National News End Child Food Poverty

I completely agree with you. I understand this is how it works. This is why the biggest mistake anybody made pre-Brexit was to be snobby and call people stupid rather than try to engage with them on anything approaching a respectful level, because it radicalised them. I told many of the people I worked with at the time (London bubble and all that) that they were the main problem. I was in Lille with a few of them from the day before until 2/3 days after the referendum, for the Euros, and vividly remember sitting in the main square listening to them moaning like idiots while telling them in no uncertain terms that their attitude and the way they conducted themselves was a big part of what went wrong. It’s no secret where I stand but if you’re respectful I will return the favour. I can have a civilised conversation with virtually anybody if they’re willing to drop the insults - throw a jab and I’ll happily throw one back. I’ll be angry and ratty at what’s going on, and towards the people who run things, but I try not to get into fisticuffs with Joe Bloggs unless they decide to whack me in the plumbs. Ultimately, why would anybody want to be on ‘your team’ if you treat them with disdain and spit on them from the off? Some people can’t and won’t be ‘changed’, but you guarantee they won’t be if you go charging in with a right hook as a first course of action. So-called populists know that - they thrive in frying pans. They’re people who endlessly campaign even when they get in, because they don’t have the ability to actually govern. They need the bitterness to keep people split into teams, because otherwise it doesn’t work. Angry people get them what they want without them having to give them anything of substance in return, besides a feeling of ‘winning’ and ‘beating people’. It’s so simple, yet so effective. For now. These things come in waves, and it doesn’t tend to last long because the angry people who burn things down generally don’t have any idea of how to build anything back up again. It’s like a riot that runs its course and then disperses - there are many more days in history without riots than there are those with them.

I’m disappointed that you say you find it funny to see other people upset, and that you laugh at their distress, but only because you couldn’t feel that way unless you’d had a hell of a time of it at one point or another. Not being remotely condescending in saying that - I don’t enjoy the thought of anybody having such a tough time at any point in their life that it makes them feel that other people being upset is somehow soothing or enjoyable. I haven’t had what I would call a particularly enjoyable life in many ways, certainly in years gone by, but my approach is that I know what it’s like to feel like you’ve been left without a single card in your hand, and so I don’t want anyone else to feel that way. Doesn’t make me right or ‘better’ for it, though, just different. Maybe if more understood that we wouldn’t all be so angry at each other. We would probably have a much better world for it.

Feel free to pop round for a doob some time. Feel free to bring the doob with you, too.

Most articulate.
Take a look to New Zealand where a more unified approach, albeit in a more nuanced way, ends up delivering a far better experience for everyone.
They are both liberal AND firm when needs be.
Could the same approach be applied in the UK or is the middle ground only obtained by appealing to those "nasty" unconscious biases?

Don`t know...... but extremism on either side is generally nasty and vindictive.

Can`t bring doob..... not allowed out! lol
 

From your own handy link........
"There is uncertainty in government funding for 2021/22 and beyond due to awaiting the announcement of a full Spending Review in 2020. In addition, announcements are anticipated with regards to the introduction of a new Fairer Funding Formula and the implementation of 75% Business Rates Retention. These are expected to be introduced from 2022/23. This level of uncertainty is unusual; however, in forming the MTFS prudent assumptions will be made based on the latest information available and using scenarios and a sensitivity analysis to form a view."

Ergo: Nobody is particularly sure what the future holds, like during a global pandemic. However we can use a best guess..... same as all of us.
If the Government turn round and run off some more money all will be fine...
 
Nick Rushton (Tory council leader in Leicestershire) funds FSM.

In the article he says "We have no money"..... but they found it.
The wheels will turn and more money will come from central Government...


The pressure now ramps up on the Labour City council to do the same...........

Its the political game separated by a mile or two.
 
do you really believe they go hungry???....ok there maybe kids of addicts, wasters etc but i'd say 99.9% dont really need FSM in the holidays.
 
From the same article:
“The latest round of funding also didn’t see rural counties like Leicestershire fare well.

“We have to work with what we have but there was no question on this, we will find the funding, we simply have to.”

So...no extra money coming in from the government to fund this, and assuming they don't have £500k down the back of the sofa, what other vital service that they already struggle to provide will they have to cut to make the space for this unprecidented situation?

Local elections come before national ones (next year isn't it?) Local Authorities who aren't seen to be doing anything (or seen to be siding with the Government) will not fair well. Pretty sure govt would be giving out more sweeteners (like making sure kids don't starve) if they were up for re-election any time soon.
 
do you really believe they go hungry???....ok there maybe kids of addicts, wasters etc but i'd say 99.9% dont really need FSM in the holidays.

I'm trying to imagine what it does to you to go through the world as you do. in order to justify depriving children of food you have to convince yourself that everyone that tells you they need it is lying

this chap remembers

 
From the same article:
“The latest round of funding also didn’t see rural counties like Leicestershire fare well.

“We have to work with what we have but there was no question on this, we will find the funding, we simply have to.”

So...no extra money coming in from the government to fund this, and assuming they don't have £500k down the back of the sofa, what other vital service that they already struggle to provide will they have to cut to make the space for this unprecidented situation?

Local elections come before national ones (next year isn't it?) Local Authorities who aren't seen to be doing anything (or seen to be siding with the Government) will not fair well. Pretty sure govt would be giving out more sweeteners (like making sure kids don't starve) if they were up for re-election any time soon.

There will be extra money, you know it I know it. It won`t make headlines, deals will be done. Its politics.
LCC have a rather large sofa and tradition dictates the Shire is Blue and the City is Red.
 
There will be extra money, you know it I know it. It won`t make headlines, deals will be done. Its politics.
LCC have a rather large sofa and tradition dictates the Shire is Blue and the City is Red.
"Deals will be done....it's politics" and this government....who can't ever be seen to be wrong or admit when they are will do what they can to keep it from the public's view. Dirty tawdry opaque back-handed, conniving. What a shame your expected standards in public life are so low you are happy to settle for that.

These are the very same people who say we can;t find the extra money....we need to make sure people are accountable for how public money is spent and it is our duty we ensure it ends up in the right place....rather than up the nose/in the veins of a drug whore, I guess. The same people who line the pockets of the likes of serco with out blinking an eye.

But it's OK...everyone is at it, so that makes it fine.....like I say, what a real shame!
 
There are many Councils.... quoting 1 doesn`t make it "true".
Why when people give an example of something that completely destroys your position do you shout 'it's only one case'. You do it all the time. Open your eyes!

The essence of the problem is a substantial reduction in government funding which is affecting all councils.

Just have a look at what the stupid Tories at Spelthorne have done to try and make up for lost government funding.

Tory Cherwell, Tory Spelthorne, Tory Northamptonshire! There are many examples and they're not all Tory.
 
Essexyellows your silence is deafening.

Why when people give an example of something that completely destroys your position do you shout 'it's only one case'. You do it all the time. Open your eyes!

The essence of the problem is a substantial reduction in government funding which is affecting all councils.

Just have a look at what the stupid Tories at Spelthorne have done to try and make up for lost government funding.

Tory Cherwell, Tory Spelthorne, Tory Northamptonshire! There are many examples and they're not all Tory.
 

I was in bed.

You can share as many polarised tweets as you like.

FSM are not the panacea to the problem.

They are a plaster on a wound that needs stitching.

So lets surmise the Government U-Turn on this until Easter 2021, much to the joy of the twitterati , the pandemic and its consequences will still be with us then.

So what then? The people with deep rooted problems will be at the bottom of a bigger pile of people needing support through redundancy, furlough ending etc etc.

Do you stitch their wound now or leave them with a box of plasters?

If there is a U Turn to be done it needs to be both big and effective.

Follow the Swedish model of meals for all, or offer the FSM straight through on the current qualification parameters.
 
I was in bed.

You can share as many polarised tweets as you like.

FSM are not the panacea to the problem.

They are a plaster on a wound that needs stitching.

So lets surmise the Government U-Turn on this until Easter 2021, much to the joy of the twitterati , the pandemic and its consequences will still be with us then.

So what then? The people with deep rooted problems will be at the bottom of a bigger pile of people needing support through redundancy, furlough ending etc etc.

Do you stitch their wound now or leave them with a box of plasters?

If there is a U Turn to be done it needs to be both big and effective.

Follow the Swedish model of meals for all, or offer the FSM straight through on the current qualification parameters.
You are your 'look over there ism'!

As you well know I was commenting on your statement that councils 'still have plenty of money to spend, they just have to work to source it and justify why they need it.'

Explain why if this is the case Tory Spelthorne borrowed nearly £1 billion (possibly illegally but certainly pushing the boundaries of its legislative power) to buy properties to try and make profit to make up for the loss of government funding.

Two massive gambles to address something that doesn't exist?
 
You are your 'look over there ism'!

As you well know I was commenting on your statement that councils 'still have plenty of money to spend, they just have to work to source it and justify why they need it.'

Explain why if this is the case Tory Spelthorne borrowed nearly £1 billion (possibly illegally but certainly pushing the boundaries of its legislative power) to buy properties to try and make profit to make up for the loss of government funding.

Two massive gambles to address something that doesn't exist?

Some councils are well run, others are not.

Same as any other businesses.

Yep, its that simple.

As for buying property.........well the value can go up as well as down, think most people know that as a "risk".

However you quoted Spelthorne so lets take a look.........

"Spelthorne Borough Council, in Surrey, has built up its portfolio since 2016 funded entirely from government loans.
Councillor Ian Harvey, the former council leader behind the spending, said: "It was the right thing to do."
The council voted last week for more councillors to be involved in any large future investments.
Spelthorne Borough Council's acquisitions include a BP research centre and BP headquarters for £385 million; three office blocks bought for £285 million; and a development in Hammersmith costing £170 million."

I wouldn`t mind betting that their ROI is helping their budget nicely.........
 
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Some councils are well run, others are not.

Same as any other businesses.

Yep, its that simple.

As for buying property.........well the value can go up as well as down, think most people know that as a "risk".

However you quoted Spelthorne so lets take a look.........

"Spelthorne Borough Council, in Surrey, has built up its portfolio since 2016 funded entirely from government loans.
Councillor Ian Harvey, the former council leader behind the spending, said: "It was the right thing to do."
The council voted last week for more councillors to be involved in any large future investments.
Spelthorne Borough Council's acquisitions include a BP research centre and BP headquarters for £385 million; three office blocks bought for £285 million; and a development in Hammersmith costing £170 million."

I wouldn`t mind betting that their ROI is helping their budget nicely.........
Yes but Why did they do it FFS?
 
Yes but Why did they do it FFS?

They could receive loans from HMG to do with as they please, in this case buy property.
On the other side of the see saw their direct grant from HMG was reduced.
If the outcome is, and the reports are not detailed enough to know, that they have created a larger pot then what is wrong?


Getting back to food poverty.....
The solution requires long term thinking, which is the crux of the issue in a nutshell.
Invest in teaching kids to cook and eat properly & on a budget.
However, if you teach a 12 year old to do it now, you will see the benefit in 5/10/15 years time when they are running their own household, but you wont be in power any more. It`ll be the next government that take all the credit for the falling malnutrition & poverty etc.

Its a lot easier to look like your helping desperate people now and chuck a bit of cash at them for some cheap political points.
 
They could receive loans from HMG to do with as they please, in this case buy property.
On the other side of the see saw their direct grant from HMG was reduced.
If the outcome is, and the reports are not detailed enough to know, that they have created a larger pot then what is wrong?
From what I've read councils can borrow to finance capital expenditure to buy or build assets to allow them to deliver their statutory duties. The rules specifically stop them from borrowing to invest on to try and make a turn on the deal. These assets are not to assist in delivering services and so their auditors are calling foul. Seems like they may have taken legal advise from people who gave them the answer they wanted. Could be a problem around the corner.

But anyway, back to the your incorrect assertion, council funding has be significantly reduced over the past decade and many don't have spare cash as you have claimed.
 
I'm trying to imagine what it does to you to go through the world as you do. in order to justify depriving children of food you have to convince yourself that everyone that tells you they need it is lying

this chap remembers

OH perleeeeeeease you cannot be comparing what happens now to what happened 50/60 years ago.....if so you are a fool who believes everything he reads in the daily fail,i myself was in receipt of free school meals 50 years ago and we didnt go hungry in the school holidays......you'll believe anything ha ha ha ha
 
From what I've read councils can borrow to finance capital expenditure to buy or build assets to allow them to deliver their statutory duties. The rules specifically stop them from borrowing to invest on to try and make a turn on the deal. These assets are not to assist in delivering services and so their auditors are calling foul. Seems like they may have taken legal advise from people who gave them the answer they wanted. Could be a problem around the corner.

But anyway, back to the your incorrect assertion, council funding has be significantly reduced over the past decade and many don't have spare cash as you have claimed.

What I said was Council`s will "find" the money as our County council have.
They will then get the money from the Government.
The County (Tory) doing what they have has put pressure on the City (Lab) to do the same.
It`s politics, its reality...it happens.

I never said it was either right or the same everywhere, sorry if realism isn`t something you can cope with.
 
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