International News Immigration

Wandering Yellow said:
There is also an estimated 417,000 - 863,000 who have made it here illegally.
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They wouldn't be Asylum seekers/refugees which those stats relate to, they'd be economic migrants which is completely different.

Where have those figures come from?
 
Marked Ox said:
Yes they are refugees if they get that status considering the process they have to go through to get it.

If you understand the difference, why are you focused on the cost to get to the UK considering their lives are at risk, or the possibility of being imprisoned for no reason, or tortured if they stayed? If your life was at risk from the state, wouldn't you pay £000s if it was the only way to get to a safe country?

I'd recommend you read up on the Refugee Convention.
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I'm concerned with the long term consequences for Britain , including my family as I don't believe that saying come to Britain in your hundreds of thousands whoever you may be and we will foot the bill , have over crowding , lack of housing , storing up future problems , lack of integration, is a promising future .
If genuinely fleeing for their life of course but how can that be proven ?
 
Sheik djibouti said:
I think it is often the case that displaced families will migrate from a danger zone and whilst they might be safe, there is no prospect of work or providing a future for their family, so will look further afield. The vast majority do however stay in the region in which they are displaced. Of those that travel further, I found this posted by @SteMerritt on an earlier page:

smartselect_20201028-111351_chrome-jpg.4879

I would say that a major factor in "why the UK?" is that many will speak some English (more likely than French and far more likely then German) and many will have some family connection. And yet we still lag significantly behind even countries like Greece on the numbers we take, who are way, way ahead of us per capita (and nobody other than the Greeks really speak Greek!).

So language and links will play a part. But it is still a comparatively small number though.
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This is an OUFC Forum. Keep to it.
 
Thomas/Brock/Jones said:
I'm concerned with the long term consequences for Britain , including my family as I don't believe that saying come to Britain in your hundreds of thousands whoever you may be and we will foot the bill , have over crowding , lack of housing , storing up future problems , lack of integration, is a promising future .
If genuinely fleeing for their life of course but how can that be proven ?
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How is 20k-50k refugees a year (can be less as well) causing long term consequences for your family? You are conflating economic migrants with refugees.

We aren't overcrowded, as for a start we have higher work vacancies than people available to do the jobs and people leave the UK as well. Also, it isn't the migrants fault that Tory and Labour Govts' had an innate inability to ensure/build sufficient and appropriate housing stock.

Migrants are net contributors to the Govt coffers. We have an ageing population, who do you think will do the work and provide the tax base for Govt services in the long run?

Again, who is saying come to Britain in your hundreds of thousands? What future problems are being stored up?

I can think of plenty groups of immigrants who integrate as well and get on with living their lives adding to the country socially, culturally and economically.

Again this 'genuine' question. Yes they are genuine, this Govt are actively trying to make it harder yet these people have got refugee status whether on the first asylum process or through the court tribunal process.
 
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I'd be amazed if it is 20-50 k a year although even if it is only if there are genuine reasons.
We aren't overcrowded! Where do you live as the amount of flats/ houses being built is certainly changing the standard and way of living .
I'm not sure that a family of 2 adults, 2 or more kids contribute above breaking even.
Society already with migration is divided with areas certainly different to others which doesn't seem to have a joined up society .
That isnt good long term .
And I can think of many areas where that isnt the case where divides are a reality sadly and even 2nd or 3rd generation don't or aren't allowed to mix .
Somewhere , at sometime in the world there will be genuine refugees , is it really a solution for them to always be put up here ?
 
Marked Ox said:
How is 20k-50k refugees a year (can be less as well) causing long term consequences for your family? You are conflating economic migrants with refugees.

We aren't overcrowded, as for a start we have higher work vacancies than people available to do the jobs and people leave the UK as well. Also, it isn't the migrants fault that Tory and Labour Govts' had an innate inability to ensure/build sufficient and appropriate housing stock.

Migrants are net contributors to the Govt coffers. We have an ageing population, who do you think will do the work and provide the tax base for Govt services in the long run?

Again, who is saying come to Britain in your hundreds of thousands? What future problems are being stored up?

I can think of plenty groups of immigrants who integrate as well and get on with living their lives adding to the country socially, culturally and economically.

Again this 'genuine' question. Yes they are genuine, this Govt are actively trying to make it harder yet these people have got refugee status whether on the first asylum process or through the court tribunal process.
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I dont think I've ever met anyone from London who wouldn't say London is overcrowded.
 
Marked Ox said:
Can you please say which page the UK figures are on? As I've looked roughly through the 42 pages and I can find figures for other countries but not easily the UK.
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You need to understand how you count an unknown number and the methodology behind it before you can begin to understand it.

The primary issue is that the UK hasn`t released even an estimate as to the number of illegal entrants since 2005. Therefore we are left with "guesswork and studies".

I will reiterate that we need migration, we are a nation of migrants but it needs to be safe, appropriate, measured and controlled.

What we do NOT need is hundreds or thousands of people risking their lives crossing the Channel and ending up "under the radar" and being further exploited and without access to housing, healthcare etc etc.
 
Essexyellows said:
You need to understand how you count an unknown number and the methodology behind it before you can begin to understand it.

The primary issue is that the UK hasn`t released even an estimate as to the number of illegal entrants since 2005. Therefore we are left with "guesswork and studies".

I will reiterate that we need migration, we are a nation of migrants but it needs to be safe, appropriate, measured and controlled.

What we do NOT need is hundreds or thousands of people risking their lives crossing the Channel and ending up "under the radar" and being further exploited and without access to housing, healthcare etc etc.
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So the number claimed by Wandering Yellow is meaningless.

The ones crossing the Channel aren't ending up under the radar as they are claiming asylum when getting picked up by the authorities. How are these Asylum seekers to get here without crossing the English Channel with legal/safe routes pretty much closed down?
 
Thomas/Brock/Jones said:
Somewhere , at sometime in the world there will be genuine refugees , is it really a solution for them to always be put up here ?
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Always put up in Britain? Yeah, right!

According to the UNHCR, there are currently (well, as of mid-2021) approximately 26.6 million refugees in the world, and 4.4 million asylum seekers.
In Britain, as of the end of 2020, there were 132,349  refugees, 77,245 pending asylum cases  and 4662  stateless persons.

In other words, the UK puts up less than 1% of all refugees and asylum seekers worldwide. The country is not even close to the top ten when it comes to host countries for refugees. Even in Europe, the UK only ranked #4 in the past year in refugee applications (behind France & Spain, and miles behind Germany)
 
tonyw said:
Always put up in Britain? Yeah, right!

According to the UNHCR, there are currently (well, as of mid-2021) approximately 26.6 million refugees in the world, and 4.4 million asylum seekers.
In Britain, as of the end of 2020, there were 132,349  refugees, 77,245 pending asylum cases  and 4662  stateless persons.

In other words, the UK puts up less than 1% of all refugees and asylum seekers worldwide. The country is not even close to the top ten when it comes to host countries for refugees. Even in Europe, the UK only ranked #4 in the past year in refugee applications (behind France & Spain, and miles behind Germany)
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And the size of our Country , on a global scale?
How many can we realistically take in that will then fit seamlessly into working and living here ?
 
Thomas/Brock/Jones said:
And the size of our Country , on a global scale?
How many can we realistically take in that will then fit seamlessly into working and living here ?
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We're a similar-sized nation to Germany and France, and quite a bit larger than Spain.
 
Thomas/Brock/Jones said:
And the size of our Country , on a global scale?
How many can we realistically take in that will then fit seamlessly into working and living here ?
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A little less than 1% by population
So even if you completely ignore other parameters like wealth, resources and standard of living, then Britain takes slightly fewer refugees in that it should on a global per capita basis.

I don't think UNHCR keeps this data, but I'm pretty confident though that Britain does a lot more than 1% of the whining about taking in refugees though.
 
m said:
We're a similar-sized nation to Germany and France, and quite a bit larger than Spain.
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m said:
We're a similar-sized nation to Germany and France, and quite a bit larger than
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m said:
We're a similar-sized nation to Germany and France, and quite a bit larger than Spain.
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Have you ever heard of maps and land size . We are much smaller than all of those counties listed .
 
tonyw said:
Marked Ox said:
Talking of maps, in 2017 only 6% of UK land was built on and plenty of that not densely at all:

New land cover atlas reveals just six per cent of UK is built on - Archive - News archive - The University of Sheffield

www.sheffield.ac.uk www.sheffield.ac.uk
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And you are no doubt looking foward to masses of the country being covered in flats and dense population demographics.
No doubt you already enjoy living in cramp conditions where its at least 30-40% built up land . Sounds a lovely ideal you have of how we should be happy to live in a giant metropolitan sprawl.
 
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