National News Brexit - the Deal or No Deal poll

Brexit - Deal or No Deal?

  • Deal

    Votes: 51 29.1%
  • No Deal

    Votes: 77 44.0%
  • Call in the Donald

    Votes: 2 1.1%
  • Call in Noel Edmonds

    Votes: 8 4.6%
  • I don't care anymore

    Votes: 37 21.1%

  • Total voters
    175
The sad part is that the majority of us (irrespective of what MP`s say/think) are neither extreme right or extreme left.
Both main parties have been trying to grab more of the middle ground by subtle changes in policy & appearance.
The outcome of that is there was little difference, despite what many of us voters think, between them, New Labour, Blair et al were just "Tory Lite".
Labour have now lurched left with Comrade Corbyn who is doing his best to dodge the job he should be doing.
Conservatives have neglected their core and are paying the price with a weakened position.
Credit where its due TM is getting on with it as best she can.
It would be nice to see our elected representatives working for the good of all the nation, respecting the result, and getting on with it.

I can't give credit to May as from early on she set her stall out with the stupid public red lines speech and seemed to go out of her way to try to alienate/sideline Parliament. She has never stopped trying to sideline Parliament as her brinkmanship over timing of votes/debates has further demonstrated.

Also triggering A50 with no plan or idea/research done was mindbogglingly stupid. Especially as she then called an general election (which surprised even her own party) and blew a majority making her reliant on the DUP whilst wasting more time. The DUP's policy on Brexit is utterly laughable in demanding the impossible.

And then after using most of the A50 negotiating time up, she finally comes up with a plan that nobody likes. Cancelling the vote on this and procrastinating over it wasting more time, just demonstrated that it was actually all about her personally (on a par with Boris).

If she'd worked with Parliament early on then I reckon we may have got a consensus long ago. How it would have looked we won't know but at least we would now be making proper preparations for March 29th and ironically I reckon we would have been in a stronger negotiating with the EU.
 
Hindsight is a wonderous thing.
I doubt TM called the GE off the top of her head, she would have been advised (badly!).
The biggest issue was not going to the EU and starting on stronger terms which was crippled by the GE!
Lets be honest nobody else wants the job its the ultimate "damned either way" and see who is waiting to knife you when you emerge from the smoke of the fire!
 
Hindsight is a wonderous thing.
I doubt TM called the GE off the top of her head, she would have been advised (badly!).
The biggest issue was not going to the EU and starting on stronger terms which was crippled by the GE!
Lets be honest nobody else wants the job its the ultimate "damned either way" and see who is waiting to knife you when you emerge from the smoke of the fire!

My biggest bugbear with May was her intransigence regarding Parliament and her repeated attempts to sideline/alienate Parliament. She seems to believe it is all about her. That a member of the public had to go to court to force parliamentary sovereignty says it all.

The other was triggering A50 without a plan in place. The old saying "fail to prepare then prepare to fail" springs to mind.

Neither are in hindsight as they were discussed amply at the time and criticised.
 
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...ster-mps-abuse-soubry-far-right-a8724491.html

So one of the 'Yellow Vests' involved in the Anna Soubry incident has been arrested.

The unoriginal UK 'Yellow Vests', who can't even get their own legitimacy and have to try to appropriate some from another country (that has nothing to do with their cause) are currently having a demonstration in London. Not huge numbers should we say:


So Chris Grayling, the project fear rubbish about the rise of the far right and the end of 'moderate' politics if the Maybot's plan isn't voted through looks a bit stupid. The tut-tutting will go up a few decibels if Brexit is stopped apart from a few nutters (relative in number).

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46847169

2 points on Grayling's lazy claim, his own claim about the rise of far right (ironically) and the Brexit campaigns (either side) using fear as the main campaigning tool pretty much demonstrate that the era of moderate politics is over. The vitriol that plagues politics currently operates under confirms this.

Also as read elsewhere, has Grayling never studied how badly appeasement worked in the past?!

Edit 1: YouTube link.
Edit 2: Article on Grayling's comments
 
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As we've already lost as we're behind at Fleetwood, an update on the "unoriginals UK Yellow Vest" march:


If the source is accurate then about 200 turned up. The list of demands is fantastic, its almost like they've got together, asked people for suggestions in a brainstorming session and written down everything suggested, however random. The corruption ones are particularly good.
 
As we've already lost as we're behind at Fleetwood, an update on the "unoriginals UK Yellow Vest" march:


If the source is accurate then about 200 turned up. The list of demands is fantastic, its almost like they've got together, asked people for suggestions in a brainstorming session and written down everything suggested, however random. The corruption ones are particularly good.

Not a good start.... :):)
I spend a fair bit of time in France & have a fair few friends over there, the "Yellow Vests" over there are what would be called the "squeezed middle class" over here. Those folk who work, contribute to society yet have little left at the end of the month.
There are lots of them both in France & over here, people who abide by the rules of society yet perceive that society (the system) takes more & more away from their quality of life and gives it to "somebody else".................................... sounds a bit like the EU really.
Those people will reach a breaking point, we are lucky in that the UK had a referendum which gave those people the chance to cause a seismic shock to "the system".
Of course the system bites back, in France its tear gas & riot police....over here its an intransigent parliament that are doing their best to either defer or cancel leaving.
I have no time for extremists of any type left, right, religious or otherwise and adopting somebody else`s "cause/image" is nothing short of pathetic.
 
Not a good start.... :):)
I spend a fair bit of time in France & have a fair few friends over there, the "Yellow Vests" over there are what would be called the "squeezed middle class" over here. Those folk who work, contribute to society yet have little left at the end of the month.
There are lots of them both in France & over here, people who abide by the rules of society yet perceive that society (the system) takes more & more away from their quality of life and gives it to "somebody else".................................... sounds a bit like the EU really.
Those people will reach a breaking point, we are lucky in that the UK had a referendum which gave those people the chance to cause a seismic shock to "the system".
Of course the system bites back, in France its tear gas & riot police....over here its an intransigent parliament that are doing their best to either defer or cancel leaving.
I have no time for extremists of any type left, right, religious or otherwise and adopting somebody else`s "cause/image" is nothing short of pathetic.

Happily I got the result wrong. :)
 
Of course parliament will claim that they are acting in our best interests, with their obvious intransigence.
Now Theresa May has said brexit might not happen if MPs vote against her ‘deal’, this from a position that we will leave the EU on 29th March. Coincidentally my passport runs out the same day.
I think we are being softened up for yet another referendum, accept the deal offered, leave without one, or stay in.
Theresa May looks to be on a loser now. A no confidence vote may well follow maybe with a delay to brexit.
Jeremy Corbyn doesn’t know what he wants to do...he says let’s wait and see whether there is an election then we can present our position to the public. He has gone on record as saying the EU are willing to compromise and are known for it...to me it seems if we cave in we have made an agreement.
At a time when we require leadership it is lacking, the uncertainty continues.....
 
Of course parliament will claim that they are acting in our best interests, with their obvious intransigence.
Now Theresa May has said brexit might not happen if MPs vote against her ‘deal’, this from a position that we will leave the EU on 29th March. Coincidentally my passport runs out the same day.
I think we are being softened up for yet another referendum, accept the deal offered, leave without one, or stay in.
Theresa May looks to be on a loser now. A no confidence vote may well follow maybe with a delay to brexit.
Jeremy Corbyn doesn’t know what he wants to do...he says let’s wait and see whether there is an election then we can present our position to the public. He has gone on record as saying the EU are willing to compromise and are known for it...to me it seems if we cave in we have made an agreement.
At a time when we require leadership it is lacking, the uncertainty continues.....

No doubt the leaderships of the Maybot and Jezza are awful.

Hopefully some leadership emerges from the back benches and a parliamentary concensus forms whichever way it goes so we can avoid a cliff edge Brexit and the mayhem that will ensue.
 
Am I the only one who that for a while has believed we will end up staying in the EU?

Mays "deal" only strengthens my belief. She has managed to "negotiate" a deal that will appeal to just about no one so it wont go through parliament.

May resigns or calls another election, next PM decides its all too difficult to get a deal and we have another vote. The political elite get their way by f*****g up the whole leave process and its as you were.
Hmmm

http://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/brexi...-if-mps-reject-her-plan/ar-BBSdkTa?ocid=ientp
 
May being demonstrated as a liar about referendums here:


On that basis, as May and all those Brexiteers wanted another referendum and still voted against a Welsh Parliament after a close result, therefore apparently lacking a democratic mandate, they should be backing another referendum.

The economic argument is fantastic hypocrisy as well considering the cost of Brexit so far, nevermind taking into account future situations.
 
We will not "forgo trade with EU Countries" because business & £££`s will not allow it to happen.
We may get a period of adjustment but that is all, remember we are adopting all EU Regs & Statutes into UK law until they are reviewed or untangled so there is little reason that trade with the EU will not continue.
Its an adjustment to a relationship not the apocalypse many remainers are forecasting.

You still haven't read this, have you? "No deal" is economically disastrous, no matter how hard you believe the lies the Leave leaders tell you, and you cross your fingers and hope for the best. The "BMW & prosecco" argument died years ago.

How long is this "period of adjustment", and what's your evidence that it will be insignificant?
 
May being demonstrated as a liar about referendums here:


On that basis, as May and all those Brexiteers wanted another referendum and still voted against a Welsh Parliament after a close result, therefore apparently lacking a democratic mandate, they should be backing another referendum.

The economic argument is fantastic hypocrisy as well considering the cost of Brexit so far, nevermind taking into account future situations.

An interesting follow up to the Welsh Assembly hypocrisy of the Maybot:


How as the result was close, those involved in setting up the Assembly got "losers consent" by involving in the process and building the structures to get consensus.

Whilst the end result is less complicated than Brexit, it is in stark contrast to the Maybot's approach which has been to try to sideline Parliament and those with different views. She has made no attempt to find consensus in Parliament other than try to use fear to get support for her deal.
 
You still haven't read this, have you? "No deal" is economically disastrous, no matter how hard you believe the lies the Leave leaders tell you, and you cross your fingers and hope for the best. The "BMW & prosecco" argument died years ago.

How long is this "period of adjustment", and what's your evidence that it will be insignificant?
Remoaner talking bollox as usual
 
What about this madcap scenario? : Rather than let her bill fail, she makes a speech which says that her government has decided to remain, in the interests of the country etc. Public uproar but less than 50%? :). Corbyn calls a GE but then what? Tories are remain and what can Corbyn do? If he switches to remain too (which he would likely have to do) he is no better a hypocrite than May but if he says he will respect the public vote (unlike May blah bah blah) and is committed to Brexit it will become a GE which he fights on an "integrity" level but is effectively a referendum /second vote. May will have to go of course but the Tories remain in power if she plays the hand this way. Interesting slogans on buses and a voting public confused as f**k! Sometimes you have to bluff with a 2-7 to get the Aces to fold. Very handy timing for Alex Salmond too...
 
The ironic thing is both parties had leaving the EU in their manifestos at the last election, who turn took 80% of the vote. If that's not another implied mandate...

As for the vote today, expect a big defeat for the Maybot. The next part is where it could get interesting. Talk is the EU have some compromises they are willing to give on the backstop (after needlessly inflicting pain on Maybot) which will form part of the next vote. Equally, some Conservatives will change their vote (from both sides of the line on the EU), so there is a lot to happen that is not staying in the EU.

As usual, the Labour party position is as unclear as it was a year ago.
 
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