International News War Room: Iran v USA

[Matty Greens Left Boot]

Im growing Mangel-wurzel this year and lots of it and squashes. Crown prince will keep throughout the winter. I'm only just finishing last years.

 

[Oxymoron]

Tis an ill wind....

BP profits more than double as Iran war sends oil prices higher

The energy giant said it had seen an "exceptional" performance at its oil trading business.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Matty Greens Left Boot]

Wow. very interesting direction of Travel:

United Arab Emirates to quit oil cartel Opec

The UAE says it is leaving the Opec and Opec+ groups of major oil producing nations.

www.bbc.co.uk

Of course the US is not an OPEC member either

 

[OUFCGav]

remaining members of OPEC.
Algeria, Equatorial Guinea, Gabon, Iran, Iraq, Kuwait, Libya, Nigeria, the Republic of the Congo, Saudi Arabia, and Venezuela.

 

[Matty Greens Left Boot]

remaining members of OPEC.
Algeria, Equatorial Guinea, Gabon, Iran, Iraq, Kuwait, Libya, Nigeria, the Republic of the Congo, Saudi Arabia, and Venezuela.

I cant see it being sustained. Saudi wont be able to hold the rest together. It is the end of a price fixing cartel.

 

[Essexyellows]

remaining members of OPEC.
Algeria, Equatorial Guinea, Gabon, Iran, Iraq, Kuwait, Libya, Nigeria, the Republic of the Congo, Saudi Arabia, and Venezuela.

Nice mix of stable economies that will cope well............. especially if Kuwait & SA go with their brethren & neighbours.

 

[Essexyellows]

Hardly a surprise.............

Police declare terrorist incident after two Jewish men stabbed in north London

The 45-year-old suspect has a history of serious violence and mental health issues, police say. They also say he attempted to stab officers while being arrested.

www.bbc.co.uk

I will await the two coppers who arrested him to be charged with "using excessive force" .........

 

[Coffin Dodger]

Hardly a surprise.............

Police declare terrorist incident after two Jewish men stabbed in north London

The 45-year-old suspect has a history of serious violence and mental health issues, police say. They also say he attempted to stab officers while being arrested.

www.bbc.co.uk

I will await the two coppers who arrested him to be charged with "using excessive force" .........

Well if you think it's ok to kick and stamp on a man incapacitated by a taser, so be it.

 

[Matty Greens Left Boot]

Well if you think it's ok to kick and stamp on a man incapacitated by a taser, so be it.

I'm not massively concerned by it.

 

[Essexyellows]

Well if you think it's ok to kick and stamp on a man incapacitated by a taser, so be it.

I don`t give a flying feck if they knocked seven barrels of s**t out of him.

Don`t go out with a knife, don`t stab two random people and nothing happens.

Obviously the "British Citizen" of Somali origin has "mental health issues" and was referred to Prevent as a potential terrorist.

Its getting close to the point where a lot of people need rounding up and returning to their countries of origin before it happens even more frequently.

 

[Marked Ox]

I don`t give a flying feck if they knocked seven barrels of s**t out of him.

Don`t go out with a knife, don`t stab two random people and nothing happens.

Obviously the "British Citizen" of Somali origin has "mental health issues" and was referred to Prevent as a potential terrorist.

Its getting close to the point where a lot of people need rounding up and returning to their countries of origin before it happens even more frequently.

Where's this bloke getting sent:

Essex neo-Nazi guilty of terror charge after MI5 gun sting

Jurors at the Old Bailey hear Alfie Coleman, 21, believed in fighting a race war.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Boris]

Where's this bloke getting sent:

Essex neo-Nazi guilty of terror charge after MI5 gun sting

Jurors at the Old Bailey hear Alfie Coleman, 21, believed in fighting a race war.

www.bbc.co.uk

Rwanda?

 

[Matty Greens Left Boot]

Where's this bloke getting sent:

Essex neo-Nazi guilty of terror charge after MI5 gun sting

Jurors at the Old Bailey hear Alfie Coleman, 21, believed in fighting a race war.

www.bbc.co.uk

Hopefully the same prison as our Somalian friend from upthread.

 

[Essexyellows]

Where's this bloke getting sent:

Essex neo-Nazi guilty of terror charge after MI5 gun sting

Jurors at the Old Bailey hear Alfie Coleman, 21, believed in fighting a race war.

www.bbc.co.uk

Prison.

As far as i can tell he isn`t a "British Citizen" of Somali origin.

And the terror threat level has been raised to "severe".

 

[Marked Ox]

Hopefully the same prison as our Somalian friend from upthread.

Agreed.

 

[Marked Ox]

Prison.

As far as i can tell he isn`t a "British Citizen" of Somali origin.

And the terror threat level has been raised to "severe".

So, both are British citizens? After all, you want people rounding up so there will be more British citizen neo-Nazis than this one. And rounding up I assume you mean they have actually committed a crime?

 

[tonyw]

Prison.

As far as i can tell he isn`t a "British Citizen" of Somali origin.

And the terror threat level has been raised to "severe".

From all reports, Essa Suleiman came to the UK legally, as a kid, in the early 90s and has long since gained British citizenship.

So he's been here at least 30, if not 35 years, including his entire adult life.

You go on and on about how legal immigration is fine and you support it, but it seems pretty clear that despite someone (or at least his parents) following all the rules, getting citizenship and living his adult life here, you still don't want him to get the same treatment as someone who happened to be born here.


He should be treated exactly the same as the Nazi terrorist. Both should be locked up for the public good, but they're both British so should be treated accordingly.

 

[Boris]

From all reports, Essa Suleiman came to the UK legally, as a kid, in the early 90s and has long since gained British citizenship.

So he's been here at least 30, if not 35 years, including his entire adult life.

You go on and on about how legal immigration is fine and you support it, but it seems pretty clear that despite someone (or at least his parents) following all the rules, getting citizenship and living his adult life here, you still don't want him to get the same treatment as someone who happened to be born here.


He should be treated exactly the same as the Nazi terrorist. Both should be locked up for the public good, but they're both British so should be treated accordingly.

All the far right that say they don't have a problem with migrants as long as they're here legally are lying. They're racists, pure and simple

 

[Essexyellows]

So, both are British citizens? After all, you want people rounding up so there will be more British citizen neo-Nazis than this one. And rounding up I assume you mean they have actually committed a crime?

From all reports, Essa Suleiman came to the UK legally, as a kid, in the early 90s and has long since gained British citizenship.

So he's been here at least 30, if not 35 years, including his entire adult life.

You go on and on about how legal immigration is fine and you support it, but it seems pretty clear that despite someone (or at least his parents) following all the rules, getting citizenship and living his adult life here, you still don't want him to get the same treatment as someone who happened to be born here.


He should be treated exactly the same as the Nazi terrorist. Both should be locked up for the public good, but they're both British so should be treated accordingly.

Arriving legally is perfectly fine, as is gaining citizenship.

However gaining citizenship isn`t a "free pass" to commit terror or try and stab people to death.

With rights come responsibilities, and in my world, if you don`t play by our rules there is no reason not to revoke his citizenship.

 

[Marston Road Yellow]

All the far right that say they don't have a problem with migrants as long as they're here legally are lying. They're racists, pure and simple

They’re not racists…..however …… theres always some “ah but….”

 

[Marston Road Yellow]

Arriving legally is perfectly fine, as is gaining citizenship.

However gaining citizenship isn`t a "free pass" to commit terror or try and stab people to death.

With rights come responsibilities, and in my world, if you don`t play by our rules there is no reason not to revoke his citizenship.

is being born here a free pass to stab someone? At what point do you gain your nationality?

 

[Essexyellows]

All the far right that say they don't have a problem with migrants as long as they're here legally are lying. They're racists, pure and simple

I have no issue with legal migration.
I have no issue with people gaining UK citizenship.
However, that citizenship is something to treasure & honour and should be at risk if you break our societal rules. And we aren`t talking speeding fines here.

If that makes me "racist" please explain how.

 

[Essexyellows]

is being born here a free pass to stab someone? At what point do you gain your nationality?

Kind of answered the nationality aspect yourself.

As for stabbing people the justice system is far to soft on knife crime which is why it is so problematic across the country.

In my world you get a straight 5 years for carrying without due cause and 10 years if you use it in anyway, slotting into the sentencing tariffs below GBH/Attempted Murder or murder.

 

[tonyw]

Arriving legally is perfectly fine, as is gaining citizenship.

However gaining citizenship isn`t a "free pass" to commit terror or try and stab people to death.

With rights come responsibilities, and in my world, if you don`t play by our rules there is no reason not to revoke his citizenship.

Once again - displaying your prejudices.

"Our rules" not "His rules" or even "the rules"; "Our Rules".

Implying that even though he's been here all his life, even though he likely doesn't remember much of anything before he came to the UK - he still doesn't really belong, he's still not really British or part of our system, and should be treated differently than a Neo-Nazi terrorist, just because that terrorist happened to be born on the island.

 

[ubermeistervonmeat]

All the far right that say they don't have a problem with migrants as long as they're here legally are lying. They're racists, pure and s

Once again - displaying your prejudices.

"Our rules" not "His rules" or even "the rules"; "Our Rules".

Implying that even though he's been here all his life, even though he likely doesn't remember much of anything before he came to the UK - he still doesn't really belong, he's still not really British or part of our system, and should be treated differently than a Neo-Nazi terrorist, just because that terrorist happened to be born on the island.

Surely the answer is both are detritus and deserve prison time

 

[tonyw]

Surely the answer is both are detritus and deserve prison time

Yes, that's exactly my answer.

Essex's answer is that one deserves prison time, and one deserves to be kicked out of the country he's lived in for all his life.

 

[Essexyellows]

Once again - displaying your prejudices.

"Our rules" not "His rules" or even "the rules"; "Our Rules".

Implying that even though he's been here all his life, even though he likely doesn't remember much of anything before he came to the UK - he still doesn't really belong, he's still not really British or part of our system, and should be treated differently than a Neo-Nazi terrorist, just because that terrorist happened to be born on the island.

The rules of the UK society..... of which I and he are part so "our rules".

And yes there is a difference, a fact that cannot be changed.

He gained British citizenship, he was given something on the agreement he lived by our rules - he has chosen not to and a gift can be rescinded as easily as given.

The Neo-Nazi was born here and is a British citizen so hasn`t been given anything to rescind, so goes to prison for the requisite time scale for breaking "our" rules.

 

[Followtheox1]

Well if you think it's ok to kick and stamp on a man incapacitated by a taser, so be it.

I think the question is whether he was incapacitated, he was still holding the knife...

 

[tonyw]

The rules of the UK society..... of which I and he are part so "our rules".

And yes there is a difference, a fact that cannot be changed.

He gained British citizenship, he was given something on the agreement he lived by our rules - he has chosen not to and a gift can be rescinded as easily as given.

The Neo-Nazi was born here and is a British citizen so hasn`t been given anything to rescind, so goes to prison for the requisite time scale for breaking "our" rules.

Of course he has - citizenship is purely a societal construct, and has been "given" to all of us.

The Neo-Nazi has been given British citizenship because (presumably) he was born in the UK and at least one of his parents is British.

Essa Suleiman has been given British citizenship because his parents brought him here legally as a child and he (presumably) fulfilled all the residence requirements.

You (and to be fair, several Tory governments) have just decided that one can be rescinded and one can't, but you're not fighting an immutable law of physics. You could easily decide to take it away. Sure, it might be hard to find another country that would be willing to take the Neo-Nazi; but I can't imagine Suleiman has still maintained Somalian citizenship after 35 years so I imagine you would be making him stateless as well anyhow.

 

[Matty Greens Left Boot]

Yes, that's exactly my answer.

Essex's answer is that one deserves prison time, and one deserves to be kicked out of the country he's lived in for all his life.

Well I would agree with that too just because a mouse lives in a warren doesn't make it a rabbit. Personally i don't believe you should be able to change nationality or citizenship you have the citizenship of your country of birth.