Ex Player Rob Dickie

[Foley]

Capello had an unbelievable record? Really? In qualifying maybe, but at tournaments, where it really counted he was beyond woeful.

At club level he had a fantastic record.

 

[oufc1991]

It depends on your definition of ‘world class’, a term which doesn’t really mean anything. He was definitely one of the best players in the world at one point

For me world class is players like Lionel messi or Ronaldo even fat Ronaldo was world class zidane beckham was loyal to his country but he wasn’t world class imo

 

[oufc1991]

You’re taking the p i s s, right? He was runner-up in the Ballon d'Or in 1999, twice runner-up for FIFA World Player of the Year and in 2004 was named by Pelé in the FIFA 100 list of the world's greatest living players. World class. Fact.

I’m not unfortunately people don’t remember the runners up unfortunately and just because pele says he in the top 100 doesn’t make it fact it’s an opinion

 

[Jolteon]

I think that is absolutely spot on, although I’d love to hear Karl’s thoughts on having 6 full backs in a squad.

The only difference is KR would have had 6 wingers he intended to play at full back instead

 

[Carpy]

Haha your not being serious are you
Beckham was never world class he had a very good right foot oh and an image that would make a club millions in shirt sales but he was never world class

In fairness, I think even Beckham himself has suggested that he wasn't the most naturally talented when it came to his all round football game (unlike someone like Scholes), but what he lacked in natural ability, he more than made up for with an abundance of desire, passion and work rate. I think world class is probably a bit far, but he was certainly very good.

 

[oufc1991]

In fairness, I think even Beckham himself has suggested that he wasn't the most naturally talented when it came to his all round football game (unlike someone like Scholes), but what he lacked in natural ability, he more than made up for with an abundance of desire, passion and work rate. I think world class is probably a bit far, but he was certainly very good.

Completely agree you could never question his desire when he put on the England shirt and he always tried 100% but was never world class

 

[Mad Dog]

Well I'm not going to argue that any of those three were inspirational!

Still, to achieve as little as they actually did, under three different managers?

It's hard for me to accept that much of the golden generation hype was anything other than media bullshit.

Bullshit? Hardly!

You only had to watch them all in the premiership week in week out, throughout their careers, in the days when the premiership was a fierce competitive cauldron, to see how good they were.

And then simply look at their achievements, and you soon realise, they were all in the top 3 players in the world for their respective positions.

Yes they underachieved, largely due to being stitched up with bad managers, who didn’t know what they were doing, and the only half decent manager, Capello, got it wrong, he alienated the whole squad, by making them function in a boot camp style England camp, instead of being more relaxed and fun, while creating the bonds and connections needed, in the way Venables did in ‘96.

But some of the best players of recent generations, such as Messi and Aguero have massively underachieved at international level, even though they’ve played in some excellent Argentina sides over the years, does that make them any less of a player? Of course not!

It happens, over all previous generations, some get lucky with managers during their international careers, and some don’t. Look at the England squad that got stitched up with Graham Taylor in the early 90’s, and failed to qualify for USA 94, and then more recently the squad that got stitched up with Hodgson!

Both those squads were full of quality, but were stitched up with crap managers.

It doesn’t matter how good you are, you still need a good manager, who knows how to connect with the players,
get the best out of a squad, the “golden generation” never had that, not once.

Harry Redkapp should’ve been England manager during the “golden generation” era, he knew how to connect with players, fans and the media, and knew how to get the best out of players, by playing them in their best positions, and allowing them to express themselves on the pitch.

That whole decade was a missed opportunity for the history of England on the international stage, and will be remembered for the colossal underachievement of the national team, but I blame the decision makers who chose the managers during that era, more than I do the players, who had more than proved just how good they were.

Southgate is certainly recreating the Venables England ‘96 vibe, and making it fun for the squad again, and I hope they succeed, but the quality is nowhere near the level of the “golden generation”

Yet...

 

[chuckbert]

Completely agree you could never question his desire when he put on the England shirt and he always tried 100% but was never world class

He was a world class idiot when he raised his foot to trip up simeone!

 

[Carpy]

Bullshit? Hardly!

You only had to watch them all in the premiership week in week out, throughout their careers, in the days when the premiership was a fierce competitive cauldron, to see how good they were.

And then simply look at their achievements, and you soon realise, they were all in the top 3 players in the world for their respective positions.

Yes they underachieved, largely due to being stitched up with bad managers, who didn’t know what they were doing, and the only half decent manager, Capello, got it wrong, he alienated the whole squad, by making them function in a boot camp style England camp, instead of being more relaxed and fun, while creating the bonds and connections needed, in the way Venables did in ‘96.

But some of the best players of recent generations, such as Messi and Aguero have massively underachieved at international level, even though they’ve played in some excellent Argentina sides over the years, does that make them any less of a player? Of course not!

It happens, over all previous generations, some get lucky with managers during their international careers, and some don’t. Look at the England squad that got stitched up with Graham Taylor in the early 90’s, and failed to qualify for USA 94, and then more recently the squad that got stitched up with Hodgson!

Both those squads were full of quality, but were stitched up with crap managers.

It doesn’t matter how good you are, you still need a good manager, who knows how to connect with the players,
get the best out of a squad, the “golden generation” never had that, not once.

Harry Redkapp should’ve been England manager during the “golden generation” era, he knew how to connect with players, fans and the media, and knew how to get the best out of players, by playing them in their best positions, and allowing them to express themselves on the pitch.

That whole decade was a missed opportunity for the history of England on the international stage, and will be remembered for the colossal underachievement of the national team, but I blame the decision makers who chose the managers during that era, more than I do the players, who had more than proved just how good they were.

Southgate is certainly recreating the Venables England ‘96 vibe, and making it fun for the squad again, and I hope they succeed, but the quality is nowhere near the level of the “golden generation”

Yet...

As individuals they were miles ahead of the current crop but as a team, they didn't click, some of that is like you say, down to the managers, but I remember an interview with BT where Ferdinand said even the players avoided getting involved with each other and stuck to their club groups, that to me means they take some of the blame for their lack of success.

 

[werthersoriginal]

Bullshit? Hardly!

You only had to watch them all in the premiership week in week out, throughout their careers, in the days when the premiership was a fierce competitive cauldron, to see how good they were.

And then simply look at their achievements, and you soon realise, they were all in the top 3 players in the world for their respective positions.

Yes they underachieved, largely due to being stitched up with bad managers, who didn’t know what they were doing, and the only half decent manager, Capello, got it wrong, he alienated the whole squad, by making them function in a boot camp style England camp, instead of being more relaxed and fun, while creating the bonds and connections needed, in the way Venables did in ‘96.

But some of the best players of recent generations, such as Messi and Aguero have massively underachieved at international level, even though they’ve played in some excellent Argentina sides over the years, does that make them any less of a player? Of course not!

It happens, over all previous generations, some get lucky with managers during their international careers, and some don’t. Look at the England squad that got stitched up with Graham Taylor in the early 90’s, and failed to qualify for USA 94, and then more recently the squad that got stitched up with Hodgson!

Both those squads were full of quality, but were stitched up with crap managers.

It doesn’t matter how good you are, you still need a good manager, who knows how to connect with the players,
get the best out of a squad, the “golden generation” never had that, not once.

Harry Redkapp should’ve been England manager during the “golden generation” era, he knew how to connect with players, fans and the media, and knew how to get the best out of players, by playing them in their best positions, and allowing them to express themselves on the pitch.

That whole decade was a missed opportunity for the history of England on the international stage, and will be remembered for the colossal underachievement of the national team, but I blame the decision makers who chose the managers during that era, more than I do the players, who had more than proved just how good they were.

Southgate is certainly recreating the Venables England ‘96 vibe, and making it fun for the squad again, and I hope they succeed, but the quality is nowhere near the level of the “golden generation”

Yet...

Did any of those guys play for a really good team like Barcelona? Not many did, though Beckham was at Real. They were just scuffling in the premier league, which was nothing like as competitive then.

 

[m]

Bullshit? Hardly!

You only had to watch them all in the premiership week in week out, throughout their careers, in the days when the premiership was a fierce competitive cauldron, to see how good they were.

And then simply look at their achievements, and you soon realise, they were all in the top 3 players in the world for their respective positions.

Hmm. That was part of the problem for me, we were in no doubt that the Premier League was the best in the world and yet this wasn't reflected in English clubs walking European competition.

And I simply don't agree that they were all in the top 3 of their position.

Of course the manager is vitally important, but when the same players fail to achieve under different managers, and managers who have previously been very successful at that, you have to ask if the hype was justified.

 

[Leysboy]

We should of met West Germany in the final of 86, if it wasn’t for Maradona’s so called hand of god.

In Italy 1990 with Bobby Robson again we had a side capable of winning the tournament, West Germany scored one of the flukiest deflections ever, Paul Parker charged the ball down from Andreas Brehme, and some how the ball looped over Peter Shilton when it could of gone anywhere. We then know what happened after that with Stuart Pearce and Chris Waddle’s pen that’s still in orbit.

In 94 Under Graham Taylor RIP, we were pathetic, and never made it to the USA.

In France 98 we were denied a legitimate goal by Sol Campbell, and were robbed, and played well with 10 men for so long. Who knows how far we could of gone should the goal have stood.

In 2002 We should of gone on to the final, David Seaman was at fault this time, for allowing Ronaldinho to score from such a long way out, but he had previous. Remember the Cup Winners Cup, or UEFA Cup, can’t remember which, but he allowed Nayim to score from near the halfway line, which meant Real Zaragoza won the game.

In 2006 Wayne Rooney let us down, for letting Ronaldo get the better of him, and then scoring the winning pen in the shootout.

2010, we turned up to South Africa, with high hopes, we crawled out of the groups, and remember one of the worst games ever, England 0-0 Algeria. We was denied another goal this time from Frank Lampard, and even VAR would of got that right. But I don’t think we would of gone deep in that tournament.

2014, In Brazil was a complete disaster, ourselves and Italy couldn’t even qualify past Uruguay, and Costa Rica.

2018 in Russia We overachieved imo, We made it to the last four of a major tournament, and we had a favourable route to the Semi’s, but made hard work of Colombia. We sat too deep after taking the lead allowing Mina to score a late equaliser and eventually won a shootout. Wow.
We took the lead against Croatia, but ran out of steam, and lost, and then lost the 3rd/4th place match too.

We have had a lot of decisions go against us, history will tell you that, but also we have caused our own downfalls too.

I think the 1990 team, was a team, and no players playing as individuals.

Maybe soon we can win a major tournament as a nation.

 

[Malc]

Re young Dickie.

He is not a world class player yet, but one day he may be.

So why all this talk about world class players and England in Rob Dickie's thread?

 

[SteMerritt]

In Italy 1990 with Bobby Robson again we had a side capable of winning the tournament, West Germany scored one of the flukiest deflections ever, Paul Parker charged the ball down from Andreas Brehme, and some how the ball looped over Peter Shilton when it could of gone anywhere. We then know what happened after that with Stuart Pearce

It's amazing how everyone forgets how poor we were in a lot of Italia '90, terrible performance against Ireland, laboured to a 1-0 win v Egypt, were second best to Belgium for large parts of the game before Platt's last gasp winner. Out muscled by Cameroon and only went through thanks to 2 penalties, the second of which was really really soft. Our best 2 games were against The Netherlands and Germany. It was such a mixed bag of a tournament.

 

[Leysboy]

It's amazing how everyone forgets how poor we were in a lot of Italia '90, terrible performance against Ireland, laboured to a 1-0 win v Egypt, were second best to Belgium for large parts of the game before Platt's last gasp winner. Out muscled by Cameroon and only went through thanks to 2 penalties, the second of which was really really soft. Our best 2 games were against The Netherlands and Germany. It was such a mixed bag of a tournament.

Yep 1-1 with Rep of Ireland. 0-0 with Holland, and Mark Wright scoring against Egypt.

Although in the Dutch match, I believe Stuart Pearce scored a free kick but was disallowed.

I think a lot of teams underestimated Cameroon, they were sensational.

 

[Marked Ox]

Yep 1-1 with Rep of Ireland. 0-0 with Holland, and Mark Wright scoring against Egypt.

Although in the Dutch match, I believe Stuart Pearce scored a free kick but was disallowed.

I think a lot of teams underestimated Cameroon, they were sensational.

Cameroon also did the best sequence of fouls/attempted fouls Vs Argentina that I've seen in international football. Especially good as it was against Argentina who are renowned for cynical fouling.

 

[SteMerritt]

Cameroon also did the best sequence of fouls/attempted fouls Vs Argentina that I've seen in international football. Especially good as it was against Argentina who are renowned for cynical fouling.

 

[Notaswindonfan]

Re young Dickie.

He is not a world class player yet, but one day he may be.

So why all this talk about world class players and England in Rob Dickie's thread?

Now, pay attention 007

 

[m]

I don't think I could ever get bored of watching that.

 

[horseman]

for a country with football as it's national game our Media seem to do their utmost to dig any dirt on the manager and or players and then go on about unrest in the camp/hotel etc.

As a nation we allowed the clubs to largely dictate who could play and for how long and there were often cases of players withdrawn wednesday but were suddenly like Shergar come the Saturday. We then had to witness endless substitutes often 5 or 6 as well as Managers taking the easy option by playing their favorites rather than looking at the wider availability.

As for the upcoming Euros what with the past year or so best to approach it like the Domestic season in a relaxed mode and just try to enjoy.