#boycottpuma

StockholmOx

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Interesting Tifo video on the BDS-supported #boycottpuma movement, which has been gaining a lot of traction in recent times:


Regardless of which side of the Israel/Palestine debate one finds oneself on, I think this raises an important general question to us as fans about to what extent we want our club associating with brands or investments linked to human rights abuses and/or oppressive regimes. When Newcastle came to town I was astounded that their fans seemed broadly in favour of a Saudi-based takeover of their club, considering the extent to which clubs like Paris, Man City, Barca and Atletico have been held to ransom by oppressive regimes using football to sports-wash blatant abuses of human rights through combinations of investment and sponsorship. Don't know about anyone else, but it would make me sick to the stomach if a similar thing were to happen at our club.

Now of course all investors are using their chosen football clubs to market themselves - that's literally the point of them investing in the first place - but seeing as the FA, PL and EFL have zero interest in drawing the line between "good" and "bad" money, is it not up to us as fans to show what we want our club to be associated with? Where do we draw the line? And are we comfortable being associated with Puma?
 

Marked Ox

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Well that is an incredibly one sided view of the Israeli/Palestinian conflict completely ignoring things like Hamas vowing to destroy/not recognising Israel, random firing of missiles etc. It isn't as though both sides views/actions aren't well documented either but that video only shows one side. And claiming victory for Liverpool not picking Puma is strecthing it beyond belief as Liverpool will have picked it on the best deal for themselves.

I assume all the same people are boycotting absolutely anything to do with or from China so don't have Apple products etc considering their human rights records such as the current suppression of the Uighurs in Xinjiang or the occupation of Tibet.
 

Essexyellows

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££££££££££££££££££`s <----------------- beat`s moral`s/politic`s/religion every single time. The End.

Make as many gesture`s as you like.
 

Gary Baldi

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It also entirely depends on your point of view about a particular area of the world or regime. Worth pointing out that not everyone has the same view of the world of regimes and their legitimacy, so I'm sure brands have a tricky time managing, in theory, the vocal minorities point of view vs the majority who may not give a toss either way and are quite happy to wear Puma kit or buy it cause it's cheap or whatever. Or be bought by Saudis because in reality, they don't care either way.

BDS is a tricky subject area and one frankly, that has been hijacked by the extremists from the little I know about it.
 

StockholmOx

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Well that is an incredibly one sided view of the Israeli/Palestinian conflict completely ignoring things like Hamas vowing to destroy/not recognising Israel, random firing of missiles etc. It isn't as though both sides views/actions aren't well documented either but that video only shows one side. And claiming victory for Liverpool not picking Puma is strecthing it beyond belief as Liverpool will have picked it on the best deal for themselves.

I assume all the same people are boycotting absolutely anything to do with or from China so don't have Apple products etc considering their human rights records such as the current suppression of the Uighurs in Xinjiang or the occupation of Tibet.

Yeah I see that to an extent, but in fairness it does clearly state that "BDS claimed victory" for the Liverpool kit deal, it didn't present it as a fact. And to be honest, I don't think the journalists here were looking to give a balanced account of the entire Israel/Palestine conflict, but instead explain why the boycott Puma movement exists, who is calling for it and why they are doing so. I didn't really post this to start an Israel-Palestine debate, I just wanted to point out that one of the club's business partners has been scrutinised, rightly or wrongly, for their sponsorship of an organisation which has been perceived to support some very bad things.

As Gary Baldi points out, BDS is a very tricky subject in itself - as is judging which regime is 'good' or 'bad'. However sports-washing in general is a serious subject and is creeping more and more into football - for instance if our owner were, in the future, to start using our club to promote a certain country in the same way Man City or Atletico have done, would we as fans accept it regardless of what our perception of that regime is?
 

Marked Ox

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Yeah I see that to an extent, but in fairness it does clearly state that "BDS claimed victory" for the Liverpool kit deal, it didn't present it as a fact. And to be honest, I don't think the journalists here were looking to give a balanced account of the entire Israel/Palestine conflict, but instead explain why the boycott Puma movement exists, who is calling for it and why they are doing so. I didn't really post this to start an Israel-Palestine debate, I just wanted to point out that one of the club's business partners has been scrutinised, rightly or wrongly, for their sponsorship of an organisation which has been perceived to support some very bad things.

As Gary Baldi points out, BDS is a very tricky subject in itself - as is judging which regime is 'good' or 'bad'. However sports-washing in general is a serious subject and is creeping more and more into football - for instance if our owner were, in the future, to start using our club to promote a certain country in the same way Man City or Atletico have done, would we as fans accept it regardless of what our perception of that regime is?

Oh, I wasn't trying to start a Israel/Palestine debate either, just pointing out the obvious flaws of the video. Tbh, I bet every major sports clothing manufacturer at any one time have dealings with countries, or clubs within those countries, that have horrific human rights issues so what do clubs do, or do they have to go with which protest shouts the loudest? For me those shouting the loudest should be challenged on whether they are living by the same medicine (ie. such as the China example and boycotting Chinese products).

Club ownership to me though is a different issue to who provides the club's kit, far more personal and I'd be uncomfortable with the Saudi's owning the club for instance.
 
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