Board Fall: The Mystery of Robert Maxwell

unification

unification

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BBC Radio 4 - Fall: The Mystery of Robert Maxwell by John Preston - Available now

Available episodes of Fall: The Mystery of Robert Maxwell by John Preston
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There's an abridged radio series (just over an hour for all five parts) of John Preston's new biography on our ebullient but not buoyant late chairman Robert Maxwell from Radio 4. Sadly, his time in charge of us doesn't get a mention nor any of his football dealings (it's rather glossed over in the full book too apparently) but I suppose it's more of a character piece so something had to be cut. It's worth a listen regardless for those who missed that era or maybe dare go through it again.

Not being around when all the Maxwell business began and something I've been unable to find online, who did Maxwell buy Oxford United from? I know he cleared the debts that were big to the club but small fry to him. Seemingly our owners and chairmen have been well established and publicly known to the fanbase since Bobby Maxwell became chairman, but who was behind the scenes at Oxford in the '70s and '80s?

Also, as extra reading I found this very interesting piece that summarises the parts his children Kevin and Ghislaine had in the club in the early 1990s and in the aftermath of their father's death. Again, well worth getting involved with.

As Bad As Things Got: Oxford United & The Maxwells, 5th November 1991 | Twohundredpercent

twohundredpercent.net twohundredpercent.net
 
unification said:
Not being around when all the Maxwell business began and something I've been unable to find online, who did Maxwell buy Oxford United from? I know he cleared the debts that were big to the club but small fry to him. Seemingly our owners and chairmen have been well established and publicly known to the fanbase since Bobby Maxwell became chairman, but who was behind the scenes at Oxford in the '70s and '80s?
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Tony Rosser/Free Newspapers were heavily involved throughout the 70's and Bill Reeves had control before Maxwell but I don't know if there was any transition periods. Rosser's reign was cited as being the catalyst for our financial troubles from mid-70's onwards.
 
living local and using the supporters club most nights, I got to see plans and a model of a new reveloped Manor ground that Tony Rosser planned and they looked great and exciting, shame it never happened!
 
LeftSideBoy said:
100% - He was, without a doubt, a Mossad agent. He had fulfilled his uses for them and as with many intelligence assets, he was silenced.
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As fun as that theory is, I think the truth is rather more boring.

Maxwell was 68 years old, top heavy, 22 stone, not a strong swimmer, an insomniac who often woke in the night and preferred to urinate off the back of the yacht. The railing at the back was under waist height so even a slight swell could have knocked him. The second autopsy of his body showed tendon damage in his shoulder suggesting he may have tried to hold onto something before falling into the sea. Throw into the mix that he’d had a massive row with son Kevin the previous evening over a meeting with the Bank of England and he was a man who was probably not in the greatest frame of mind.

I don’t doubt that Maxwell had many more skeletons in his closet - it’s how he operated in business with his public and private businesses not knowing much about the other - and who knows whether he had anything to do with Mossad. However, the story that Mossad bumped him off is a bit too fanciful for me - glamorous and ripe for a movie plot but a bit too far fetched to be the truth.
 
unification said:
As fun as that theory is, I think the truth is rather more boring.

Maxwell was 68 years old, top heavy, 22 stone, not a strong swimmer, an insomniac who often woke in the night and preferred to urinate off the back of the yacht. The railing at the back was under waist height so even a slight swell could have knocked him. The second autopsy of his body showed tendon damage in his shoulder suggesting he may have tried to hold onto something before falling into the sea. Throw into the mix that he’d had a massive row with son Kevin the previous evening over a meeting with the Bank of England and he was a man who was probably not in the greatest frame of mind.

I don’t doubt that Maxwell had many more skeletons in his closet - it’s how he operated in business with his public and private businesses not knowing much about the other - and who knows whether he had anything to do with Mossad. However, the story that Mossad bumped him off is a bit too fanciful for me - glamorous and ripe for a movie plot but a bit too far fetched to be the truth.
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Considering Ghislaine is well known to be an Israeli intelligence asset, it’s not too fanciful at all. How would Ghislaine, an aristocrat, become so heavily involved with the Israeli secret service? Because it runs in the family. Robert, at his peak, controlled the western tabloid media in its entirety. That doesn’t happen by accident. It also served as a propaganda arm for the Israeli government. The whole Epstein operation was started by Israel, in order to blackmail key public and political figures. Epstein and Maxwell sold information on Prince Andrew to Mossad and often referred to doing so as their ‘super bowl moment’. Ghislaine was Epstein’s handler so if he was an intelligence informant, it’s safe to assume the same applied to her Ghislaine and her father. This is well documented.

 
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unification said:
As fun as that theory is, I think the truth is rather more boring.

Maxwell was 68 years old, top heavy, 22 stone, not a strong swimmer, an insomniac who often woke in the night and preferred to urinate off the back of the yacht. The railing at the back was under waist height so even a slight swell could have knocked him. The second autopsy of his body showed tendon damage in his shoulder suggesting he may have tried to hold onto something before falling into the sea. Throw into the mix that he’d had a massive row with son Kevin the previous evening over a meeting with the Bank of England and he was a man who was probably not in the greatest frame of mind.

I don’t doubt that Maxwell had many more skeletons in his closet - it’s how he operated in business with his public and private businesses not knowing much about the other - and who knows whether he had anything to do with Mossad. However, the story that Mossad bumped him off is a bit too fanciful for me - glamorous and ripe for a movie plot but a bit too far fetched to be the truth.
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I mentioned this in another thread, but I've also read the book and I think the author, although leaving his conclusions open, is probably in agreement with you. There was a very poor autopsy carried out in Spain and the Israeli's did another before his burial and their most notable find was the shoulder damage.

There is also a certain amount of conjecture regarding the boat death in the middle of the sea - there were plenty of chances to do it elsewhere and the Israeli's did give him a state funeral (which isn't to say they weren't involved). Whilst probably not a full-on spy, he undoubtedly passed on information but the book also questions how much use that would have been - overestimating his own importance was a Maxwell trait!!

There are two brief mentions of OUFC in the book - but only in the context of 'he owned a football club'.

I think it's a good read and Preston a decent writer - he also wrote the Jeremy Thorpe book 'A Very British Scandal' and 'The Dig', recently dramatised by Netflix. Whilst delves into the intricacies of his past and his murky and criminal business dealings, he also gives credit for his part in the development of scientific book publishing in the UK .
 
LeftSideBoy said:
Considering Ghislaine is well known to be an Israeli intelligence asset, it’s not too fanciful at all. How would Ghislaine, an aristocrat, become so heavily involved with the Israeli secret service? Because it runs in the family. Robert, at his peak, controlled the western tabloid media in its entirety. That doesn’t happen by accident. It also served as a propaganda arm for the Israeli government. The whole Epstein operation was started by Israel, in order to blackmail key public and political figures. Epstein and Maxwell sold information on Prince Andrew to Mossad and often referred to doing so as their ‘super bowl moment’. Ghislaine was Epstein’s handler so if he was an intelligence informant, it’s safe to assume the same applied to her Ghislaine and her father. This is well documented.

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If by well-documented, you mean that this bloke being interviewed. When he’s asked for evidence he says “at this moment all I can say is that’s how it is”.
 
LeftSideBoy said:
Considering Ghislaine is well known to be an Israeli intelligence asset, it’s not too fanciful at all. How would Ghislaine, an aristocrat, become so heavily involved with the Israeli secret service? Because it runs in the family. Robert, at his peak, controlled the western tabloid media in its entirety. That doesn’t happen by accident. It also served as a propaganda arm for the Israeli government. The whole Epstein operation was started by Israel, in order to blackmail key public and political figures. Epstein and Maxwell sold information on Prince Andrew to Mossad and often referred to doing so as their ‘super bowl moment’. Ghislaine was Epstein’s handler so if he was an intelligence informant, it’s safe to assume the same applied to her Ghislaine and her father. This is well documented.

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This is great.

Ghislaine an 'aristocrat'? She is the daughter of Czech man born into abject poverty and whose family died at the hands of the Nazis. A self-made man maybe, but definitely not an 'aristocrat'.

'Controlled the western tabloid media in its entirety' - come on, he controlled the Mirror and People (what about the Sun, Mail, Star, Express, News Of The World and that's just here!). Unlike, Murdoch, who beat him to the punch on a number of media assets', he didn't control much outside of the UK and bought a failing regional US tabloid just before his death.

'This is well documented' - really, with full disclosure and actual evidence, or just more online conjecture?
 
LeftSideBoy said:
No, that was just one example. I’m not sure what would motivate an Israeli spy to come out and lie about something like that? What would he gain from doing so?
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Some exposure, a sense of self-importance and so on. All heresay and no actual evidence.

Good that the story came from a state owned Soviet media network best known for its disinformation campaigns and outright lies justifying the actions of the Russian government.
 
LeftSideBoy said:
Considering Ghislaine is well known to be an Israeli intelligence asset, it’s not too fanciful at all. How would Ghislaine, an aristocrat, become so heavily involved with the Israeli secret service? Because it runs in the family. Robert, at his peak, controlled the western tabloid media in its entirety. That doesn’t happen by accident. It also served as a propaganda arm for the Israeli government. The whole Epstein operation was started by Israel, in order to blackmail key public and political figures. Epstein and Maxwell sold information on Prince Andrew to Mossad and often referred to doing so as their ‘super bowl moment’. Ghislaine was Epstein’s handler so if he was an intelligence informant, it’s safe to assume the same applied to her Ghislaine and her father. This is well documented.

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Them pesky Jews eh?
 
LeftSideBoy said:
Considering Ghislaine is well known to be an Israeli intelligence asset, it’s not too fanciful at all. How would Ghislaine, an aristocrat, become so heavily involved with the Israeli secret service? Because it runs in the family. Robert, at his peak, controlled the western tabloid media in its entirety. That doesn’t happen by accident. It also served as a propaganda arm for the Israeli government. The whole Epstein operation was started by Israel, in order to blackmail key public and political figures. Epstein and Maxwell sold information on Prince Andrew to Mossad and often referred to doing so as their ‘super bowl moment’. Ghislaine was Epstein’s handler so if he was an intelligence informant, it’s safe to assume the same applied to her Ghislaine and her father. This is well documented.
Click to expand...

On bolded items:

1. If she's an aristocrat I'm a turnip. The daughter of a fantasist parvenu.

2. I hope Rupert Murdoch doesn't hear about this.

3. Started by Israel, as in "let's start a grup of peadophiles"? I doubt Prince Andrew would much of a target, a known ponce with no influence over any government.

That said, I'd be surprised if both of them weren't low-level Mossad informants, being in Oxford and moving in minor cricles of celebrity and influence.
 
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