Potential New Ground

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I can’t believe people are suggesting we may have to sign up to a new lease, it’s only held us back for 20 + years, would be better to start again and get the shackles off our necks than do that.
 
Kassam wouldn't want another 20 year lease either, so I'm sure if we ever got to that stage then all parties would be able to put in a release clause, or negotiate a shorter term lease deal until a new stadium was built. There maybe a penalty fee but it would be significantly less than the cost of playing elsewhere or being stick with the same deal for another generation.
 
Kassam wouldn't want another 20 year lease either, so I'm sure if we ever got to that stage then all parties would be able to put in a release clause, or negotiate a shorter term lease deal until a new stadium was built. There maybe a penalty fee but it would be significantly less than the cost of playing elsewhere or being stick with the same deal for another generation.
On the question of a new licence for 20 years, albeit on the same terms, Kassam has no choice. It's an option that the Club is entitled to exercise. Whether it would want to, of course, is a moot point but, in the absence of any alternative, it may have to. It is possible that a different arrangement could be negotiated, but as previously stated, that would require a seismic shift by Kassam and of itself might still not be sufficient. Clearly a ground share for an indefinite period is undesirable and ideally would only be acceptable if the club were working towards a different solution. The signs are at the moment that there is not much flesh on that bone but there may be more going on behind the scenes than we are privy to and hopefully something we can all buy into will begin to emerge in the next few months. Finally, I do not subscribe to the view that a ground share, even for a season or two, would see the end of the club. It is often overlooked that a large proportion of the fan base who attend marches regularly travels considerable distances to attend matches, and for many, travelling to Wycombe, Milton Keynes or wherever would be no more onerous than the travelling they do now to Grenoble Road.
 
Government trampling over local democracy .... the shape of what the next 5 years promises? :(
Really tricky that Sarge. Once there's no 5 year plan + 20% = 6 years then anyone can apply to build anywhere.
The district council turns those applications down then they get overturned on appeal. Resulting in development where NO one wants then.
 
Government trampling over local democracy .... the shape of what the next 5 years promises? :(

I don`t know of a single planning appeal that has been called in, after local rejection, that has not passed irrespective of who is in government.
 
Certainly tricky. This issue was the overarching one in the May election and is the one reason why the tory council was voted out and replaced by the current council. The massive growth in house building has already damaged the area severely over the past 20 years and these homes will turn it into a commuter suburb.
 
I don`t know of a single planning appeal that has been called in, after local rejection, that has not passed irrespective of who is in government.

So you agree that local democracy (the planning offices being driven by locally-elected bodies) is trampled on, I see.
 
Really tricky that Sarge. Once there's no 5 year plan + 20% = 6 years then anyone can apply to build anywhere.
The district council turns those applications down then they get overturned on appeal. Resulting in development where NO one wants then.

The very same issue wasn't a problem for the Tory majority Coalition Govt with the Vale of White Horse Council when the Tories took control of it and didn't pass the agreed Local Plan brought forward by the Lib Dems just before the election.

The same Tory Councillors, iirc, stood for re-election on getting a Local Plan passed at the next election.
 
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The problem is that there is no planning involved in the planning process, developers are being granted a license to build and by replacing their obligations to local community with a CIL payment, they can wash their hands of any involvement in the areas that they "develop".

We were a village of some 2,500 houses; cottages, bungalows, a few bedsits and some two & three bed estates with larger houses on the periphery. We now have an additional 925 dwellings (mostly 3/4/5 bed, with a token amount of two bed starter homes) on 15 separate sites spread around the entire village and it's approaches - all but one were refused and all but one of the subsequent appeals were upheld. As a result, we have an infrastructure for schooling & healthcare that is now simply overwhelmed by the sudden 35% growth in the space of 4 or 5 years, a haphazard and congested road network - and don't mention the drains!

With a bit of planning, a relief road around the outskirts of the village would have allowed simple access to the M40 for the lorries and cars that have to navigate the village roads and alongside that you could have built 1,000+ homes and still had room for a health centre, a sports venue, a supermarket and other shops and even some industrial units (the only local employer in the village of more than half a dozen people is a small Co-op). Instead of a dormitory town with little to keep you here, we could have had a sustainable local community.

And I could probably be talking about any one of thirty or more locations, probably thousands nationwide, that have been changed out of all recognition by allowing developers to build what they want rather than what is needed.
 
The very same issue wasn't a problem for the Tory majority Coalition Govt with the Vale of White Horse Council when the Tories took control of it and didn't pass the agreed Local Plan brought forward by the Lib Dems just before the election.

The same Tory Councillors, iirc, stood for re-election on getting a Local Plan passed at the next election.
& the outcome of that ended with developments all over the vale where they were not wanted by either the town councils or the district councils
 
& the outcome of that ended with developments all over the vale where they were not wanted by either the town councils or the district councils

Yes, but that doesn't change the political angle this has.

A Tory Govt enforcing a local Tory plan but wind back and they didn't enforce a Lib Dem policy. It is riding roughshod over local democracy as one of the main reasons the Tories got voted out of South Oxon DC was because of that proposed Local Plan. I can pretty much guarantee it wouldn't have happened to a Tory Council.

So it leads to the question, what is the point of local democracy if the National Govt just ignores it because it doesn't give the answer they want?

It strikes me that Local Govt, since austerity, is only useful to National Govt as a place to make/hide massive cuts, therefore insulating National Govt from blame. This approach by this Govt is just another way to undermine local democracy and decision making process.
 
Seeing what Brentford are doing with that new 18,000 stadium is depressing from our perspective. Would love something similar for us nearer the city centre

How about an 18,000 stadium next to 1700 new homes? In the middle of an area that has deprivation and needs a community hub?

Plenty of people like normal, wittering on about what can't be done as opposed to what could be done. Plenty of people continue to dismiss Firoz and seem to align his agenda from the late 90's to the current day - based on what? Things change folks, do you think his close partners within Firoka will stay on forever? Maybe for all we know, he fancies doing something different and providing that family legacy he craves? Has anyone seen the constraints lifted - Singha Beer, better relations, the OxVox mural, players training on the pitch, etc etc etc.

Maybe he could work with like minded business associates who ............. work together to build, regenerate and build something better ........... on the footprint in OX4? I bet Tiger's got a few aces up his sleeve and probably worth him keeping them up there, out of sight of others.

I still think our future is here. I think it might be with FK and the current Board. I think they could build a superb stadium, built on the foundations of what we've already got. I know people who have had architects down here talking about a host of things they could do with the current stadium.
 
How about an 18,000 stadium next to 1700 new homes? In the middle of an area that has deprivation and needs a community hub?

Plenty of people like normal, wittering on about what can't be done as opposed to what could be done. Plenty of people continue to dismiss Firoz and seem to align his agenda from the late 90's to the current day - based on what? Things change folks, do you think his close partners within Firoka will stay on forever? Maybe for all we know, he fancies doing something different and providing that family legacy he craves? Has anyone seen the constraints lifted - Singha Beer, better relations, the OxVox mural, players training on the pitch, etc etc etc.

Maybe he could work with like minded business associates who ............. work together to build, regenerate and build something better ........... on the footprint in OX4? I bet Tiger's got a few aces up his sleeve and probably worth him keeping them up there, out of sight of others.

I still think our future is here. I think it might be with FK and the current Board. I think they could build a superb stadium, built on the foundations of what we've already got. I know people who have had architects down here talking about a host of things they could do with the current stadium.
Mmm. One of only a couple who remotely trusts 'Firoz'
I have seen too much with my own eyes how Uncle Firoz works (the Priory is an obvious example)
But ok what could Kassam offer and who would pay for this 'superb stadium'?
I went to the Oxvox presentation on the stadium and sure this looked good.
Years later and the 2 questions remain. Hoe can you work with Kassam and who would pay for the huge cost?
 
How about an 18,000 stadium next to 1700 new homes? In the middle of an area that has deprivation and needs a community hub?

Plenty of people like normal, wittering on about what can't be done as opposed to what could be done. Plenty of people continue to dismiss Firoz and seem to align his agenda from the late 90's to the current day - based on what? Things change folks, do you think his close partners within Firoka will stay on forever? Maybe for all we know, he fancies doing something different and providing that family legacy he craves? Has anyone seen the constraints lifted - Singha Beer, better relations, the OxVox mural, players training on the pitch, etc etc etc.

Maybe he could work with like minded business associates who ............. work together to build, regenerate and build something better ........... on the footprint in OX4? I bet Tiger's got a few aces up his sleeve and probably worth him keeping them up there, out of sight of others.

I still think our future is here. I think it might be with FK and the current Board. I think they could build a superb stadium, built on the foundations of what we've already got. I know people who have had architects down here talking about a host of things they could do with the current stadium.
The 'constraints' that have been lifted are all fine and a step forward - but as far as I can see they do not cost Firoka/Uncle K a penny. That is very very different to enabling us to somehow upgrade the stadium to something better - and of course the perennial question is 'Who pays and how do they make their money back?'
For all we know (although I find it a bit unlikely) Kassam might suddenly want to pour millions into a football club as some sort of 'legacy'. Or he might be entirely happy to sit back and collect the rent. Or he might really want us out so that he can sell the land for housing. We simply don't know - I'd like to believe otherwise, but actions speak louder than words and I think your scenario is probably wishful thinking.
 
Mmm. One of only a couple who remotely trusts 'Firoz'

Hold on. Don't make comments like that without backing them up. Just because I am a little more balanced than some, don't label me Foley.

Yes I've met Firoz with other members of OxVox, when I was on the committee, alongside other council officers. Perhaps you could give us an overview of his 'current' thought process instead of what he did or said, years and years ago.

It'd be more interesting to know what the current OxVox committee or club officials have had with either a) the council and/or b) FK. That would be more beneficial to the debate. Or if other 'invested' parties are stifling our supporters trust representatives in getting in front of club officials or finding out what is or isn't going on.
 
On the back of the accounts being published, and the level of debt placed on the club, I can understand why many would think that the prospect of a new stadium is more remote than ever. However, as @Paul Cannell has mentioned elsewhere, it is unlikely that the level of debt would be allowed to rise without the prospect of finding a way to recoup this. And the only way that can really happen is through a stadium/leisure complex.

I'm obviously unable to go into detail (and recognise that some will therefore assume this is horseshit!) but there has been advanced conversations regarding a piece of land on a 99 year lease. There are some complications, but nothing that has entirely derailed this project (although I suspect the delay may have changed the timelines being quoted). So, I really believe that there is both the intent and finances in place to make our new home a very real prospect. In addition, plans are already in place to further develop the training ground to include covered pitches and great community links. This will not be cheap, but should create an opportunity to bring revenue back into the club through hiring out pitches etc.

So I think that the board is still very much focused on the long term future of the club and whilst the current debt levels are not great, I don't see it as a reason to panic just yet.
 
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