buy in top quality players to fill gaps in their team. Only to find that wenger was reluctant. Whatever the reasons, i think Arsenal slowly unwound.
Sad to see really.
 
horseman said:
I have said this before Wenger has taken a lot of unfair stick..there are only 3 domestic trophies and if champions league qualification is not to be included then there are 18 other failures....Along with manure they were dominating the premiership until Chelsea and Lately City bought the title..
For those who say he has stayed too long who else could possibly have stopped Chelsea and City buying the title?

Some Arsenal fans have got their wish but let's see what they achieve in the next 5/6 seasons
Click to expand...

That argument worked until about three years ago. When they were consistently finishing fourth behind Man U and the two moneybags clubs, then you could say that they were meeting reasonable expectations.

But the past two seasons, they've finished comfortably behind both Liverpool and Spurs as well - both of whom have had substantially smaller wage bills than Arsenal - and then of course there was Leicester the year before that. A year where all three of the richer Premier League clubs were in various stages of meltdown, and Arsenal still couldn't muster a serious title challenge.

Sorry, but I think that the stick Wenger has received in the last few years is absolutely fair. His first decade at the club rightly gave him a long managerial leash.....but it should have run out long before now.....
 
Considering he was earning a handsome $10 million a year recently, he was paid for success, not mediocrity.
 
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