Potential New Ground

[OX14]

Being in possession of a reasonable mind and using sound logic, means that throwing millions at Kassam, then millions more in renovations, building a 4th stand, installing proper and up to date communications technology with proper conference facilities, catering, upgrading all the toilets and other sanitary facilities, replacing the worn out seating and bringing the general health and safety requirements up to standard etc. etc. would not induce any right minded developer to even consider the prospect. Add in that the stadium would offer no further development prospects other than the remote possibility of some flats in the corners (and taking into account the pre-existing covenants on the stadium) and the thought of "buying" the stadium is too ridiculous to imagine.

That's all without even considering the fact that Kassam is never, ever going to sell his stadium to anyone from OUFC. He's made that perfectly clear from the outset.
OxVox are very well aware of the costs, it was they who put together a study into buying the stadium (ably assisted by Stewart Donald) That study made it clear that without a benefactor of some magnitude, that was a non starter. (that benefactor would need to be prepared to wave goodbye to his or her funds for ever)

On the Kassam won't sell to anyone, hasn't that always been the case because of the time left on the lease? Kassam might sell now considering in 5 years time we could walk away leaving him with a stadium that no one will pay to use.

 

[Manorlounger]

On the Kassam won't sell to anyone, hasn't that always been the case because of the time left on the lease? Kassam might sell now considering in 5 years time we could walk away leaving him with a stadium that no one will pay to use.

And then he sells it to a developer for housing or whatever. As long as OUFC have somewhere else to play, then he has fulfilled his obligation to the covenant. Listed as a "Community asset" he is obliged to inform OxVox of his intention to sell giving them 6 months notice. In terms of profit, the stadium has long since paid for itself.
In terms of who he would sell to, that would be anyone who meets his asking price who is not OUFC. (Actually, anyone who makes him a decent offer will get it, he has no emotional attachments to the stadium!)

 

[uptheus]

And then he sells it to a developer for housing or whatever. As long as OUFC have somewhere else to play, then he has fulfilled his obligation to the covenant. Listed as a "Community asset" he is obliged to inform OxVox of his intention to sell giving them 6 months notice. In terms of profit, the stadium has long since paid for itself.
In terms of who he would sell to, that would be anyone who meets his asking price who is not OUFC. (Actually, anyone who makes him a decent offer will get it, he has no emotional attachments to the stadium!)

Or anyone who will offer him the value as a housing development value which is a lot higher than the stadium cost (£13.5m) e.g. possibly double that value, especially if you throw in all the other ventures/land there.

 

[OX14]

Or anyone who will offer him the value as a housing development value which is a lot higher than the stadium cost (£13.5m) e.g. possibly double that value, especially if you throw in all the other ventures/land there.

If the land is that profitable as housing, why don't we buy the whole ozone aswell, knock it down, build houses on it that will pay back the investors and raise enough funds to finish of the stadium and own it out right? Sure the out lay will be huge, but it will be a hell of alot easier then trying to get planning on undeveloped land.

 

[werthersoriginal]

If the land is that profitable as housing, why don't we buy the whole ozone aswell, knock it down, build houses on it that will pay back the investors and raise enough funds to finish of the stadium and own it out right? Sure the out lay will be huge, but it will be a hell of alot easier then trying to get planning on undeveloped land.

That occurs to me too. But in that case why doesn't Kassam do that?
I know it's annoying for people who are more ITK.

 

[battman]

If the land is that profitable as housing, why don't we buy the whole ozone aswell, knock it down, build houses on it that will pay back the investors and raise enough funds to finish of the stadium and own it out right? Sure the out lay will be huge, but it will be a hell of alot easier then trying to get planning on undeveloped land.

Is that easier? Not only will you have to negotiate with Kassam to buy both the stadium and the Ozone, but you're saying you'd spend money to knock down the Ozone to build a few houses, when the more profitable option for Kassam would be to build on the stadium plot and some of the stadium car park? I don't see how that would be easier than the club building a stadium and adequate facilities on green belt land.

Planning is planning, so you'd still need to jump through all the hoops when renovating a brown field site, even if a building currently exists on that plot. One of the biggest hinderances to building on green belt land is nimbyism because it's politically toxic for councillors to vote these things through. But with the football club, there's the will from the council to get a deal for a new stadium.

 

[battman]

That occurs to me too. But in that case why doesn't Kassam do that?
I know it's annoying for people who are more ITK.

The Ozone takes up less space than the stadium and needs less parking spaces. If you were going to knock down one to build housing, you'd dismantle the relatively simply-built stadium over a leisure complex that brings in money and footfall on a more consistent basis. Not to forget there are two hotels on that plot. What use would they be if you took away the only nearby restaurants and cinema?

 

[bazzer9461]

H

That occurs to me too. But in that case why doesn't Kassam do that?
I know it's annoying for people who are more ITK.

e can’t though can he? I thought and I’m certainly not ITK that the Grenoble site is to be used for leisure facilities and that’s why there aren’t any houses

 

[OX14]

H

e can’t though can he? I thought and I’m certainly not ITK that the Grenoble site is to be used for leisure facilities and that’s why there aren’t any houses

Any housing application will need a change of use of land, the whole grenoble Road site is for commercial only. The kassam stadium site is for leisure only.

Kassam does hold all the cards, but how much would the stadium site be worth to a house builder? £13.5 million I'm not to sure about.

What's to say once we do up sticks that the kassam stadium will be flattened for housing? There are 3000 houses being built across the road in a much more desirable location.

 

[Malc]

Any housing application will need a change of use of land, the whole grenoble Road site is for commercial only. The kassam stadium site is for leisure only.

Kassam does hold all the cards, but how much would the stadium site be worth to a house builder? £13.5 million I'm not to sure about.

What's to say once we do up sticks that the kassam stadium will be flattened for housing? There are 3000 houses being built across the road in a much more desirable location.

Not is the sewage works is staying put!

 

[OX14]

Not is the sewage works is staying put!

Well yes and the caravan site. But its bit more desirable the fact that it will be on the edge of the green belt, where as the kassam will be smack bang in the middle.and I doubt living next to a derelict pub and a leisure complex will draw the house buyers in. Perfect location for a football ground though with that extra footfall on your doorstep.

 

[Manorlounger]

Not is the sewage works is staying put!

Wake up and (don't) smell the cake: sewage plant plans unveils odour-control plans

WHEN Thames Water talks about the smells wafting from the 'cake barn', they're not talking the Great British Bake Off.

www.oxfordmail.co.uk

 

[Victor1986]

Development land WITH Planning Permission is going for £1M per acre (tops, in very desirable locations). The land at Grenoble Road is designated for Community Leisure Use & it will be a very hard & lengthy process to get that removed - in fact it could only be removed if it could be "re-allocated" to somewhere else - another stadium perhaps? The footprint of the Kassam & its associated parking etc. is 5.1ha (approx 13 acres). If we buggered off to somewhere else old FK would be left with land that he would only get, say £8M for if a developer were (crazy enough) to take on the challenge of getting its 'use' changed or removed. With our licence running down we are very much in the box seat to take it off his hands for a LOT less than the £13.5M always quoted.

 

[OX14]

Development land WITH Planning Permission is going for £1M per acre (tops, in very desirable locations). The land at Grenoble Road is designated for Community Leisure Use & it will be a very hard & lengthy process to get that removed - in fact it could only be removed if it could be "re-allocated" to somewhere else - another stadium perhaps? The footprint of the Kassam & its associated parking etc. is 5.1ha (approx 13 acres). If we buggered off to somewhere else old FK would be left with land that he would only get, say £8M for if a developer were (crazy enough) to take on the challenge of getting its 'use' changed or removed. With our licence running down we are very much in the box seat to take it off his hands for a LOT less than the £13.5M always quoted.

Exactly what I thought, 3000 houses across the road, 3000 at Culham, 800 in North Abingdon, 400 in Radley. All more desirable locations then the kassam plot.

20 million on the kassam and building a 4th stand could be recouped by player sales, extra revenue in the championship. Couldn't it?

 

[bazzer9461]

Any housing application will need a change of use of land, the whole grenoble Road site is for commercial only. The kassam stadium site is for leisure only.

Kassam does hold all the cards, but how much would the stadium site be worth to a house builder? £13.5 million I'm not to sure about.

What's to say once we do up sticks that the kassam stadium will be flattened for housing? There are 3000 houses being built across the road in a much more desirable location.

That’s SODC which the OCC have asked to build as they say there is nowhere else to build in Oxford.
I read somewhere they were saying they could build 800!dwellings so that would mean tower blocks and very limited parking.

 

[Marked Ox]

That’s SODC which the OCC have asked to build as they say there is nowhere else to build in Oxford.
I read somewhere they were saying they could build 800!dwellings so that would mean tower blocks and very limited parking.

Make it student housing (create a route for Brookes/Uni buses etc), free up property elsewhere for families etc.

 

[Mad Dog]

Im sorry but Im really struggling to believe that with all these investors having been in and around the club for three years now, with all their expertise and experience in these matters, theyre still ‘considering all their options’.

Exactly.

Like you say, with all their expertise, experience AND wealth, I can't imagine they'd want to put in an offer to increase their stake in the club so much, unless they knew something big and exciting was on the horizon, which is why I'm actually feeling pretty optimistic about the whole situation.

 

[Essexyellows]

Development land WITH Planning Permission is going for £1M per acre (tops, in very desirable locations). The land at Grenoble Road is designated for Community Leisure Use & it will be a very hard & lengthy process to get that removed - in fact it could only be removed if it could be "re-allocated" to somewhere else - another stadium perhaps? The footprint of the Kassam & its associated parking etc. is 5.1ha (approx 13 acres). If we buggered off to somewhere else old FK would be left with land that he would only get, say £8M for if a developer were (crazy enough) to take on the challenge of getting its 'use' changed or removed. With our licence running down we are very much in the box seat to take it off his hands for a LOT less than the £13.5M always quoted.

Thank you.
People need to think a lot wider than our wealthy backers.
FK isn`t getting any younger and he`ll want a legacy for the family.
The site itself, for anything other than the stadium, becomes problematic.
The whole new land, planning, new ground is years in the making, far longer than we have on the lease.
From FK`s view we will have done 20 years at £250k a year, or whatever the numbers are, so he`s "earnt" £5+ million, if the current tenants decide to buy the house at £10 million and do it up then everyone might be somewhere near happy..... who knows?

 

[Manorlounger]

Thank you.
People need to think a lot wider than our wealthy backers.
FK isn`t getting any younger and he`ll want a legacy for the family.
The site itself, for anything other than the stadium, becomes problematic.
The whole new land, planning, new ground is years in the making, far longer than we have on the lease.
From FK`s view we will have done 20 years at £250k a year, or whatever the numbers are, so he`s "earnt" £5+ million, if the current tenants decide to buy the house at £10 million and do it up then everyone might be somewhere near happy..... who knows?

One small fly in the ointment, OUFC have to leave in order to end the licence arrangement. If we leave, we have nowhere to play. If we wish to buy, Kassam will not sell to OUFC. He doesn't have to sell. He has no need to sell. He is not interested in selling. He has a very lucrative arrangement in place, in law.
In other words, it ain't going to happen. End of.

 

[Essexyellows]

One small fly in the ointment, OUFC have to leave in order to end the licence arrangement. If we leave, we have nowhere to play. If we wish to buy, Kassam will not sell to OUFC. He doesn't have to sell. He has no need to sell. He is not interested in selling. He has a very lucrative arrangement in place, in law.
In other words, it ain't going to happen. End of.

We`ll see. We don`t do simple.