World Cup Poland V England

I just don't get England fandom at times. Southgate imposes a style on an international side and is pilloried for it the second it doesn't get three points. For the first time in donkey's years, England aren't just a shock-and-awe team that sees the XI best players that they have thrown onto the field but a cohesive unit that plays a certain way. It's cautious, conservative and not always stunning to watch, but it generates results. A World Cup semi-final, a NL finals spot and their first tournament final at the Euros ever where they were knocked out on penalties and he still can't win over some.

Jeez. It was a draw against Poland yesterday. So what? England were five wins from five going into it and still four points clear even after a draw. If you're getting hung up on this, have a word. It's the bigger picture that needs looking at and England should really be looking at training camps and organising the warm up games ahead of the World Cup next year. France won the World Cup in 2018 and yet in qualifying for the tournament conspired draw with Belarus and draw 0-0 at home against Luxembourg. I bet no one was mentioning those results when Pogba et al were parading the trophy around Moscow.

Despite only conceding two goals in qualifying, I still think the defence needs further work for England. It may be a question of resources at his disposal (Southgate certainly has plenty of options for the other positions), but Pickford seems to have to do a little more work than he should at times. Also, with the likes of 30 years+ players like Walker and Trippier being the mainstays, it seems as though the defence doesn't seem to have that succession planning that Southgate likes to impose with drafting in younger players. They may need to see a few more options come through the ranks.
Completely agree. And for context of where we are, here's a list of all European teams with a better qualifying record than us at this point in time...

Denmark (6 wins from 6)
Belgium (Same points, better goal difference)

That's it.
 
No, he just frustrates me and thousands more with his play on his day he’s unstoppable but when he receives the ball and suddenly stops which allows the opposition to all get behind the ball and three or four then go to him and he tries to dribble or whatever to get free of them and then he loses the ball. That’s what I don’t like about him

He has been a regular part of a defence that got to the Euro final and have pretty much qualified for the World Cup. He deserves his place in the team as his speed in defence has saved others on numerous occasions and he has caused plenty of threat going forward.
 
He has been a regular part of a defence that got to the Euro final and have pretty much qualified for the World Cup. He deserves his place in the team as his speed in defence has saved others on numerous occasions and he has caused plenty of threat going forward.
I’m on about Sterling who is supposed to be a forward but if you are referring to Walker,!he was cack last night
 
I’m on about Sterling who is supposed to be a forward but if you are referring to Walker,!he was cack last night

You mean Sterling that scored 3 (1 less than Kane) and with 1 assist in the Euros. Walker was hardly cack, Stones made more errors.
 
You mean Sterling that scored 3 (1 less than Kane) and with 1 assist in the Euros. Walker was hardly cack, Stones made more errors.
That was then this was yesterday, and yes stones did make more errors in the Euros but yesterday Walker wasn’t at the races neither was Sterling, and even until his wonder goal neither was Kane.
All this sullying around in the defence can be costly as it nearly was last night before there last minute goal.
 
A manager doesn’t make any substitutes despite a number of his players looking knackered - the opposition team then scores a late equaliser. I don’t care who the manager is or what he’s done in the past, he’s going to get criticised/questioned for that decision.

Also I wish that everyone would stop going on about the World Cup semi final, it was not that good a result. We lost 3 games in that tournament - literally every time we came up against a decent side, we lost. The run to the final in the Euros was much better however. I agree that there aren’t currently any better options than Gareth Southgate, but he’s certainly not infallible or above criticism.
 
A manager doesn’t make any substitutes despite a number of his players looking knackered - the opposition team then scores a late equaliser. I don’t care who the manager is or what he’s done in the past, he’s going to get criticised/questioned for that decision.

Also I wish that everyone would stop going on about the World Cup semi final, it was not that good a result. We lost 3 games in that tournament - literally every time we came up against a decent side, we lost. The run to the final in the Euros was much better however. I agree that there aren’t currently any better options than Gareth Southgate, but he’s certainly not infallible or above criticism.
Of course you can criticize him or any other manager but it's just silly when people say he (or Karl) are useless, negative, they hate them, etc.
 
That was then this was yesterday, and yes stones did make more errors in the Euros but yesterday Walker wasn’t at the races neither was Sterling, and even until his wonder goal neither was Kane.
All this sullying around in the defence can be costly as it nearly was last night before there last minute goal.

A couple of months ago you mean, wow ages....

And he scored the key opening goal vs Hungary less than a week ago which you seem to have forgotten.
 
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I like Sterling for England, the passion is there and he seems to put himself in good positions and pops up with goals. However I'm also not blind to see that in those same games he can often give the ball away countless times, can't beat a man or generally has an absolute stinker of a game. However if he can pop up with the winner then most fans will quickly forget that.

Football can be a strange game, you can have a poor game but also be the hero.
 
A couple of months ago you mean, wow ages....

And he scored the key opening goal vs Hungary less than a week ago which you seem to have forgotten.
No I haven’t forgotten but last night he wasn’t any good
 
We had that game in the bag and should have won it.
But we played too much tipee tapee in their final third, trying to walk the ball in.
Kane showed that if it opens up you can score from distance.
Tired legs also cost us. Should have been some fresh legs in the last 5-10 minutes.
 
Only Belgium and Denmark have more points in qualifying from the European section. Denmark's group is absolutely woeful as well.

Actually, I would argue that Denmark's group is a lot tougher than ours.
Austria looked very capable in the Euros, took Italy to extra time. We all like to laugh at Scotland, but they are at least well organized and fairly efficient. And Israel are one of the tougher #4 seeds.

Denmark are just a really, really good side at the moment.

Which is another reason why our Euros run was so impressive. Three of the teams we beat are currently leading their WCQ groups.......
 
Which is another reason why our Euros run was so impressive. Three of the teams we beat are currently leading their WCQ groups.......

Nope.

Southgate is s**t.

Deal with it.
 
A manager doesn’t make any substitutes despite a number of his players looking knackered - the opposition team then scores a late equaliser. I don’t care who the manager is or what he’s done in the past, he’s going to get criticised/questioned for that decision.

Also I wish that everyone would stop going on about the World Cup semi final, it was not that good a result. We lost 3 games in that tournament - literally every time we came up against a decent side, we lost. The run to the final in the Euros was much better however. I agree that there aren’t currently any better options than Gareth Southgate, but he’s certainly not infallible or above criticism.

I don't think anyone is saying he is. His record thus far is excellent but that's not to say he gets things wrong. The substitution thing yesterday for one and I do think he could have allowed England to find an extra gear in the final at the Euros, having home advantage and all. He doesn't have carte blanche just because he's got results.

It's the disproportionate level of criticism he faces as though England lost to a minnow. Every England manager will face additional scrutiny but there does seem to be a number who seem to revel in any minor failing - and they aren't just Scotland fans. As I said, the bigger picture is more important here. England have dropped a mere two points from a possible 18 and there's a meltdown. The table didn't change and the ease in which England are qualifying for the WC is still in hand and with both tiny nations to play. Likewise at the Euros, England drew with a fired up Scotland and there was seething rage from some. To the rest of us, we saw it as a point that took England through. No bother whatsoever. Carry on and onto the next one.

I like Southgate's stoicism. He watches and prepares matches unlike a fan would and that helps.
 
You hate the manager who was a penalty away from winning the Euros? Which England managers in your lifetime have been better?
thats just stating one fact about that game though, the bigger fact was we were totally outplayed and couldnt get out of our half for a large amount of that game and in no way deserved to win that game.we had 1 shot on target in 120 minutes.

Southgates biggest problem apart from playing defensive football is that he simply doesnt change anything despite the game going against England. The Poland game, although didnt really matter at the time is another example of not changing something when things started turning against him, putting 2 or 3 players on with fresh legs probably wouldve been all he needed to do to see out the win.
 
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