National News Brexit - the Deal or No Deal poll

Brexit - Deal or No Deal?

  • Deal

    Votes: 50 30.1%
  • No Deal

    Votes: 74 44.6%
  • Call in the Donald

    Votes: 3 1.8%
  • Call in Noel Edmonds

    Votes: 6 3.6%
  • I don't care anymore

    Votes: 33 19.9%

  • Total voters
    166

Pete Burrett

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Quite an impressive bit of foot stamping by Johnson there, oh and it is him and Brexit that is threatening the Irish peace process.
You really can't blame the EU for wanting a VERY hard border between itself and the soon-to-be Third World UK. How long before our citizens decide to move in their millions across the border in search of food and medicine? Makes sense for the EU to want a wall. Got to keep those desperate foreigners out.
 

Gary Baldi

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You haven’t actually answered the question with clarity. But you didn’t say that we can’t let food and medicine shortages happen, so that suggests to me that you’re saying if they’re a byproduct of leaving on October 31, you’re willing to take them as part of the terms. Are you willing to accept a lack of food and essential medical supplies - the latter of which could cost even one single life - out of some sort of principle? Because that to me would be alarming. As I’ve said several times already, it does not matter how we got here, why or how it’s all happened, any responsible politician who hears the words “a shortage of food and medicines” MUST sit there and want to avoid this. As should any reasonable person of any status observing from the outside, surely?

It’s easy to rant and rave, become aggressive, start calling people names etc, but I hope we’re all collectively going to start to move past that, regardless of what side of the fence we’re on. It’s damn exhausting if nothing else, so believe me when I say that I am not looking to have a row, start throwing punches or anything else. I just can’t understand how anybody would willingly accept a situation that causes such enormous problems as a lack of medical supplies. I’m aware we’re supposed to have gone already, I’m aware Boris has come along and boxed himself in already by saying we’re out no matter what, I’m aware that everything has been handled badly before now in terms of planning and negotiations - I know all of these things. But I can’t accept that something as severe as all this stuff about genuine shortages doesn’t change the game. Our basic sense of human decency and morality should mean that our priority, and our basic instinct, is to preserve the good health and life of our fellow citizens.

I’m really struggling to get my head around how in these circumstances we can just shrug and go, “Look, it’s too late, we’re going and it doesn’t matter what comes up.” We wouldn’t live our lives like that at home, so I don’t understand how we could live that way when it comes to the biggest political shift of our entire lifetimes.
I cannot answer the question as I am not a member of HMG or a deep specialist in international trade, nor privy to the supply chains of private/public companies, and then various mitigation plans in place. If that doesn't meet with your agreement, so be it.

It is incredibly exhausting. People like me tried to bridge the gap after the referendum, and we've been told we're racist, thick, etc. So I am done being looking to bridge the gap and just want Brexit - I am not moving on it. I can't be the only person who voted to leave who is fed up of being abused for voting that way and is past caring about Remainers feelings or wants.

We live in a democracy, and as such, if we still want to live in a credible democracy rather than a liberal theocracy, we cannot allow the "losing" side to subvert and diminish a vote cause it's hard, etc It's a recurring theme in UK and US politics now.

The screeching about wasting money on No Deal planning in 2017 and 2018 is looking foolhardy now isn't it? I wasn't the only one who has suggested we started it on day one after Article 50 because it was the most prudent thing to do - but then we've been derided as being poor negotiators! We had to do it, we didn't and now everyone is is panicking. Perhaps if we had collectively got on with Brexit, rather than Remainers trying to stop it, we would not be stuck where we are.
 

Gary Baldi

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How do you reach a compromise on the Irish Border problem? The Republicans will not accept a border across Ireland, the Loyalists will not accept a border in the Irish sea. How do you reach a compromise on this?
How do you think a compromise can be reached?
 

Pete Burrett

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When members of the government talk about bumps in the road, it's important to understand that they mean people will die.
To be exact, they mean 'people will die because the EU refuse to bow down to our demands. Not this government's fault. Don't they realise who we are?'
 

tonyw

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6 Dec 2017
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I know that Boris Johnson is not stupid - so I assume his comments today about Britain promising not to put up infrastructure on the Irish border are purely for the benefit of his supporters, and to help him pin as much of the blame as possible on the EU when the UK economy craters in two months' time.

Because the alternative is that he has missed the point completely.
The EU is not about to allow an open border anywhere with a country that has a different regulatory framework. And of course post-Brexit Britain is going to develop a different regulatory framework.
What does he think would happen if tomorrow Finland just decided it was going to open the border with Russia? Or Bulgaria with Turkey? That would be cool, right, because the EU aren't interested in maintaining the integrity of the single market? :rolleyes:
 

Whingit

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14 Dec 2017
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It's amazing that somebody as thick as pig s**t could once get teams playing such good football.
 

Eaststandboy

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Let's see what happens when Boris and Angela meet up. Can see it being a painfully dull experience for both sides.

Interestingly, this crept out today. A hard one for Merkel to mitigate with No Deal on the cards.
 

Yellow hert

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7 Dec 2017
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60
I voted to remain and still believe our EU deal is far superior to anything else but democracy has spoken. However maybe all those ‘no deal’ people could actual answer a few questions about the consequences of their actions without blaming the EU?

We voted to leave the EU and the free trade area known as the common market even though this was not explicit in the referendum. So why are the people who campaigned and voted for this so confused that this will mean trading borders with all EU members including the Republic of Ireland?

When we leave the EU we will also lose all the 40 free trade agreements that the EU bloc negotiated with 70 other countries. Which of those trade agreements do the brexiteers hate and can ensure that we can get better ones even though we have less leverage as a single country?

Which countries are purely reliant on the WTO terms?

How quickly can all those trade agreements be done? I know we’ve stitched up a great deal with Liechtenstein which is good for people needing dentures but other than Switzerland we will not have free trade agreements with any of the other top 10 trade partners with the UK.

If there is chaos at the borders how will we ensure the essential cargo can still reach the UK?
 

Pete Burrett

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I voted to remain and still believe our EU deal is far superior to anything else but democracy has spoken. However maybe all those ‘no deal’ people could actual answer a few questions about the consequences of their actions without blaming the EU?

We voted to leave the EU and the free trade area known as the common market even though this was not explicit in the referendum. So why are the people who campaigned and voted for this so confused that this will mean trading borders with all EU members including the Republic of Ireland?

When we leave the EU we will also lose all the 40 free trade agreements that the EU bloc negotiated with 70 other countries. Which of those trade agreements do the brexiteers hate and can ensure that we can get better ones even though we have less leverage as a single country?

Which countries are purely reliant on the WTO terms?

How quickly can all those trade agreements be done? I know we’ve stitched up a great deal with Liechtenstein which is good for people needing dentures but other than Switzerland we will not have free trade agreements with any of the other top 10 trade partners with the UK.

If there is chaos at the borders how will we ensure the essential cargo can still reach the UK?
You're asking logical questions and showing concern for the unknown we're hurtling into, like a lot of sensible people, even a fair number of those who voted Leave.

You're also asking staunch Leavers to accept the potential adverse consequences of leaving on a no deal basis. This is where the debate you're rightly trying to engender will fall down.

Government 'plans' for a no deal business are laughably inadequate. For example, a massive £9 million will be distributed to British ports to help mitigate the effects of importing and exporting in a new environment where no-one knows which problems might be encountered.

But instead of postponing the whole Brexit event until proper analysis as to its effects is complete and worthwhile plans put in place to mitigate those effects, we are advised to have faith in British ingenuity and hope that everything will be alright.

It's no way to run a country, and anyone running their own business would not contemplate taking the same risks.

Still, I'm sure internationally respected Boris will persuade Merkel to do what he wants. Have faith, people.
 

Gary Baldi

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4,376
I voted to remain and still believe our EU deal is far superior to anything else but democracy has spoken. However maybe all those ‘no deal’ people could actual answer a few questions about the consequences of their actions without blaming the EU?

We voted to leave the EU and the free trade area known as the common market even though this was not explicit in the referendum. So why are the people who campaigned and voted for this so confused that this will mean trading borders with all EU members including the Republic of Ireland?

When we leave the EU we will also lose all the 40 free trade agreements that the EU bloc negotiated with 70 other countries. Which of those trade agreements do the brexiteers hate and can ensure that we can get better ones even though we have less leverage as a single country?

Which countries are purely reliant on the WTO terms?

How quickly can all those trade agreements be done? I know we’ve stitched up a great deal with Liechtenstein which is good for people needing dentures but other than Switzerland we will not have free trade agreements with any of the other top 10 trade partners with the UK.

If there is chaos at the borders how will we ensure the essential cargo can still reach the UK?

In brief as I can't be arsed to go into this again

I don't think any Brexiteer hates a trade agreement, some trade deals have been negotiated and require sign off, 2 countries are on WTO because no one has done what the UK is looking like it will o and if the Maybot and Hammond had taken No Deal seriously, the plans for essential cargo would be further along.

Sadly, thru lack of funding and Chris Failing, that did not take place. Also, the EU prohibited us from negotiating FTAs while still a member of the EU.
 

Yellow hert

Junior Member
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7 Dec 2017
Messages
60
So Gary are you in favour of a no deal exit, May’s deal or remaining know what you now know as it stands?
 
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